Not 100% sure of the final prices including the power cords. But if look up these particular cables, you will see that all of these except the Frey are essentially one rung down from the top of the line from three top brands. I should point out that the AudioQuest Hurricane power cord however is two down from Audioquest’s top of the line power cord.
Home Demo Faceoff: Nordost / Audioquest / Transparent
I have just received home demos of 4 popular sets of high-end cables: Nordost Valhalla 2 and Frey / Audioquest Firebird Zero and Bass / Transparent Reference. I'll be determining what to pair with my existing gear:
-B&W 803 D2-Gryphon Diablo 300, with internal DAC module and Phono Board-Mac Mini (soon to be replaced by an Innuos Zenith Mk III)-Audioquest Diamond USB cable-Van Den Hul D-352 speaker cables (while great for the price, these are why I am upgrading)
First up: Audioquest Firebird Zero Single Wire with Jupiter Jumpers and Audioquest Hurricane High Current
Definitely far more high end sizzle and an improvement over my cheap "reference" Van Den Hul cables. Far, far more high frequencies come through but not at all harsh or shrill. Everything at the top end has opened way up. Sound is immersive with instruments fully formed in 3 dimensions. Bass is incredible - lots of low end growl and detail as well. Would describe the sound as "lush". While everything sounds good as you can tell, overall nothing wowed me. It was simply a few degrees better than my current cheap cables. There was one negative aspect: vocals did not sound quite as solid or natural as with my cheap cables. Vocals were not "focused". Also, there is an overall smidgen of a sense of the sound being mechanical - not organic. It is more of a sense than something I can hear and pinpoint, but it is not 100% natural sounding. Would still take these over my current cables, but they are not perfect. Thought it may have been rooted in my speakers or Mac Mini, but then I heard the Nordost cables and realized my gear was not causing the slight off-ness I was detecting. But before getting to the Nordosts, I tested the Audioquest Firebird Zero + Firebird Bass in biwire configuration. Guess what? More natural sounding, slightly, with overall more confident and solid tones, including vocals but apparent across all frequencies. Bass is tighter and punchier. Overall no change in transparency or detail, or dynamics. While bass was more solid and punchier, as were all tones, there was not actually any more bass than the single wire version. Overall control seemed tighter. Is it worth the cost to biwire the Firebird? Hell no. The difference is incredibly subtle, and I would not suggest that people pay the money (although things could be different on your gear vs mine). But the difference is one that I notice and it mostly solves the one weakness I sensed in the single-wire Firebird. My wife also described that she noticed all the same differences I heard between the single-wire and bi-wire Firebirds, and she didn't know which configuration she was hearing (it was "blind").
Next up: Nordost Valhalla 2 with Valhalla 2 Jumpers and power cord
Holy crap. Now these wowed me. First and foremost - I get very focused (and stressed) with testing gear and questioning and testing the validity of my own thoughts on what I hear. Because of this I never get out of "testing mode" when I am testing. These cables made me forget I was testing. I just got into the music and wanted to try more and more songs that were not even in my test queue. How do they sound? Shockingly full of high frequency detail and treble openess, with a warm full, inviting mid and low end. AND: shockingly fast sound. There is just so much high end detail coming through - and it is cool and crisp, not sharp and harsh. The overall sound is just so natural - this combined with the fastness of the pace made it seem like the beat was faster than I recalled for each track. Listening to these all of a sudden made me realize how artificial and awkward my system sounds with the Audioquest gear. With the Nordost's, it is just so free flowing and natural - analogue-like. Vocals are way better centered, and it gives a better impression that the vocalist is actually in front of you. Sibilants in vocals are so much more pronounced, as are all upper frequencies, however there is absolutely nothing harsh about them and they are in fact very satisfying to listen to. They are balanced by a warm and inviting midrange, with good bass. It took some time to get used to all that upper end transparency, and actually "trust" that the sound would not become grating or harsh. But it NEVER did, and I quickly learned to appreciate the high end detail rather than cringe and be afraid that suddenly things might get shrill sounding, which again they never did! I just can't get over how different these sound. Because of the fastness and high end detail, vocals have so much more life and energy. Completely energized, as if the vocalists are actually more into the performance! The one slight quibble is that the Nordosts don't have as much bass as the Audioquests. Next I thought of pairing the Audioquest Hurricane power cord with the Nordost Valhalla 2 speaker wire to see if I could claw some of that Audioquest bass back while keeping the benefits of the Valhalla 2's. The bass came back! It was absolutely stronger and more present with the Hurricane power cord. However. A slight bit of the unnaturalness I mentioned also came back when using the Hurricane. While the bass was great, overall I much prefer the natural sound when using the Nordost Valhalla 2 power cable. It is just overall easier to listen to and more satisfying. So far the Nordost Valhalla 2's are leading the race by a longshot. Not to mention, the Nordost's are far easier to install and are way more forgiving than the super stiff and unweildy Audioquest Firebird cables.
I have not yet tested the Nordost Frey's or the Transparent Reference cables. I will shortly and will post my findings in the next few days. But now I'd be shocked if the Valhalla 2's can be topped. One final thing I would say: the base gear in my system is quite rich and full sounding (Diablo 300 and D2 version of B&W 803's), so it is possible the Nordost's are the perfect balance for my system. I could also see it being possible for the Nordost cables to become too much of a good thing in a different system to mine, in particular a system that already emphasizes high frequencies. But on my system these cables sound fabulous.
-B&W 803 D2-Gryphon Diablo 300, with internal DAC module and Phono Board-Mac Mini (soon to be replaced by an Innuos Zenith Mk III)-Audioquest Diamond USB cable-Van Den Hul D-352 speaker cables (while great for the price, these are why I am upgrading)
First up: Audioquest Firebird Zero Single Wire with Jupiter Jumpers and Audioquest Hurricane High Current
Definitely far more high end sizzle and an improvement over my cheap "reference" Van Den Hul cables. Far, far more high frequencies come through but not at all harsh or shrill. Everything at the top end has opened way up. Sound is immersive with instruments fully formed in 3 dimensions. Bass is incredible - lots of low end growl and detail as well. Would describe the sound as "lush". While everything sounds good as you can tell, overall nothing wowed me. It was simply a few degrees better than my current cheap cables. There was one negative aspect: vocals did not sound quite as solid or natural as with my cheap cables. Vocals were not "focused". Also, there is an overall smidgen of a sense of the sound being mechanical - not organic. It is more of a sense than something I can hear and pinpoint, but it is not 100% natural sounding. Would still take these over my current cables, but they are not perfect. Thought it may have been rooted in my speakers or Mac Mini, but then I heard the Nordost cables and realized my gear was not causing the slight off-ness I was detecting. But before getting to the Nordosts, I tested the Audioquest Firebird Zero + Firebird Bass in biwire configuration. Guess what? More natural sounding, slightly, with overall more confident and solid tones, including vocals but apparent across all frequencies. Bass is tighter and punchier. Overall no change in transparency or detail, or dynamics. While bass was more solid and punchier, as were all tones, there was not actually any more bass than the single wire version. Overall control seemed tighter. Is it worth the cost to biwire the Firebird? Hell no. The difference is incredibly subtle, and I would not suggest that people pay the money (although things could be different on your gear vs mine). But the difference is one that I notice and it mostly solves the one weakness I sensed in the single-wire Firebird. My wife also described that she noticed all the same differences I heard between the single-wire and bi-wire Firebirds, and she didn't know which configuration she was hearing (it was "blind").
Next up: Nordost Valhalla 2 with Valhalla 2 Jumpers and power cord
Holy crap. Now these wowed me. First and foremost - I get very focused (and stressed) with testing gear and questioning and testing the validity of my own thoughts on what I hear. Because of this I never get out of "testing mode" when I am testing. These cables made me forget I was testing. I just got into the music and wanted to try more and more songs that were not even in my test queue. How do they sound? Shockingly full of high frequency detail and treble openess, with a warm full, inviting mid and low end. AND: shockingly fast sound. There is just so much high end detail coming through - and it is cool and crisp, not sharp and harsh. The overall sound is just so natural - this combined with the fastness of the pace made it seem like the beat was faster than I recalled for each track. Listening to these all of a sudden made me realize how artificial and awkward my system sounds with the Audioquest gear. With the Nordost's, it is just so free flowing and natural - analogue-like. Vocals are way better centered, and it gives a better impression that the vocalist is actually in front of you. Sibilants in vocals are so much more pronounced, as are all upper frequencies, however there is absolutely nothing harsh about them and they are in fact very satisfying to listen to. They are balanced by a warm and inviting midrange, with good bass. It took some time to get used to all that upper end transparency, and actually "trust" that the sound would not become grating or harsh. But it NEVER did, and I quickly learned to appreciate the high end detail rather than cringe and be afraid that suddenly things might get shrill sounding, which again they never did! I just can't get over how different these sound. Because of the fastness and high end detail, vocals have so much more life and energy. Completely energized, as if the vocalists are actually more into the performance! The one slight quibble is that the Nordosts don't have as much bass as the Audioquests. Next I thought of pairing the Audioquest Hurricane power cord with the Nordost Valhalla 2 speaker wire to see if I could claw some of that Audioquest bass back while keeping the benefits of the Valhalla 2's. The bass came back! It was absolutely stronger and more present with the Hurricane power cord. However. A slight bit of the unnaturalness I mentioned also came back when using the Hurricane. While the bass was great, overall I much prefer the natural sound when using the Nordost Valhalla 2 power cable. It is just overall easier to listen to and more satisfying. So far the Nordost Valhalla 2's are leading the race by a longshot. Not to mention, the Nordost's are far easier to install and are way more forgiving than the super stiff and unweildy Audioquest Firebird cables.
I have not yet tested the Nordost Frey's or the Transparent Reference cables. I will shortly and will post my findings in the next few days. But now I'd be shocked if the Valhalla 2's can be topped. One final thing I would say: the base gear in my system is quite rich and full sounding (Diablo 300 and D2 version of B&W 803's), so it is possible the Nordost's are the perfect balance for my system. I could also see it being possible for the Nordost cables to become too much of a good thing in a different system to mine, in particular a system that already emphasizes high frequencies. But on my system these cables sound fabulous.
Showing 27 responses by nyev
Also Inna, you raise a good point about a potential future upgrade of my speakers, and having to change the cables again. I did consider this, and I have a couple of thoughts: 1) You can say the same about the amplifier and other components. Everything has to be matched. So, the way I am looking at it is, if and when I upgrade my speakers, I need to find some that match ALL other components in my system, and that includes cables. 2) This next sentiment will probably pass: After listening to my system with the Valhalla 2's, not to sound cliche but to me this seems like audio nirvana. It actually makes me NOT want to upgrade my speakers for fear of losing the qualities I am currently enjoying so much. Of course, this will only last until I hear something better, but that's the way it goes. Like I said, I'm just thankful I have not tested Odin 2. It briefly crossed mind to ask the dealer for an Odin 2 demo power cord, but NO! Not going there lol! It's a slippery slope. Either way, I don't actually think I'll need to upgrade my speakers for quite a while now. I'm extremely happy with the sound with the Valhalla 2's. And I still have an Innuos Zenith Mk III streamer that is on the way (back-ordered), so I'm expecting an improvement over my Mac Mini when this finally ships. |
To expand on my prior comments, Audioquest’s Firebird/Hurricane sound, to me in my system, is lush but somehow restrained in a way that I can’t quite put my finger on, with absolutely incredible bass. Maybe the bass is a bit too incredible. In contrast, Nordost Valhalla 2 is dry, warm, detailed, lightning quick, and absolutely effortless. In short the Nordost is contributing a positive difference of a similar scale to what I found my Gryphon Diablo 300 amplifier had over many, many amplifiers and preamps that I tested at a similar price point. This is no subtle improvement. The scale of the difference is the equivalent of finding a perfect source component or amp for your system. No power cord or cable skeptics could deny this type of difference in sound. |
Luckily, I’ve had enough experiences trying very expensive gear that I thought sounded terrible in some way or other. So I feel like price is not a bias. My dealer actually suggested I try the Frey as well as the Valhalla 2’s, as he thought the Frey’s were a better value. The reason I’d be surprised if the Frey’s or Transparent’s will beat the Valhalla is simply because of how much better I liked the Valhalla’s over the AudioQuest Firebird’s, even when the Firebird’s were bi-wired. By the way, the bi-wired Firebird’s would have cost more than the Valhalla 2’s, so there is an example where a lower cost option easily bested a higher cost option. One thing I always do is question my own perceptions. I listened to the Valhalla 2’s again today with fresh ears. They were just as musical, free flowing, detailed, and easy to listen to as last night. By the way I stayed up to 6am testing and going back and forth. The one thing I do wonder is whether some might consider the sound of the Valhalla 2’s to be “etched”. I don’t think so, but it is possible others might. While the AudioQuest Firebird sound I would describe as “lush”, the Valhalla 2’s I would say are a “Natural and Dry” sound by comparison. |
Thanks for the advice. Unfortunately I’m rather limited in trying demo cables with my equipment at home because of where I live. For that reason, I cannot try cables from Wywires or Townshend. In fact, there are only a couple of other brands I could try which are not of interest. Cableco’s lending library doesn’t help, as I live in Canada and according to their site they only lend in the US. I’ve now completed my testing of the Nordost Frey 2 and the Transparent Reference. Here are my findings: Nordost Frey 2: First thing I tried was pairing the Frey 2 power cord with the Valhalla 2 speaker wire to see the difference from the Valhalla 2 cord. For the first minute or so, I couldn’t hear a difference between the power cords. But I realized I was only focusing on frequency response at first. I went back and forth and found that with the Valhalla 2 cord, vocals and other tones were far more open and 3D. Overall however, when I switched to a full Frey 2 power cord and speaker cable, I was impressed! Much better than the Audioquest Firebird (biwired!) to my ears. I am thinking I am becoming a fan of Nordost. I would be happy with the Frey 2’s. Good bass, natural and relaxed sound, not harsh, good timing. However, when I switched back to the Valhalla 2’s, everything opened up, and I realized the Frey’s sound is a bit compressed in comparison. Vocal energy increased with Valhalla 2’s and everything was more lifelike and 3D. More like the singer is in the room with you. But still. You can’t go wrong with the Frey 2 for the money, and to me it beats the more expensive Audioquest Firebird/Hurricane hands down in terms of being more natural and enjoyable. Still, I cannot unhear the Valhalla 2’s now.... I’m just glad I have not tried the Odin 2’s! Transparent Reference: Right off the bat I was impressed. Much more natural sounding than the Audioquests. Overall, these produced the "largest" sound of the cables I’ve tested. Better bass than Nordost, and high frequencies are completely open and not harsh at all. After listening to the Transparent’s across a variety of music types, I was very impressed with how big, open, and natural they sounded. One aspect that I found quite shocking is just how "clean" everything sounded. I don’t know how else to explain it; maybe the noise floor was lower or something? I just kept noticing this quality - I’d say this was the Transparent’s most striking quality. However, I did notice that some music with a lot of upper mids and high frequencies could take on a slightly harder sound. Almost too clean of a sound perhaps? In thinking about what I was hearing, I believe the Transparent cables may actually be the most "transparent" of all the cables I’ve tested, in terms of actually just disappearing and letting the source material, amplifier, and speakers speak. I definitely have a high appreciation for these cables. At one point, I was dismayed as I was thinking this race would be very, very close between the Transparent Reference’s and the Nordost Valhalla 2’s, which would mean a lot of work A/B testing.But. When I went back to the Valhalla 2’s, wow. Immediately it was a comforting, inviting, warm and detailed sound that was just SO musically satisfying. Not as much bass, and not as big of an overall sound, and maybe not as squeaky clean, but who cares. These are just engaging and during the testing, these were the cables that made me want to quit testing and just listen to music - which as I said is exactly what I did until 6am last night. One reason I think I like the Valhalla 2’s so much, and moreso than the Transparent’s, is that there is a definite warmth and smoothness to the midrange, despite being insanely peppered with "inner detail" and lightning quickness. Maybe this warmth and smoothness means the cable is doing more than it is supposed to in terms of adding its own signature. But I really like these qualities so I’d rather have them there. One thing I hadn’t mentioned about these: the dynamics and slam of midrange percussion is the best of the cables tested. There is a rhythm, impact, and drive to the midrange, while also being velvety smooth, and this just enhances overall musicality. In short the Valhalla 2’s seem like an old, warm, inviting, favorite pair of jeans. The sound is both welcoming and inviting. So there it is. Results: 1st place: Nordost Valhalla 2 2nd place: Transparent Reference 3rd place: Nordost Frey 2. Because of the price and also the overall sonic presentation, I’d likely pick these over the Transparent References. But the Transparent’s are undoubtedly more capable. 4th place: Audioquest Firebird (biwire) and Hurricane. This was the big surprise. Audioquest was WAY behind all the other cables I tested. And I wanted to like them. One thing I am wondering: I’m told these were among the first cables to be subjected to AQ’s new factory burn-in process. I am wondering if either 1) dealer was mistaken and these were not actually burned in, or 2) this new burn-in process doesn’t quite go all the way, meaning that these cables may not actually be fully burned in? I guess I’ll never know, but I was rather disappointed in these. I’m sure there are many other cables out there that I would like, but I don’t have access to trying anything else, and the Valhalla 2’s actually give me far more than I was ever expecting. I was not actually that excited about upgrading cables until I heard what these can do. Now I am excited. Just not about the cost... |
Yes I’d say that is correct Lalitk that the Frey 2’s offer 85% of the performance of the Valhalla 2’s. Maybe even 90%. So yes from that perspective, a good value. One point about the Transparent’s. They are "calibrated" by Transparent for your particular amp. My demos came from Transparent after being calibrated for my Diablo 300. Not sure exactly what they are calibrating when they do this - probably impedance. If you change your gear, Transparent will re-calibrate your cables for free, for life. If you are an audiophile and value transparency above all else, of the cables I tested the Transparent’s are for you (they are also engaging and enjoyable as well). If you are an audiophile and value musical engagement above all else, then the Valhalla 2’s are for you with their satisfying warmth, drive, and quickness. They just make the music come alive way more than anything else I’ve heard. And if you want the highest value, then the Frey 2's are a great choice. The only loser in this test, unfortunately (and unexpectedly), is Audioquest. Maybe due to my gear or my tastes. |
Also regarding budget - unfortunately my original budget topped out at the cost of the Valhalla 2 speaker cables only - not the power cord as well. And, I have a new (but burnt in with 425 hours on it) AQ Hurricane which unfortunately I’m now dissatisfied with, outside of its excellent bass. Will have to sell. Might have to save up a bit for the Valhalla 2 + power cord, as now that I’ve heard it, I don’t think I can live without! I keep being thankful I’ve not tried Odin 2.... Either way, I'm set on the Valhalla 2 combo. I did try mixing and matching the Frey / Valhalla’s. I found that the increase in performance (which was moreso with Valhalla power / Frey speaker than the other way around) provided more openness of mid and upper tones with more space around the tones. But the difference was not large enough to justify the cost. If I went Frey 2 I’d go all Frey 2. The more significant jump in performance comes when you go full Valhalla 2. That last 10-15% in performance takes it from a great sounding system to one that is transcendent. It is hard to believe that Odin 2 can go further, but others have validated this. Whitecamaros went on about how much of a positive difference the Odin 2 power cord on its own made. I've seen pro reviews say that Valhalla 2 is about 85% of what Odin 2 delivers, and if the jump is the same as what I found between the excellent Frey 2 and the Valhalla 2.... Well I can't even imagine that. The pro review I saw mentioned that most aspects of the Valhalla 2 are the same as with the Odin 2, other than the Odin 2 having a greater sense of openness. The funny thing is, I'd say exactly the same thing about the jump from Frey 2 to Valhalla 2. Frey 2 provides all the same frequency response and detail of the Valhalla 2, as well as offering the same overall sonic presentation, but Frey 2 is just a bit more closed in or compressed. Also Frey 2 may not have the same lightning quickness. This is not a criticism of the Frey 2, and not something you notice unless you listen to the Valhalla 2. |
Yeah really a good thing I haven’t heard those too..... I really didn’t start out looking for an integrated, but after getting one, with an integrated DAC, I appreciate the elegant minimalism vs a slew of boxes and even more cables. Just more elegant, and I don’t feel I gave up anything at all vs spending an equal amount on separates. In fact I think I got more vs separates at the same price, which is precisely why I ended up with the Diablo. Having said that yes Gryphon separates I imagine would be in another realm of performance..... |
Yes, I was surprised that I didn’t “max out” the performance of my speakers. Before my cable testing I thought that I may not hear that much of a difference between high end cables if my speakers (and source for that matter) were limiting performance rendering differences in cables irrelevant. But that appears to not be the way it works, as the differences were very, very noticeable between all cables I tested. There seems to be a problem with my Innuos order; the company does not seem able to ship their new streamers anymore. Also, online they stopped selling them. Seems they are having major issues with production of their new models. Dealer said they have quality issues on the faceplates (they are catching the issues in production QA before being released). Because of this, it may free up some funds to put towards my cable purchase. My back-ordered Innuos is the same dealer as Nordost which makes things easier. I know traditional theory says it makes sense to upgrade the source before cables... But you guys didn’t hear the difference the Valhalla 2’s made. I know upgrading from my Mac Mini will make a difference too, but I’ve not seen anyone reporting a difference on the scale I’m seeing with the Valhalla’s when they move to a dedicated streamer. Part of the reason I’m so stuck on this upgrade now is that it is not just an increase in performance. The overall sonic presentation just matches what I specifically am looking for. Perfect mid bass and mid range slam with great rhythm, warmth and presence, with very crisp detailed and open highs with high energy vocal presentation. With sibilants you get a pleasant “ssss” instead of a harsh “shhhh”. Just found out the power cord costs more than I thought! Not good. I may choose to go with the Nordost Reference jumpers instead of the expensive Valhalla 2 jumpers to save some cash. I will test the difference tonight as my dealer confirmed I can keep the demos one more day. |
Okay, with multiple individuals, on a HiFi equipment forum of all places where people discuss gear that costs more than cars, basically going “whoa dude, slow down, that’s too much money”, that is giving me a reason to be concerned :) As such I tried pairing the Transparent Reference power cord with the Valhalla 2 speaker wire. The Transparent cord is WAY less expensive than the Valhalla 2. And guess what, it worked! While I definitely heard a bit less space and breath around vocals, the bass and focus that was missing with the Valhalla 2 cord came back! And I still had the accessible warm sound from the Valhalla 2. I actually think I like the sound slightly better this way. I did not notice a difference switching between the “cheap” Nordost Reference and expensive Valhalla 2 jumpers, after switching back and forth a few dozen times and imagining I was hearing differences. Maybe I did hear some differences but I couldn’t quite pinpoint them. It is possible the much cheaper Reference jumpers were thinner in the mids, which made them seem like there was actually better separation of tones. Again not sure if I was imagining this.... So another place I can save. Finally, I did one last test of my Audioquest Hurricane cord vs the Transparent Reference cord to further pinpoint what I don’t like about the Hurricane. In short I found the Hurricane to be a bit bloated by comparison. Bass not as tight, upper frequencies were missing, and there was a slight accentuation in the mids that can be annoying. |
So unexpectedly Thecableco may be shipping me a demo of the Audience au24sx cables, which I didn’t think was possible as I am in Canada. These cables along with the Clarus Crimson’s are the only two cables left that I’d really like to try before committing to the Transparent/Nordost combo. Seeing as it seems I will get to test the Audience cables, I think I need to find a way to demo the Clarus Crimson’s... |
Hi 4425, wow, you described the EXACT same experience I had comparing the Valhalla 2’s vs others. I didn’t phrase it that way but you are spot on describing the slightly forward presentation while still being warm and musical but with less bass. I found that replacing the Valhalla 2 power cord with other power cords while keeping the Valhalla 2 speaker cables completely solves the bass issue, at the expense of losing a hair of detail in the mids and high frequencies. I am now testing a few more cables from TheCableCo - Audience au24 SX as I mentioned, and at their recommendation Synergistic Research Atmosphere Euphoria X. With these two sets including matching power cords, I will also be testing one power cord model up from both brands. Synergistic is interesting as they said they (TheCableCo) have first hand experience with it being paired with Gryphon at shows. And, it is quite interesting in that you can tune the shielding with different attachments to change to a cool, balanced, or warm presentation. Also it only costs $200 more to upgrade to biwire. For Clarus Crimson it may be difficult for me to test. I found a dealer who can help, but Clarus told him I’d need to buy the cable, at list price, and then return it. This is not a problem in itself, but as I’m in Canada I’d need to pay import duty. If I return it, I don’t know that I’d get back the import duty. Not to mention, I’d lose the 5% deposit from TheCableCo for borrowing their cables and then not purchasing from them. To to make matters a bit more complicated, Clarus told my dealer their pricing is going up by 50% June 1st as they have not raised prices in 5 years. So while I’d really like to test Clarus it may be too difficult. |
Thanks All, I am definitely taking everyone’s input into consideration. The Valhalla’s are actually quite a bit lower than why Larry quoted after the dealer discount. Also I only need 6ft per side so that helps. But due to input from others I am being cautious and testing more cables from Audience and Synergistic, to see if I can achieve the same result at a lower cost. Like I said up-front, all cables cost too much! But maybe the Valhalla 2 prices are a bit too much. Hopefully I will get good results with the other options. I still have the AudioQuest Firebird biwire demos and have been listening more to them. Which are actually the priciest combo I’ve tested, in the biwire configuration way more than Valhalla 2 in single wire configuration. Which is not a fair price comparison but just to show that more dollars doesn’t translate directly to improved sound. The AudioQuest cables are capable but I just can’t get past the feeling of sluggishness and lack of high frequency openness.... Also they are far and away the most difficult to work with of any cable I’ve tried. They are big and unwieldy. |
I would really like to test the Gryphon power cord and cables. My dealer said that wasn’t possible. Guessing Gryphon’s NA distributor is not able or willing to facilitate the demo. Maybe I’ll try contacting the distributor directly. But I’m not holding my breath on being able to try these in North America. Gryphon is one of the handful of companies that are equally respected for their source and amplifier components as well as their transducers. So it is reasonable to assume they make good cables too. |
Also, regarding the Tyr 2, I’d probably just go for the Valhalla 2 over Tyr 2, if I was already about to spend that much. But hoping the Audience will come through and be what kind an looking for at a lower price when I get to test. Im also thinking of just going ahead with the Clarus Crimson purchase, with the ability to return. Yes I will need to pay import duty and taxes, but after researching I found I can get these fees back from Canada but I need to submit a form and prove I returned the goods. Pain in the butt but I feel like I won’t have evaluated all possibilities otherwise. And, the Clarus cost is going way up on June 1st. |
Inna, The N.A. Gryphon distributor replied to my email in minutes and indicated they will coordinate getting demo Gryphon Power Cords and Speaker cables to my dealer for me to test. Do you know the list price of the Gryphon cords, by chance? They have their upper Reference line and also their lower-end Headline series. Hoping the Reference line is about the same cost as the other stuff I'm testing. |
rshad, yes more tests are coming but not 100% sure when yet. So here are the latest developments: -After trying to line up tests of the Clarus Crimson cables (purchase with 100% money back return policy) from a US-based dealer, I realized the total price including taxes and duty was going to be more than double the cost of buying it directly through the Clarus NA distributor. The Clarus dealer actually suggested that at that price I should just buy it blind. So against my (and everyone else's) better judgement, that's what I did. I am going to treat it like a lottery - if it ends up working out, then I just "won" a few thousand bucks. If it doesn't work out, well, I can sell and lose probably a bit. But my purchase price is less than 50% what it should be, I believe because I am buying directly from a distributor rather than a dealer. As I said above, while this isn't the wisest approach the odds are pretty good these will work well, as NO ONE has ever said anything bad about these across a wide variety of gear. And many prefer these from the WAY more pricey Nordost offerings. So we'll see. Will take 200 hours to burn in however. -I am nevertheless going to continue with my demo test of the Audience au24 SX cables, from thecableco. I can always find something else from them to put my 5% deposit (that they require for the demos) towards, if I prefer the Clarus. I know this isn't the wisest approach, but the Clarus were such a deal that this isn't the end of the world if it doesn't work out. I should indicate that I'm still debating what to do about the power cord - whether to purchase one or not. |
Thanks! Will be finding out the ETA on the Clarus cables shortly. I ended up ordering the power cord as well, as it is just too cheap to pass up. Weird how this loophole allows me to buy direct from the distributor at prices dealers get - I think it is because there no Clarus dealers in Canada, but there IS a Clarus distributor based here. Eye-opening how much the dealer markup is, but not a surprise. Dealers aren't selling daily to a large base of consumers, so they need to make margins to keep doors open. In the end it is as if I am getting a discount of more than 60% lower than list price, on a cable loom that is supposedly comparable (and some say preferable) to cables costing $15-20K. Not to mention Clarus dealers were just notified of the massive (50%) price increase on Clarus products that takes effect June 1st. Worst case scenario, if I like the Audience (or other) cables better, I can sell the Clarus used and hopefully not lose too much thanks to my significant discount, and thanks to the price hike next week. |
The Frey 2’s were actually delivered a highly enjoyable and satisfying presentation at a fraction of the price. However I did perceive a noticeable lack of midrange clarity and air with the Frey 2’s vs the Valhalla 2’s. And a hair less speed with the Frey 2’s, but the Valhalla 2’s are know for being stupidly fast. Whether that difference is worth the cost is up to the listener I guess. For me, I can’t be happy with the Frey’s knowing they are filtering out some of what my Diablo 300 is capable of delivering, even to my fairly modest speakers! |
I've been waiting until my Clarus Crimson cables and power cord have completed 200 hours of burn-in to share my thoughts. I'm at 185 hours currently.... The last 15 hours are proving difficult as I have guests staying (including my infant nephew) over the next week. Some say volume doesn't matter for burn in, just provided there is current flow, but in my opinion I don't think anyone truly understands what is occurring during burn-in or whether volume matters or not. So I am waiting until I can play at least at a moderate volume - it is going slowly now! While I've read that these cables sound terrible before 200 hours, to the extent that some reviewers thought something was wrong with their stereo, that was not my experience at all. While they sounded great at 0 hours, I did notice a very noticeable "papery" quality to the upper mid/lower treble. It made high-hats sound very, very different - very meaty sounding. Didn't sound bad, but just not natural. After the first 24 hours this effect was entirely gone. At 185 hours, these cables sound phenomenal, especially for the price I paid for them. The difficulty is, too much time has passed and I can only base my judgement on what I currently hear, and comparing with how I recall the other cables I tested earlier in this thread sounded. I'll start with what I currently hear without comparisons. First thing that stands out is how fluid the entire frequency spectrum is - everything is smoothly integrated, yet tones are still distinct and separate. The second thing that stands out is how free flowing and effortless these cables sound. The third is how great the soundstaging is - instruments are big and well-formed across what seems to me to be a wider than normal soundstage. This was noticeable right out of the box, but after extended burn-in, an amazing depth of soundstage emerged too. These cables are also very easy to listen to - no harshness, not analytical, and this is across all sorts of music that has a tendency for harshness on some equipment. Sibilants produce a pleasing sssss versus a harsh shhhhhh. I've read that these cables are made with multiple types of copper that are each optimized for different frequencies - maybe this accounts for the overall smoothness and free-flowing effect. Now, I'll attempt to compare against what I remember in my favorite pairing from my last barrage of tests, the Transparent Reference power cord with the Nordost Valhalla 2 speaker cables. Please take some of this with a grain of salt, as I mentioned the prior tests were some time ago now. First the speaker cables: The Clarus speaker cables are smoother, more integrated, more natural. The Clarus' soundstage was also very, very impressive and I think topped the Valhalla 2's, in both horizontal positioning and also depth. The Valhalla 2's were more forward with the midrange (while still being warm at the same time - which I really liked), and were faster than anything I'd heard. The Valhalla 2's had a hair more detail, this I am absolutely sure of based on listening to a specific passage in a song I use to test detail retrieval. In the end both speaker cables were very pleasing to listen to, and both had areas they performed better in than the other. I could be happy living with either. While I really do enjoy the forward-yet-warm mids of the Valhalla 2's, I do wonder if eventually I might think this is too much of a good thing. But I really, really enjoyed that effect as it made music very satisfying to listen to.... But the Valhalla 2's cost almost $15K more than what I paid for the Clarus Crimson's (which I managed to get at a steal of a price buying direct from a distributor), so, that's a factor for sure. It is very possible that if I heard them side by side I would lean towards the Valhalla 2's more. I guess I will never know, because right now I am very happy with the Clarus Crimson's. The integration and perfect balance of tones is just magical at times. On to the power cords: This is where things start to get different. I think the Transparent Reference power cord offered more solid, well defined, and detailed bass than the Clarus Crimson power cord. It is also possible that the slight missing detail I noted above is actually attributed to switching from the Transparent Reference power cord to the Clarus Crimson power cord, and is not related to the speaker cables. I'm totally happy with the current full Clarus Crimson combination, but when I get around to it I think I may want to get a demo Transparent Reference XL power cord to see how the bass and detail change - I have a pretty strong suspicion this combo will be a good pairing based on my prior results. In the meantime, I'm very happy with the sound, with a bit more burn in to go! My Gryphon Diablo 300 sounds fabulous with these cables. Highly recommended, and great value for money (as far as cables go I suppose), but if you consider the Clarus Crimsons I'd suggest experimenting with the power cable as I feel like there are gains to be had there going to a different cord. I read a pro review that seemed to come to the same conclusion - they raved about the Crimson speaker cables, but had a bit of an average response to the power cord versus others. It's not bad, but with others you can have a bit more defined and solid bass and possibly more detail across the spectrum. One final point: I realized I didn't mention in this post that I have the bi-wire editions of the Clarus Crimson speaker cables. Not sure how much of a difference this makes, but because I was able to purchase these cables at over 60% below list price, I thought why not. |
After enjoying my system with a more reasonably priced Clarus Crimson bi-wire setup, I’m finally upgrading to the Nordost Valhalla 2’s and also possibly to a Transparent XL power cord to my Diablo 300 amp (I will test the power cord first). the Clarus Crimson biwire speaker cables are really great and I highly recommend them. Quite musical in that they are not analytical or sterile, good bass and soundstaging. They might be a bit on the slow side, and could be a tad too “polite”. Nonetheless I’d still put them at the top of the list for anyone considering speaker cables at this level or even above.
|
@jafant , thanks for asking. I closed this off in related threads (Shunyata Omega QR vs AudioQuest Dragon HC), but I’ll summarize here. First, Transparent may make great cables but both Shunyata and AudioQuest I found to be WAY more customer focused with unbelievably prompt and friendly responses. Beyond my expectations. Not so much with Transparent. Both AudioQuest and Shunyata had new top of the line power cords for me to try with no commitment whatsoever to purchase, simply because they had no demos currently available. Transparent refused to do this and had no demos of the Opus cord I wanted to try. Shunyata in particular - Richard - super friendly, helpful, and approachable. In the end I thought both The Dragon HC and the Omega QR were equally good - albeit VERY different. The Dragon had a bit more energy and bass engagement, with a drier sound. The Omega QR had this lush, exquisitely smooth sound that immersed you in a more “luxurious” jungle of a soundstage. I could easily be happy with the sound of either cord depending on my mood or what I’m listening to. Both cords had awesome detail retrieval with a great front to back depth to the sound. This shootout I think was unique for me as all shootouts I’ve done before yielded a clear winner in terms of sound. Not so in this case. But in the end I went with the Dragon HC because the Omega QR didn’t create a snug connection with my Diablo 300 amplifier. The Omega QR comes with a tacky plastic shim to tighten the fit. I expect they do this in order to make the plug smaller to accommodate a certain brand of equipment? Who knows, but even with the shim it was a loose connection with my amp and it would easily disconnect with the slightest nudge. It’s possible that it is my Gryphon amp’s fault and not the cord, but I don’t have this issue with the Dragon. So that is where I ended up on power cords. I am continuing to enjoy my Valhalla 2’s every bit as much. Except they made my system more revealing and exposed my AC power noise that goes away late at night! That launched me on a quest to solve this. Currently testing an Audioquest Niagara 5000 and also considering the 7000 or a Torus RM20. And going all out and installing dedicated lines. And bought an Innuos PhoenixNET isolation switch (shipping now). And an Innuos PhoenixUSB reclocker. And finally, a used perfect condition pair of B&W 802 D2’s (Shipping now)…. Good thing I sold my car and a whole slew of things I don’t care much about to pay for all of this… Just need to complete the electrical work and figure out the conditioner and that is it! Oh yeah, and very likely two Nordost Valhalla 2 USB cables - I have demos being mailed to me shortly! After all the upgrades I realized that the generic USB cables that came with my Innuos reclocker easily beats my Audioquest Diamond USB cables. High frequencies are far less open with the Diamonds. I don’t think I could hear this difference when my system was less resolving. That will be it because I will have used up all the money I made from selling stuff! Totally worth it though. Took many years to pinpoint the sound I was looking for and I think I’ve figured things out, finally. I couldn’t live with most gear out there even if it was free, most stuff just sounds not quite right to me. There is no harshness or tonal issues in my system to compensate for. Now it’s simply a matter of making everything as revealing as possible, and that’s it. Really happy with all the recent upgrades and it’s made such a massive difference. The speakers will arrive last… |