I remember when the 'Luddites' were stuck on monophonic, and said that stereo was a plot to make us buy more speakers. I like full (5 channel) multichannel, but I can see that for some people and music types the surround (rear) channels are non-essential. However, in the front you need three channels. This has been known since the earliest days of stereo. |
Mig007...Interestingly, when you close your eyes, a well set up nearfield multichannel system can transform a tiny room into a huge hall. |
Tvad...You don't like "audio tricks"? What do you suppose the phantom center channel of a stereo rig is? Everything except mono is an audio trick. |
Tvad...A few decades ago I messed around with various forms of "derived" multichannel, including some circuitry of my own design. In general I agree with you that the typical stereo recording doesn't work well in full surround.
However, some particular recordings do work very well. Few recordings are made with just two mics. There is usually an ambience mic at the back of the hall, and when its signal is mixed in out-of-phase between the two channels it will, upon playback, emerge from the rear, exactly where it belongs. One Judy Collins cut, "Amazing Grace" is exceptional. She sings in a church, at first solo, but then the congregation comes in all around you. At the end, as the sound decays you can hear people behind you putting their Hymnals back into the wooden racks! Spooky!
But usually four channels from two is overreach. However, three from two (center) always works well. I play stereo material that way on my multichannel system. I have used a center channel for about forty years using various ways to derive it.
Now, for true multichannel, I have some recordings of classical chamber music where each channel has one instrument isolated in it. When you play back such a recording you are not "transported" to the studio, but rather the performers are transported to your listing room. The realism is amazing. |
I forgot to mention, and many people don't know, that there is a large body of "antiphonal" music...composed for two or more choirs or orchestras front and rear as well as side to side. Mono and stereo playback equipment is completely incapable of properly reproducing antiphonal music. Much well-known music is actually antiphonal, but is unknown today except in a "mixed-down" form. I have one SACD "J. S. Bach, The Four Great Toccatas and Fugues played by E Power Biggs on the Four Antiphonal Organs of the Cathedral of Freiburg" that clearly illustrates the benefits of multichannel. Once you hear this music played in antiphonal manner you will never again be satisfied with a stereo rendition. |
Timrhu...Your question... "what listening perspective do you get with multi-channel playback?" Some DVDA discs let you select your perspective..."Stage" or "Audience". |
The movie "Sweet Dreams" (based on the life of Patsy Cline) is an interesting example of what can be done with remixing. It was discovered that the original master tapes of her singing in an isolation booth existed in good condition, although the accompaning instrumental tracks were in less good condition, and somewhat dated in performance techniques. For the movie soundtrack a remix was done using Patsy's original voice track with parts of the instrumental tracks and also some brand new instrumental tracks. The result can be heard on MCAD-6149 DIDX-424. (By the way Jessica Lange did a superb job of lip syncing in the movie, which I recommend as well as the CD). The remix was done by a who's-who of Nashville sound men.
Another remix that I think is interesting is a DVDA "Emmylou Harris, Producer's Cut". This was done by her former husband Brian Ahern. There is on the disc an extensive video with Brian where he explains how and why the multichannel remix was done. Again, some new tracks were added.
By the way, apart from the technical interest, both discs are nice music. |
2chnlben...The idea that performers should always be in front of you does not reflect the reality of a jazz jam session or a chamber music performance in your home. Note also my earlier posting about antiphonal music. Ambience is not the only sound for surround channels. |
Of course it's all about the mix, and that includes stereo. No doubt there are silly multichannel discs just as there are bad stereo ones. There are plenty of multichannel discs that do not put performers in the rear.
And Mrtennis...If you seek realism, spatial cues are quite important, and more difficult to achieve than pitch, timbre and harmonics. In fact, as your hearing deteriorates with age, as yours will too, (sorry about that) you will find that spatial awareness is affected very little, and therefore becomes even more important. |
Dreadhead...FYI, I do happen to be a "rocket scientist" although I don't know what that has to do with audio. |
You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make him drink. |
Tbg...What you have discovered is that multichannel does not make up for second rate equipment, but neither does it degrade good equipment. My multichannel equipment is no different from what I would use for stereo. |
Kal is correct.
Since I installed my multichannel system I have evolved three addition ears, one on my forehead and two on the back of my head. I remain fearful of where my subwoofer ear will grow. |
Audiotomb...That recording setup is exactly what TACET used for their chamber music recordings on DVDA. |
Audiotomb...A word of warning...you will need surround/rear speakers to match your fronts. When I got these DVDA, and played them using my good but not excellent rear speakers I was disturbed by the fact that the cello, in the left rear sounded weaker than the viola in the front right. New rear speakers fixed the problem. |
As Kr4 says, the performer locations vary (but not between movements of a given piece). The text notes always describe the configuration used for each piece, and sometimes discuss the reasoning. I don't have any that are weird. |
You can do that if you are willing to switch interconnects around, or if your preamp has more than one six channel input. I actually considered doing exactly what you suggest so that a TV screen could be put between what, for music, would be the rear speakers. However, I found a different use for the second six channel input. |
