Nandric, et al. If you want to take Raul’s testimony about the AT636, keep in mind that he recommended using them under the naked chassis of an SP10 MK2. No obsidian plinth; just set the chassis down on 3 or 4 AT636s. Raul and I went at each other over this practice; I still think it’s a bad idea, because of the fact that the chassis will want to twist in the opposite direction of platter rotation, and the feet are entirely insufficient to anchor the chassis. So, I must ask, Nandric. Are you using the AT636 under your obsidian plinth or under the naked chassis, a la Raul?
|
I recently got a TECHNICS SL-1000MK3D - SP10-MK3 SH-10B5 Plinth. and have just installed a Thales Simplicity II tonearm. Surperb sounding table on my diy compression spring platform.
I feel there is nothing wrong with the plinth as its very well damped. The feet however, I feel they might be able to be inproved?
How do you get the feet off the SH-10B5 plinth? I have tried unscrew the feet, however they will not budge and I don't want to break them. |
Hi Chris 74, well there are many 'things' that I can't
imagine. Say the number of particles or the speed of light.
Even some more to the earth things. Like, for example, why
should anyone buy a 4-5 K plinth for an $1000 SP-10 TT?
Not to mention the arguments like 'the inherent body,
weight', etc., which are as expressions inscrutable to me
in this context.
To recommend such plinths is of course your privilege but
to judge this recommendation as nonsense is my. |
Nandric, Typically, I shy away from such commentary but my friend, such naive and defensive comments to my post above literally bleed of inexperience. Posting emotional knee jerk reactions and defensive posturing ruins forums. Politely speaking, when an individual with direct experience shares their insights on a given topic, obviously you have every right to personally disagree with any sentiments expressed. However, before trying to discredit and blatantly claim this person has no idea, you may want to know who you are talking to first. In this case, your comments were directed towards someone who has owned and listened to more Sp10 based plinths than you can ever realize. |
Hi Pani, Try Foxtan and Otomon (?) via ebay but also
Raul. Those AT pneumatic footers he recommended. As I
understand he is selling some of his carts so he may be
willing to sell his AT footers. There is btw a bigger version
then the AT 636 but to me those 636 look better with
Obsidian plinth. |
Hi Nandric,
Where can I buy a AT 636 from ? |
Nothing really wrong with the Obsidian base. Many love it. BTW it is very heavy plastic composite not solid rock or glass. It is extremely dense, heavy, and well damped and has no obvious resonance--it feels more like rock than anything else. Many other companies experimented with weighted plastic composites, including Sony, Pioneer, and Kenwood. I have never seen anything from those companies better than the Obsidian base. Of course, if you worship your turntable, there is no limit to what you could spend on an Ultimate Plinth, and at some point with vast weight and technology you might make something better. But for the cost, you couldn't do significantly better than the Obsidian. I mean at the original price and current resale prices, which weren't outrageous when I got mine last year. The artisan designers of new super bases charge way more, of course, and I have not heard them. A simple birch plinth is not going to be better than the Obsidian unless the birch plinth is huger than huge.
The SL10 (SP10,Obsidian,EPA arm,dustcover) package got a bad name after a review in Hifi News claiming they had gotten feedback. Well, yes, they put speaker right next to turntable on the same table and cranked it to the max. The LP12 did better on this test. But it was unrealistic test, and with better feet or a suspension base for the SL10 it would likely have done better than the LP12 since virtually every part of the SL10 is well damped, except the little feet aren't very isolating for a big heavy table. For some reason, the reviewers thought the base was actual Obsidian, and they falsely blamed that, creating a meme that lasted through the 80's. However everyone now knows that if the SL10 has any serious problem, it's in the feet--which are fine if table is perched on an isolating stand. |
Hi Chris, Your 'arguments':'lack the inherent body, weight
and tonal character' make no sense. To state whatever clear
one need to have some clear idea. You obviously have none
whatever. There is nothing wrong wit Obsidian plinth except
the footers. Try for example the AT 636 instead and even
a deaf person will hear the difference. So to speak. |
In my direct experience, the factory Technics B3/B5/B7 Obsidian based plinths completely lack the inherent body, weight and tonal character required to allow the Technics Sp10Mk2 and Mk3 models to showcase their strengths. In my opinion, for these reasons, these complete Technics Sp10 models only received lukewarm industry press around the era of their introduction. Certain designers (ie. Artisan Fidelity, Porter, Dobbins) have invested years developing and improving Mk2 and Mk3 aftermarket plinths to maximize the potential of the platform, if it were as easy as coupling a factory Obsidian plinth to the drive, no one would have taken the time in the first place. If by chance you have the opportunity to personally hear a properly constructed hardwood/composite/Panzerholz constrained layer based plinth in comparison to the factory Obsidian plinth, you would literally be awe struck at the contrast. |
Hi Pani, I own the SL 1000,Mk2 . That is SP-10 mk2 with
Obsidian plinth. One should remove the original footers
which are worthless and substitute them for AT pneumatic
636 or the bigger one. Your last question looks to me more
relevant than the first. Those Obsidian plinth's are very
expensive so you should anyway buy the SP-10 Mk2 (or Mk 3)
naked. There are all kinds of plinths for the SP 10 with
ditto prices (see:ebay.uk). |
Chakster, I have been through your thread. Thanks for pointing out anyway.
I am not really a fan of 12" tonearms so it is not a priority for me. All I am trying to figure out is how good/bad is the Obsidian plinth compared to other good plinths made outside. If I decide to try a SP10, should I try to find one with an Obsidian base or just buy naked and find a plinth from one of the after market vendors ? |
Pani, look at this thread for more plinth options:
http://forum.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/fr.pl?eanlg&1430138986&&&/SP10mk2:-OMA-Graphite-plinth-vs-Dobbins-
I think original plinth is "too bad" because you can't use "10,5 and "12 inch tonearms. Also it looks ugly compared to slate OMA plinth and others. |
I've got an SP-10 MK II with the original obsidian plinth, dust cover, and EPA-100 tonearm. It is not yet set up. I'm toying with several options for an alternative plinth, but the answer may be as simple as keeping it stock except for filling the inside of the cast aluminum TT housing with epoxy mixed with brass powder. Some have stated that the obsidian base subtracts LF. |
Had the MK3 with the Obsidian base and it was excellent and matched the SP10 well. Limitation was the length and no. of arms. I never liked the table in the wooden plinths that were available at the time in the Far East.
You should ask Albert about his Panzerholz, unfortunately I never heard it.
david |
