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Ikeda IT-407 tonearm geometry

I’ve read all there is to read on this subject and never got satisfaction. It inspired me to ask this question earlier.
“Cartridge alignment with non slotted headshells”. 
The main reason I have a problem with these headshells is with my Ikeda it407 (chrome) tonearm, the cartridge must be twisted quite a bit in towards centre.  I have a vintage audio technica headshell with fixed holes and I don't even need a protractor to see that it won’t work. I don’t think stevenson alignment is this bad? I don't have a protractor with stevenson. My pivot to spindle distance is set perfect using my smartractor. I’m quite sure it is not possible to use an spu headshell in my Ikeda with the tonearm at the recommended distance without being seriously out of alignment. I’ve researched this online and I’ve spoken to Bill Demars at Beauty of Sound.  He said that the recommended pivot to spindle distance is probably wrong and some people position at a further distance. He agreed about spu in spu headshell in the ikeda arm not being ideal. I’ve never heard if anyone has asked Ikeda these questions about their arm. 


I do really like this arm, the way it sounds and the fact that is has a removable headshell, 
I’d just like to have better understanding of it? 



sdrsdrsdr

Showing 8 responses by chakster

chakster's avatar
chakster
6,144 posts
 
Technics engineers in Japan who designed SL1200G tonearm with alignment method that is very close to Stevenson (almost identical) must be very s****d then.


In my own defense I should probably add that my Reed 3P tonearm with fixed headshell uses the Baerwald geometry. As much as I’ve tried, I’ve never been able to conclude that this set up sounds superior in any way to the others.

@edgewear same here with my Reed 3p "12 with Baerwald and vintage FR and IKEDA with Stevenson
chakster's avatar
chakster
6,144 posts
 
The main reason I have a problem with these headshells is with my Ikeda it407 (chrome) tonearm, the cartridge must be twisted quite a bit in towards centre.


I have Ikeda IT-345 with original headshell. The reason Ikeda-San made the shape of the headshell so strange is because he did it for his own IKEDA cartridges first. BUT overhang is adjustable on the shell, so you can move it forward or backward. Azimuth is adjustable too. This shell is definitely not cool for square shape cartridges, looks a bit ugly together. It's perfect for IKEDA cartridges and for something with rounded shape as Miyabi Standard, Miyajima etc. Why don't you just buy IKEDA cantilever-less cartridge for this wonderful tonearm? 

 I have a vintage audio technica headshell with fixed holes and I don't even need a protractor to see that it won’t work. I don’t think stevenson alignment is this bad? I don't have a protractor with stevenson.

Which one ?  When AT made Technihard series they made two versions (short 13 and long 15) with adjustable overhand and azimuth. 


My pivot to spindle distance is set perfect using my smartractor. I’m quite sure it is not possible to use an spu headshell in my Ikeda with the tonearm at the recommended distance without being seriously out of alignment. I’ve researched this online and I’ve spoken to Bill Demars at Beauty of Sound.  He said that the recommended pivot to spindle distance is probably wrong and some people position at a further distance.

Can't comment on long version, but since the IKEDA IT-345 and FR-64s share the same PS distance (230mm) i think IKEDA IT407 and FR-66s protractors are the same too (just longer PS) ? 

IKEDA-345 and FR-64s / FR-64fx alignment method is Stevenson. 

I don’t think stevenson alignment is this bad? I don't have a protractor with stevenson.

I recommend you to buy Dr.Feickert protractor to have 3 methods in one protractor (Baerwald, Lofgren and Stevenson). It's great tool for any turntable and any tonearm, worth the investment (top quality product, made in Germany). 



chakster's avatar
chakster
6,144 posts
 
I recommended Dr.Feickert because you said this:

I don’t have a protractor with stevenson.

Believe it of not, but i don’t like mirror under cartridges, i have very bad experience with Van Den Hul mirror protractor, i prefer white lines on black surface (just like Feickert, better for my eyes) and it’s enough for me to align cantilever with these lines. Additional light is a good bonus for Feickert. A good vision is also good bonus, i can handle it.

You can always order Stevenson protractor for one particular tonearm.

If you don’t need Stevenson alignment at all it’s another story, but then you will have to twist your cartridges in the headshells on Ikeda.



chakster's avatar
chakster
6,144 posts
 
I thought I would try Stevenson but I keep hearing how poor it is. Maybe uni-din is a better choice. Check this out.

Bad things about Stevenson alignment coming only from one user on this forum, many others are happy with Stevenon and can’t detect any problem using headshell integrated cartridges like SPU or FR-7 series with Fidelity-Research or Ikeda tonearms.

You have to check and decide for yourself.
I’m using Baerwald on some of my tonearms with many cartridges when re-alignment is not a big deal using proper headshells.

Anyway, maybe i’m just not so old to hear distortion, i can’t say anything bad about Stevenson alignment method and if you will read more about it there was the reason to invent this geometry, especially for those who’re into classical music.

chakster's avatar
chakster
6,144 posts
 
@bukanova

 In most of the records crescendo occurs in the very end (at least in classical and jazz) so with cartridges like SPU which are not the best trackers I do feel more safe to have Stevenson as it less possible that it will damage inner grooves of record.

Exactly, i can only remind others that we have not only big "12 inch records, but smaller "10 inch EPs and "7inch singles. On smaller format of vinyl there is nothing located that far from the center hole, because the radious of the record is much smaller. I've posted about it before, on "7 inch records everything located in the field where on "12 inch located only last two songs maximum. Stevenson alignment is not for idiots. 

But anyway, most of us using at least two tonearms and we can compare one to another with different alignment methods. I have 4 tonearms in use, some with Baerwald, some with Stevenson, some with manufacturer's own alignment.  

chakster's avatar
chakster
6,144 posts
 
Before anyone will tell how Michael Fremer can hear distortion please read this post about his favorite tonearm called SAT. You will be surprised to read about SAT tonearm geometry, this is Michael's favorite. 
chakster's avatar
chakster
6,144 posts
 
Over and over again, every year, oh my god.
No one can HEAR it, Japanese tonearm designers continue to use Stevenson. The one who claimed to hear it (M.Fremer) is using SAT tonearm that received tons of criticism on here because of is geometry.
People contradict to each over, some people contradict to themselves.

Normal people continue to enjoy music with whatever alignment (Baerwald, Lofgren or Stevenson ... or maybe something new like Uni-Din).

I will add more frustration:  Rigid Float/Ha , a very short 7” inch tonearm !
HOW ABOUT UNDERHANG  5~20mm ?

chakster's avatar
chakster
6,144 posts
 
Steve, with your name you must get Stevenson
sorry, it was hard to resist :) 

Seriously, always try first what manufaturer recommends, Ikeda-San is the legend in High-End world. 

You can ask @halcro for his FR-66s PS distance, it must be the same as Ikeda 407. 
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