How important is S/N Ratio....?
" If you have equivalently low levels of noise but when music is playing you have within it some correlated noise that follows with the music (harmonically or IMD related) then this gear will sound much worse (even if they both share the same "on paper" S/N ratio)" So what your saying is distortion effects the S/N or not...when measured. "if it is just thermal background white noise that is totally unrelated to the audio signal then you have a great piece of gear" Ok so more inner detail...subtleties....Clarity......Focus But let's ponder this.....if distortion effects what we hear......wouldn't the S/N....true measurement...measure the distortion present in the amplifier. So the higher the S/N the lower level of distortion present in the device..amplifier. That would in theory effect....soundstage,imaging percieved and also bandwith of the amplifier. Also the componet with the poorest S/N would be the weakest link in the chain...hmmmm. |
So the consensus so far is...... Signal to Noise ratio.....is meaningless...inconsequetial to the sound of your amplifier... Sorry I don't buy it...true there might be ten ways to measure it....so confusion abounds....but when a lower S/N level can be quantified.....it has to have a relation to actual levels of distortion present.... Wether the cart goes before the horse or viceversa.....I hear a difference especially in the Amplifier componet. |
Shadorne..... "Agreed but I think several replies here are simply trying to say that the link is not as strong as you suggest. Otherwise people with analog gear (vinyl or tape) would be very unhappy - and they are not! Distortion and Signal to Noise can be separate issues and don't have to be related. You can have one bad and the other good and vice versa. Of course in excellent gear both will be good." Interesting as tape has a very large bandwith.....I really can't say about vinyl as I moved to digital source long ago and have never thought about going back...... Of course I am talking about the high upper end here....as the build quality of the componets and circuit design...seperate the levels of sound performance. Well let me ask you then......what are 3 qualities of a amplifier that combines both excellant thd and S/N levels... |
Alexander....join the party....this seems to be not such a hot topic.....but let me put this in terms of my real experience.. After years of spending thousands on cables and other tweaks....to improve the noise floor....and it did remove grunge....I started replacing capacitors in my componets. The preamp was first....major difference....then the coupling caps in my dac....again increased clarity,transparency....I was on to something here because these 2 caps were low noise and frankly the change was indeed stunning...Next was the amplifier... Recapping and changing the 2 power supply caps was so much better...not incramentel but I would say a quantum leap...now people talk about live....well in theory a microphone should pick up everything within it's range. Sound,reverb,decay,air movement and changes in pressure,ect. Well in the best digital recordings for once I feel like I am hearing everything that a mike can pick up. Now just changing capacitors...why that much difference..The tech sheet says reduces distortion by a 1000 pct and has a noise level of -135 db down or more....these are super low noise....and they are because I can hear it. I won't go into the what equipment or circuits....you may or may not get this kinda of sound quality.....I just got lucky and upgraded some equipment that I had for years. But the most improvement I heard was in the amplifier....in every aspect....you name it....everything. Like I said I dont know if THD is the cart or the noise is the horse.....but the capacitors are "super low noise". |
-135 db down is meaningless only when....there is no sonic difference discernable....but when I add two low noise PSU capacitors and 10 ultra low noise caps to a SS amplifier and the sound is unmeasurably better...I guess the poor guys that spend 30K for a amplifier can't tell the difference either...BTW the upgrade cost me 750 bucks....including labor. |
Wonderful.....I am no tech...but this amp has pull out CB's so the recapping was not that involved...the thing that was a challenge was fitting the low esr power caps. The solder issue you mention is better left to those that make their living...doing such things. I will have a matching pre-amp with these ultra low noise caps vs a unit with some Nichicon gold installed.....if I get a quantum leap with the ULN type.....well it will be interesting. |
Just for those interested I found some info..... "Ordinarily, when the electrons flow through common conductors such as an electrolyte, a manganese dioxide, an organic semiconductor and so on, non-linear distortions generate corresponding to each conductor (average -100db) as shown in Figure 1 which indicates distortion characteristics. However, in the case of Black Gate, the distortion showed such a surprising low value (-174db) as if no electrons flew. The distortion noise was almost zero. " excerpt from this link http://www.acoustic-dimension.com/blackgate/techEcap.htm |
