Hanaleimike,
Man, I am going to pour a double scotch tonight and cry with you. Sorry about the loss. But, cheer up! Lots of good Conrad Johnson, McIntosh, Citation, Dynaco, marantz, etc.. to be found. Go for it. You'll have the time of your life, and your wallet will thank you.
Norman |
Stringreen, better speakers? Not that there aren't any, there are many. The BP 10s still sing. I have my eye on a pair of Quads, ESL that an audio buddie of mine will be parting with. Properly set up, they are really sweet. And yeah, the Grace arm is gorgeous. |
Cafreeman, that is a beloved system. I had some Mac gear, a MA 6100 integrated, then later a C-29 and a MC-2300. I also had an LP 12, but I couldn't walk across the floor when playing a record. (needed a better support)
Nice to see that there are still those enjoying Vintage gear.
Grimace, enlighten me.. what old gear do you use?
Thanks Gentlemen! |
Carter,
Man you are spot on. It seems that all of us, somewhere in time lost the entire notion that it is all about the music. The system that I mentioned is one that I have owned for over 30 years. However, it wasn't the only one I listened too in all that time. I was caught up in upgrade Hell for years. Went through thousands of dollars and in the end, was never more satisfied than with the system that I use now. So, like everyone else, I sold gear at a massive loss only to end up appreciating, and throughly enjoying the system that I always went back too. The Citations. My upgrade days are OVER. I am content. When this revelation finally hit me, I began once again to just enjoy the music. I listen every day, and love what I am hearing.
Great post Carter...
Norman |
Steve,
My eldest son uses a Vintage Yamaha hifi. C2 pre-amp and a m40 amplifier that he runs in class A mode. It is a very sweet set up, no disappointments. He uses a set of EPI 100's with a POLK subwoofer. The Yamaha pre-amp is really impressive, at least as good as if not better than my Citation 17. And the phono section is what really stands out to me. You're right, NO HYPE, just pure enjoyment... for years now.. with minimal cost.
I have yet to hear, a substantial improvement in any new 'state of the art' system from what was available twenty or thirty years ago. In fact, isn't that what everyone is now discovering? Idler drive turntables, reel to reel, tube amps? We got it right long ago... we just didn't know it until digital came around and we discovered 'listening fatigue'.
Keep the faith.. vintage is where its at.
Norman |
missioncoonery,
Well that certainly hasn't been my experience. In fact in many cases just the opposite. You'll find many music enthusiast who prefer vintage. Bear in mind, the gear has to be in top working condition.
Loving the Sansui at the moment.
N
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I have recently been down sizing and selling off many amps and preamps, tape decks etc. Before letting them go, I have been listening to them one last time. =) What fun!
Recently, I inserted my ancient but pristine Sansui 9090DB, and WOW!
I had forgotten how good this thing is. I am aghast that I am enjoying a receiver so much, but the phono is wonderful. The soundstage is glorious and at the moment I can't seem to bring myself to pull it from my system. It sounds absolutely wonderful and effortless. Smooth and airy. No fatigue whatsoever and very dynamic.
I have been having everyone audio friend I know come for a listen. We are all surprised. I bought this in 1977, and didn't use is long as I began using Mac separates and got on the upgrade wheel. I am liking it so much I may send it in for a quick CLA and keep it.
Just saying, it seems to do everything just right and it's beautifully built.
Norman |
playpen,
Depending on the model, your P+E might actually be a Dual in wolfs clothing. Dual bought P+E in the early 70's. Flip it over and look at the bottom of the motor. If it has Dual stamped in it, then it was built by Dual after P+E closed. In any regard, they are really good turntables.
I am curious how your Harmon Kardon sounds? Those were pretty nice receivers, even the little ones sounded smooth. I have no experience with Rotel, other than a few of their CD players both of which went up in flames. (no really) But they sounded nice.
If the Rotel was that harsh, it probably needed servicing.
I love old KLH speakers. Had a pair of sixes once.
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lewm,
You make a good point on how one defines 'vintage'. I guess when I started the thread I was thinking 60 & 70's. But as 80's are now long gone that would qualify as well.
Your system sounds awesome. I am wondering what model Threshold you are using? I really enjoyed Threshold amps, all of them. Never heard a bad one. Seems like it should be so much more than just powering the subs.
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ChrshanI37,
Did you mean a Sansui 2000a? I'm not familar withan a2000. The 2000a however is a gem of a reciever, with wonderful textures and tone, power way beyond it's weight..
ads speakers were all good. I remember seeing them used as nearfield monitors in recording studios.
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ChrshanI37,
The AU2000 is an incredible piece. Great amp section and a fantastic pre-amp. I love the phono section with built in varible loads.. Defintely a keeper..
N
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Playpen,
Love the story about your "eico". I remember those being pretty nice actually. I think I'm remembering an old eico tube receiver that my cousin had and it was good. He was driving Epi 202's with it.
Get the old girl serviced. You might be surprised.
I still have my original first hi-fi. It actually sounds pretty good. I could never sell it. Too many good memories and its a great bedroom system.
Back in November a neighbor gave me a pristine Dual 1019. I haven't done anything with it. I was thinking of setting it up as a mono table to play some of my 10" blue notes with. I need to tear it apart and give it a proper servicing first and see what it sounds like. I got a kick out of seeing the "16" speed on it. I've never seen a 16 speed record..
Isn't this the greatest hobby of all time? I hope you find your KLH 17's. Sometimes memory lane is a blast.
Norman |
Been selling off my collection of mostly amps and preamps as... Well you can only listen to one at a time, and some have'nt seen
play time in years. Much of what I have let go, though admitedly older has been McIntosh, GAS, Krell, Phase Linear, Sumo, Mark Levinson ( goodbye ML-2's).
It's been taking quite a while because I've been inserting each one into my main system for a listen. As I do I quickly recall what it was that attracted my to the componet. (sonically)
I am stunned that there are a few that are really hard to for me to take back out. A pristine Sansui 9090DB that I put away nearly 40 years ago because well it wasn't "high-end" and I was becoming an audiophile. So much did I enjoy the Sansui that today it went to a local shop for a once over. I'm keeping it.
Tonight I am listening to the, most lowly of my collection. A 1974 Sansui 551, with a whopping 16 watts rms. Laugh, scorn, jest, make fun of, but this little guy is so sweet. So silky smooth it's unnerving. It is powering my much modified D-Tec BP10's which are a mean 3 ohm load. Volume is plenty good, bass while not Krell level is very good. It has the ability to render tones that are so captivating. My wife, looks at me dumbfounded over these last few weeks. She loves this little guy and the 9090db, as do I.
She asked "you've had this how long and you've spent how much over the years when you had this?"
This was my first hi-fi, and I can't for the life of me beleive that I used it for so little a time. Another keeper.
With these last two Sansui's, I have been enjoying my music more than I can recall having done so in decades. Just saying, As I sit here in the early morning hours listeningn and sipping tea.. I am rethinking my audio decisions in a big way and having a blast listening.. |
Playpen,
"What a trip down memory lane." I agree. Life was simpler, times were different. It's not just nostalgia though. Listening to music through these old systems just 'sounds' right for some reason.
I am not saying they are they are the last definition in slam, and micro dynamics, or soundstage, (because they're not) but they deliver the tunes in an effortless easy manner and are easy to listen too.
Loves KLH speakers! Had a pair of sixes. Enjoy, this is almost too must fun.
Norman |
oblny,
I hear you. I had a couple of Pioneers briefly and liked them. I actually prefer the SX1050 over the SX1250. These were really built well. I get tired of some audio buddies talking about how 'mid-fi' this is, but I don't agree at all. How many of today's products will be around 40 years from now? Not to many.
Hi-Fi, that's what this is, not high end just Hi-Fi and it's extremely good.
Norman |
Sansui 8 is pretty amazing sounding with a sweet phono stage and I always loved the green dial lamp.
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Samzx12,
I really enjoyed the Pioneers, had the 1150 and 1250. The 1150 seemed to me to have more power and I really like its sonics. I have never owned any marantz but had heard many for long periods. They are beautiful to look at and very well made. I think they sound a little darker then the Pioneers.
I perfer the sound of Sansui to that of Pioneer. Sansui's especially the 9090db sound dynamic and very sweet. But that doesn't mean it's more accurate. It's just what I like. Truthfully the Pioneer is probably more accurate.
I stopped listening to receivers when I started reading Audio and stereophile. I first bought a Mac MA 6100 which was beautiful and sounded nice, but it started me on a road of 40 years of upgrades and swaps. Much of what I had was very high end, but it wasn't until I got into using harman kardon citation gear that I found something that did everything well.
When I rediscovered my Sansui 9090db I felt silly for ever having listened or believed that it wasn't good enough. It actually sounds way better overall than anything I've ever owned, including citation, McIntosh, Krell, Levinson etc.
The Sansui just does everything well, and it's beautiful. I'm looking forward to getting it back from a check up and using it in my primary system. My snobby audio buddies couldn't believe how good it sounded. I can't either.
You're Sansui 8 is legendary for its sound quality. Give it a serious listen. It will throw a huge soundstage and it has that sweetness that is hipnotic.
If I had an 8 I would never sell it.
Norman
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Boxer12,
I almost bought a Yamaha B1. I ended up a few years later getting a Yamaha M-40 for its class A circuit instead.
Sounds like you have a really nice system. Don't discount it because it's old. Some of the best sounding gear ever made is old, which is why from time to time they are reissued.
Norman |
Oblny,
I laughed at your magazine comment, because that's exactly what happened to me. The power of peers and the printed page!
Now I don't care. It's impossible to keep up and when you try it becomes more about the gear then the music. Now I'm enjoying something that is difficult to buy and sounds terrific. It's also great to look at.
I'm really happy I never sold my 9090db. It's like having it all new again.
Norman |
samzx12,
I would imagine that the Prima Luna is a very different presentation. Kinda like when I was running levinson ml2's. They could do a string quartet like knowing I've ever heard before. Jazz trios were wonderful. Complex classical and hard rock, well not so much.
Keep in in mind that I've never heard the Prima. I could be completely off base. |
Oblgny,
Great story on the Ohm Walsh. I heard them once when I was 16 or 17. They were amazing and could really take a lot of power. I think they were being driven by the Phase Linear 350. Those were the early models that didn't have any high end driver support. They were completely full range. They were also way out of my price range.
You mentioned the Dalquist Dq 10. That is still an excellent sounding speaker. I could live with a pair of those, but they are so hard to come by in good condition.
If if only we had 2020 hindsight. There are so many things that slipped through our hands. Thankfully we still have some of them.
Norman |
whipsaw,
Kensonic! I love Accuphase gear. When it first became available they directly compared it the build quality of McIntosh when it was reviewed.
I agree with you 100%. They leave very little to improve upon.
Norman |
Boxer12,
Not a fan of $$$$$ interconnects and cables. I found that as once common features as 'tone controls' fell out of favor with the high end community (don't get me started), that there was a need to adjust tones on certain music playback. I readily here differences in cables, but to me they are silly. My audio buddies snap em up and explain how their is more air, more highs, or now they have a complete full bottom end. When I am playing a recording that needs more highs I walk over to my preamp and adjust the treble.
The late great genius James Bongiorno once said that he will design a preamp without tone controls when someone showed him a 'flat' room. I agree.
Having extensive studio experience I can say without question that 99% of all of our recorded music has had some type of equaliztion adjustment during the recording process. That and I don't know of any recording studios that use expensive esoteric cables in the recording loop. None.
To me cables are used as today's tone controls. I have a few expensive cables that I purchased over the years. They are in a drawer with my unused audio accessories. I keep them on hand to demonstrate how they emulate my preamps tone controls ( though no where as effectively). I know, I'm gonna hear it from everyone who has their favorite cable in use. My advise, use a preamp with tone controls and put your cable dollars into records, tapes or whatever.
Norman |
Oblgny,
I agree with you. Nostalgia does play a role. Had some friends over a few weeks ago and one walked up to the 9090db and just stared at it. He had always wanted one when he was a teenager. When I look at it I remember very well having to save and save (layaway actually) to buy it.
The differnces that I hear in the vintage gear are just some how more pleasant to me. For some reason I love what I hear and I don't find myself analyzing the gear the way I do when I'm swapping out amps and preamps.
The bottom line is, that whatever draws you in, recreates that magic that makes listening so enjoyable is what you should be listening too regardless of others opinions.
Norman |
I think so. =)
Remember. "old is the new young"
At least that's the way I figure it. |
oblgny,
Your story sounds familiar. I think I lived it!
Now inserting my Sansui receivers back into my system has rewarded me with the most fun I've had listening in years!
My 9090DB is being tuned up, and it's going back into my main system.
I did have an SX 1050 and an SX 1250 for a while. You don't seem to be missing your Mac, and I am not surprised. I think the Pioneer build quality is first rate, they were nice to look at and sound wonderful.
Norman
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boxer12,
Here locally this past summer, a neighbor sold his well worn marantz 8's for $5500.00 I think he has them listed for one day.
Not to feel bad though, as we have all lived through those "kick me" moments. =) |
russbutton,
I've owned quite a bit of Mac gear. Liked all of it, but somehow always ended up trading it in or selling it off. The marantz 8 is supposed to be a gem but I've ever heard one. The Mac C22 is very highly regarded. Thinking about it, all my Mac gear was solid state. Maybe there is more magic in tubes? =)
Norman
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Just received my Sansui 9090DB back from servicing (Deltronics). Guru of all things audio 'Mike', gave the old girl a clean bill of health. Repairs needed? Zero. All functions exceeding spec. Not bad for a 39 year old receiver. =)
He did have to clean the balance pot however.
Back in in the system and sounding wonderful.
Norman
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Sam,
Yes, and I have really been enjoying it. I am going to keep two preamps and one power amp. Everything else is about gone now, but there are just certain pieces that you can't part with. =)
Norman |
