If I just use a DAC, do I need a Pre-amp?

Yes you can, but the impedances of the equipment might not match, causing anomalies

There is no impedance match problem with today's solid state sources, but there "can" be with boutique "tube output sources".

Cheers George 

And JA concludes with

The XP-30 has rekindled for me the concept that the beating heart of an audio system is the preamplifier.

Yes Nelson Pass is in business to make money, even from his preamps, if people want them.


Yet Nelson Pass also quotes this:

Nelson Pass,

“We’ve got lots of gain in our electronics. More gain than some of us need or want. At least 10 db more.

Think of it this way: If you are running your volume control down around 9 o’clock, you are actually throwing away signal level so that a subsequent gain stage can make it back up.

Routinely DIYers opt to make themselves a “passive preamp” - just an input selector and a volume control.

What could be better? Hardly any noise or distortion added by these simple passive parts. No feedback, no worrying about what type of capacitors – just musical perfection.

And yet there are guys out there who don’t care for the result. “It sucks the life out of the music”, is a commonly heard refrain (really - I’m being serious here!). Maybe they are reacting psychologically to the need to turn the volume control up compared to an active preamp.”

Cheers George

davidgwillett OP

The old saying "best preamp in the world" "sound like a piece of wire".
Guess what that’s what going direct is, and then passive and last an active preamp.

And if you don’t like direct and your not "bit striping", then you don’t like the sound of your source, change it, don’t add another expensive problem into the mix.
As Ivor Tifenbrun (Linn LP12) said, it all starts with the source, get that right and your almost home.

Cheers George

Even cheaper than the Schiit Saga, but it’s just passive is the Schiit Sys $49. it’s 10kohm passive just like the Saga just not paying for the tube stage or remote. https://www.schiit.com/products/sys

Cheers George

Not sure if this is to be believed but some reviewers were stating that the addition of this preamp made the DAC sound even quieter than direct DAC to amp.

Who ever said this is yanking himself, because it’s impossible, unless there was a grounding problem.

Nelson Pass,

“We’ve got lots of gain in our electronics. More gain than some of us need or want. At least 10 db more.

Think of it this way: If you are running your volume control down around 9 o’clock, you are actually throwing away signal level so that a subsequent gain stage can make it back up.

Routinely DIYers opt to make themselves a “passive preamp” - just an input selector and a volume control.

What could be better? Hardly any noise or distortion added by these simple passive parts. No feedback, no worrying about what type of capacitors – just musical perfection.

And yet there are guys out there who don’t care for the result. “It sucks the life out of the music”, is a commonly heard refrain (really - I’m being serious here!). Maybe they are reacting psychologically to the need to turn the volume control up compared to an active preamp.”

Luminous Audio makes a passive preamp with a volume control that is not in-line with the signal.

That’s just uses a series fixed resistor with a pot shunted to ground, best is is a series/shunt ladder as it gives far better input impedance consistencies.
http://diyaudio.co.kr/wwwboard1/data/board1/compare.pdf

Cheers George

davidgwillett
I have the opportunity to get a nice Fisher 400CX-2...but why?

 Going direct is the most transparent/dynamic/uncolored way of listening to your source.
Only if you find the need to "color" the sound of your source do you need an expensive active preamp, but you will take a hit on the above for that coloration.
It makes better sense to change the source to get what’s wanted/needed instead.

Classic saying: Ivor Tiefenbrun (Linn LP12 TT inventor)
"It all starts at the source, get that right and you half the way home"

Cheers George