I'm a little stumped


My base system (power & speakers) is a McIntosh MA6100 integrated amp running a pair of Klipsch Chorus II's.

I'm been thinking real hard about upgrading both the power & speakers. After a fair bit of research and remembering a friend's MG1's from many moons ago I pretty much decided to go with a pair of Magnepan 1.6qr's. I auditioned a pair today and pretty much drew a blank. I expected to be amazed (I would have brought a pair home) and was left with sort of a "no comment". The audio shop ran the 1.6's with a Bryston 2B (180W @4 ohms). Overall they sounded a little thin & quite bright without much bottom end. The bottom end can always be cured with a sub, but the brightness?? I'm sure they could have used more power, but I thought there would be a hint of greatness I could draw on. I also listened to a pair of B&W 704s & Theil 2.4's. Basically they all paled in comparison to my little MA6100/Chorus combo. I was looking forward to maggie nirvana, but didn't see it...any ideas what happened? Bad room, bad setup, not enough power??
fishboat

Showing 3 responses by jax2

I'd agree with Plato, Chorus would be hard to beat for the $. If your
expectations are set by a horn+tube sound I think you'd have to expect
that an Electorstatic powered by SS will sound quite different. I have a
good friend who is also a horn/tube/Klipsch audiophile. He purchased a
pair of 1.6's on a whim, as he is often prone to doing (buying gear, not
just Maggies!). He has several
nice tube amps as well as a Parasound 200 watt amp as I recall. He
came away with a similar reaction as you describe ("...what's all the
fuss about? I don't get it."). He ended up selling his 1.6's after
about a month with them.

I don't think it's a rule with electrostatics or necessarily with
Magneplanars as both can sound quite splendid indeed, but as my pal
Slappy implies, they'll sound different depending on what you pair them
off with. Also, they just may not be your taste.

On a similar note, I went over to Speakerlab, here in Seattle (nice folks
by the way), with my buddy Peter_S to take a listen to the Gallo
Reference III's (those weird-ass speakers getting great reviews that
graced Stereophiles cover not long ago). Peter's also a tube guy and the
speakers were hooked up in a room with Parasound Halo dual monos (ss
amps). So we listened for about a half an hour to different music we'd
brought and were familiar with. Though we both liked them for their
tight bass and wonderful soundstage (I should let Peter write his own
opinions...at least I think he liked those aspects of them), we both
thought the presentation with the Halo amps was sterile and analytical. I
can't imagine anyone needing the subwoofer element they offer as the
bass was plenty low and tight for my tastes, at least with the Halos. It
was perfect in an almost bland kind of way that when you look at all the
things it does well leaves me very surprised that it does not engage me
more than it did. It certainly sounded very neutral. Peter had gone there
ready to buy a pair for himself, but kept his wallet in his pocket. He's
over at CES now and I'm betting he'll come back with something.

I digress. I've owned two pairs of Forte II's which are the Chorus II's
smaller cousin (though not by much). I thought they were excellent
speakers, especially for what they go for. Very versatile with all kinds of
music and many different amps I paired them off with. I could certainly
enjoy them for a long time with no complaints. I moved onto LaScala's
which does them one better and really shine with tubes. If you like your
Chorus II's why not listen to a pair of LaScalas or Khorns (if you have the
space and opposing corners), or even Cornwalls? Just a thought. Better
yet, try a good tube amp with your Chorus II's...they really don't need
that much power to shine...25-35watts of tube power will keep you
grinning I'd suspect and be a nice change from the McIntosh SS amps
you have. Try it out first of course...perhaps you may know a local
audiophile who may do some listening with you and bring their amp
over. I've done that where I live and had a great time and made friends
at the same time.

Marco
Fishboat - What kinds of music do you like to listen to? How big is your listening room? What is your budget? The answer to those questions may narrow down your choices in the wide selection of amplifcation that will work with you Chorus II's. My experience with Klipsch speakers (just the Heritage stuff) is that pairing them off with tubes brings a greater sense of realism, holography and airiness (as a broad generalization). There's a whole wide range of tube amplification for all kinds of budgets. The wonderful thing about them is that even the less expensive choices can be VERY rewarding. I do suggest taking a listen to what this kind of combination sounds like before you buy. Just as your surprise with the Maggies, you may also be surprised at how different tubes may sound when your expectations are set by your SS Mac. As already has been suggested; if you're happy and you know it clap your hands! If there is a dealer near you who will let you audtion gear that may be a good idea. Or post the thread with your area and ask if a fellow A'goner may like to let you come take a listen to their tube system. If you are near Seattle feel free to ping me off the thread. I'd be happy to make a few suggestions based upon my experience, and assuming your budget is moderate based upon your current setup. Jolida is making some fine integrated amps that are upgradable and sound wonderful stock. Most are of a very versatile push/pull design. Their 302B or 502B would work quite well with your Chorus II's. Quicksilver Mini Mites are also excellent amps but would require a preamp. I have not heard them, but have heard great things about the Cayin line of integrated tube amps here on the Gon - likely very similar to the Jolida stuff as both are moderately priced tube amps built in China. Do try to take a listen before you take a leap. As far as your experience with the LaScala price you mentioned: Klipsch still is manufacturing the LaScala and the Khorn at a comensurate price for a new speaker of that expense to manufacture in the current market and economy. So the price you observed was likely a newer version purchased recently at retail. Vintage LaScalas can still be easily found in the $1000 range, and Khorns in the $2000 range.

Marco
Hey, that's what makes this forum so much fun Fishboat! Glad to be of help. Just a few more thoughts based on your recent words:

Oh my, YES, YES, YES, improving your front end can have a HUGE impact on sound IMHO, especially given your current player. There are threads ad nauseum on audio hierarchy that you can find with a search. Most seasoned audiophiles seem to fall in two camps as far as which component has the potential to make the most impact on the system. One being the front-end, and the other being speakers. There are still others who will cite other components. My intention here is definitely NOT to dredge up opinions that have already been stated in many other threads on this subject. Just to tell you that you can be assured your CD player makes a tremendous difference in your system. Making even an inexpensive improvement there to a more modern, well-designed player would be money well-spent. Not to sound like a skipping record, but if you want to keep to a modest budget, again Jolida makes a player that is killer for under a grand brand new (JD-100A). No, I don't have stock in the company. For a great discussion on Audio System Hierarchy check out the December issue of The Absolute Sound - there is a great panel discussion on that very subject.

So from your preferences of vocals and jazz I'd say tubes would be a great way to go. Definitely check out what a difference they can make. I don't know your MA6100, but I'd suspect it is not likely it can act as a preamp to another amp. The Jolida's I mentioned, and the Cayin are all integrated amps and would not require a preamp.

Marco