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I could not believe it

I was happy owner of pretty decent rig (Supratek+Clayton monoblock+AA Capitole as cdp). One pretty Sunday morning I came across garage sale, guy have 20 years old Fisher turntable for sale (cheap looking extremely dirty unused for 10+ years).
I would not normaly buy it, but for $2 what the heck. I bought it for fun. It took 30 minutes of cleaning, and I connected it to phono stage of Supratek Chenin. I had some LP's at home.
To my surprise it worked. To even bigger surprise it worked so good.
I compared Dire straits and Madonna LP’s with exactly the some albums on CD.
I could not decided which I prefer (CD or LP). I really could not!
Remember we are talking about $8700 cpd and maybe in good condition $30 worth cheesy turntable. It keeps me wonder how much better would sound decent turntable ?
Classical music from Deccca, Deutsche Gramophone, Columbia Masterworks actually scared me. Resolution (there is not congestion I hear on every classic CD) smoothness really scared me. It cannot be so! I could not believe what I heard. Why for goodness sake we have ever embraced CD format, for convenience maybe, not for quality for sure?
generally sound from CD on Capitole have more body, much better bass, dynamics on some audiophile CD’s.
BMG and other normal CD are in comparison to LP’s simply unlistenable.
Classic on CD’s is especially congested and its resolution is not even close to what I heard from LP’s on cheesy Fisher turntable.
There is one but though:
a lot of surface noise especially on older LP’s.

So , analog gurus I'm rookie at the subject but believer now, please give me advice about some decent turntable which besides resolution and lack of congestion would give me even soother and even more detailed presentation, huge dynamics, wide soundstage. And would be quiet without this awful surface noise.

What Turntable would you recommend for up to $3000 used.
I read that pretty good ones are
Nottingham Space Deck w/ space arm
vpi scoutmaster with jmw-9 arm.
How does those two compare, maybe different recommendation.

PS.
I heard on CES $30.000 turntables and they have been awesome, but I have never though that actually cheap turntable could sound that good and actually stand a chance to high-end CDP and on classic beat it in spades.
sorlowski

Showing 3 responses by sorlowski

sorlowski OP
236 posts
 
Stiltskin,
Ander the influence of great number of positive reviewsfrom audioreview.com I have bought 2 year ago SONY 9000ES SACE player. I was very disappointed it could not much quality of my old Arcam APLHA6 I had at that time. AA Cap was step forward from Arcam 6 but that big like Sony was step backward from Arcam. By chance I bought this weekend RCA Gold Seal recording of Boston Pops, for some reason this particular LP have unbelievable resolution, something I had never heard from even Gold audiophile CD’s on my AA Cap. It s getting better and better.
I would be in seven heaven if not awful surface noise and limited dynamic. I’m sure more serious turntable like VPI or that German AS will take of that problem.
What tubes are you using in your Chenin ?
>Dgad
Change the tubes on your Audio Aero Capitole. I bet that is a big part of the problem.
How do I do that, as far as I know they are solder in to the board ?
What tubes would you recommend. Maybe would be possible to soldier sockets to AA so future tube replacement would easier ? Have anybody done that ?
I remember Supartek Chenin was pretty nice with stock tubes, but when I have replaced stock with GEC KT66 + Bendix 6106 + Sylvania 6sn7W (metal base chrome top) it become different preamp with exceptional resolution and charming mids. I might add I replaced them after reading thread abut Supartek on Audiogon.
Regards to you all.
sorlowski OP
236 posts
 
Let me share one more experience with you.
During weekend I got hold of old Carver CT-17 preamp ($800 in 1990). It has phone stage so I replaced Supratek with Carver.
It got the some load 47kohm like Chenin.
1) LP playback on Supratek is much louder them CD Playback, with Carver it is opposite way Cd sounds much louder.
2) Even my wife says (she is not audiofile) that with Chenin old Fisher sound better (resolution and musical wise not dynamic wise). With Carver in line LP charm was gone, sound was pretty plain, uninvolving. CD sounded much, much better. If I head LP with Carver first I would never got interested in LP. What is interested with CD there was difference but not that big. With LP it was huge. So I not sure anymore if LP is that much better them CD or just Supratek makes it sound that much better. I invited some peoples from work they did hear alike that cheesy Fisher with Supratek sounded better them AA Cap with Supratek.
Those mp3 lovers have been shocked that LP is that good :)
Maybe AA Cap would sound much better with different preamp like LP lost his charm with Carver ?
sorlowski OP
236 posts
 
Thank you for all the responses I was not expecting more then a few.
I heard Bose and I could not believe how bad it was. When it comes to record cleaner VPI 16.5 is interesting example $500 new nearly $400 used, does it have any sense to buy it used. They do keep value.

>If Sorlowski had posted his experience over in Vinyl Asylum, there would have been a half dozen people trying to reason with him about how great digital is and how each format is sonically equal.

It would be futile, I know what I heard. Of coures it was subjective to me only. I rechecked my impression a few times. I do not like it either. Plastic cheesy Fisher should not have stand a chance with build like a tank AA Cap . Heavy maintenance or inconvenience does not bather me as long it would sound better.. I already have Supratek (my convenience I had with MA A300 is long gone).
I thought that transistors have been step forward until I went to HE2001 and the best SS setups like ML and others was for me miles away from VAC, LAMM, Manley.
When it comes to cd vs lp maybe part of the reason is in software. I have noticed that AA Cap on typical CD sound like $300 cdp only on audiophile grade CD's it shines. Maybe LP have been recorder inherently better.
Have anybody actually compared Nottingham and Scoutmaster ?
I do not know if I could use recommended by Elizabeth Ortofon OM10 or a Shure 97me, description on Fisher says to use ST-66 D stylus.
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