High end high quality int. amp for low level listening

More efficient and higher impedance speakers make a lot more sense than a more powerful amp. 

^How^?
At 60 dB they are not stressing the amplifier, and unless that 60dB goes to 80dB SPL, then there is no great reason to add more watts, nor to add more sensitivity.
And if it sound good, then why change anything?

That said the Pass, and some of the others, would be nice to have… but they do not seem to be “required”.

At 60 db liwstening level , you are only using less than 20 watts ...if that.

He said:

It's known that the speakers are power hungry as they rated at 86db sensitivity and 4 ohm impedance 

So 1 W would make 86 dB. maybe they are 3 meters away so they drop to 76 dB and add in the second speaker and they are at 79dB.
That is still 10 dB higher than “somewhere in the 60 dB range”, so he is arguably using closer to 1/10W.So I am failing to see how sensitivity or [power is what the OP needs?


However this is a good point:

What you need is an integrated with loudness control, for low level listening and still get the punch. 

Something like that makes more sense. Those recommendations for a more sensitive speaker or a higher powered amp still have me scratchin’ my head!

Yeah…
And I’d be interested in what DACs you’re choosIng from.

@holmz Thank you for your wise words. You remind me of person called 'jan.vigne'. He was a very knowledgeable hones and rational person active on stereophile and ecoustics forums (but sadly not here).

Well please send Jan my apologies for besmirching his/her fine name.

• What country are you in?
  
• What are you top 3-6 song you like?
  
• What are you top 3-6 books you like?
  

These are dictated by the laws of physics.

(Does the quanta of an electron get bigger in bigger amplifier?)

@realworldaudio tbh i wasn't aware that higher power amps have lower resolution on low level listening. Can you name any specific integrates that have great resolution on low level listenings?

I would suggest some questioning of the factualness, and proof of various claims, would not be a wasted question for you to ask.

I do not want to come across as too harsh, but it is a low probability that all these solutions can exist simultaneously as optimum solutions.
(You have been told so far):

1. To use more sensitive speakers
   
2. More powerful amplifier
   
3. Use a less powerful amplifier
   
4. Use Subs
   
5. Use tone controls and loudness controls.

If it loud enough now, then we can exclude #1, #3 immediately. #2 we could exclude with a volt meter or an oscilloscope… Or I previously excluded it using just a pencil. 

At least three people mentioned tone and loudness controls for low level listening. Does your current amp/preamp have that?
There is a lot of info on the net about tone controls and Fletcher Munson curves.

That puts the #4 (sub) as potentially having some merit if it was I used as a way to have tone control.

If you are happy with it (which you said you were in the opening), then doing nothing is a pretty safe bet, and it is in between having an amp with more power and less power.

That leave #5 (tone controls), via a preamp, as being the only thing to look at that has any rational basis in fact.

The other reason to change things would be purely emotional. That is not bad, it is just not reasoned.

The pathos integrated is a great, very smooth sounding amplifier and likely has the required power for the OP's circumstance.

I am still trying to work out the OP and their circumstance…



I listened to some music today at 65, 75 and 85 dB. It all sounded good, but the lower 65 dB could use some tone control.

having subs in the mix will lessen the load on the amp and allow lesser sensitivity

How big of a concern is the load on the amp, when the SPL is in the 60s of decibels?

Maybe you’re right. But there would have to be a reason why the sounded better.

It could also be the Fletcher Munson is getting somewhat adjusted with speaker that has more low and high end than the other set?
It would be interesting to see REW curves for those two sets @dcevans That assumes that both amps don’t have a loudness correction feature.

The speakers are linear, so it is not like the more sensitive set comes off the blocks faster, other wise they would be non linear at low volume levels… and also they would then be non-linear with small changes in signal level. One would have to make them sticky or something like that, as the motor force is a linear product of current and magnet flux strength. The main non-linear part with a speaker, I think, is compression.

That TABLE 1 in section B right on page 1 says that the the high efficiency are the lest linear.

Are harmonics at play that make them sound better when playing low?

I was kind of interested in seeing if anyone has a firm grasp on what makes for a system that sounds great at low volume. It has puzzled me for a long time. From the answers, it doesn’t sound like anyone else does. I have a fuzzy idea.

I suspect that this @dil fellow might:

Or install an equalizer.

If one had measurements of SPL versus frequency then that could be a start.

Would a Lyngdorf TDAI 1120 work?

Just to be clear, only in an 8 Ohm load does 2.83 volts = 1 watt. In a 4 Ohm load 2.83 volts = 2 watts. The OPs speakers are 86 dB SPL (2.83 V/1m) @ 4 ohm.

Yeah that is correct, but we still get the +3 dB from the other side playing at the same time…  so we are back at 86 dB.

The main point is that 66 dB is -20 dB from 86dB.

So it is like 10mW RMS… maybe a bit more if the R^2 is higher, but definitely under 0.1W… in any case, I cannot see how “more power” could be the right answer.

It would be interesting of the OP has access for demo’ing some amps.