Hear my Cartridges....🎶

^^  Halcro. Yes indeed ! Now I would like to take this opportunity to introduce you the good old SHURE Ultra 500 cartridge ... Because that´s exactly what SHURE managed to achieve in their V15V-MR design and that goal culminating in the SHURE Ultra 500 in particular. No hint of `edginess´ and truly a more sophisticated HF presentation with more nuanced and yes a `warmer´ and if you like more `emotional´ (natural) sound. I discover that wonderful sound nearly thirty years ago : ) And sadly could not have managed to find a cartridge that could outperform my Ultra 500, in any aspect really, not to mention that HF area. I have AT-ART9 modern superb MC design, AT-ML180, Grace F-14/boron-MR, I had one special Dynavector... even that ASTATIC flag ship (Raul´s find) : ^)
And of course, the frequency response is linear with appropriate capacitance values, very low for the original beryllium cantilever and very high for modern SAS cantilever explained by David (dlaloum). And as David says, the Ultra sounds good everywhere, mediocre decks/arms and superlative TT compos/ designs `Ö´
Still, of course, the AT-ML180 is a superlative design with its miniature ML stylus tip giving a very low effective mass this is one of crucial things in the very finest cartridge designs, and this actually is the reason for the very best AT MM cartridge. Indeed this AT has a very neutral, very linear sound, and thus maybe even the most natural, for some people at least.

Halcro, I would gladly see an Ultra 500 in your collection hopefully in some day soon and hear your thoughts about ...

Very interesting thread indeed, keep them coming.

Best regards,

Henry, I haven´t tried a V15/III so far unfortunately but with a modern SAS stylus it would be greater that it originally was. This is not my experience but a friend´s who had the original III, as he wasn´t excited of its high register performance, likewise you discovered.

Can this `newborn´ III outperform the 500... as many audiophiles say the III is better than the IV and the V... Well not really, I´m afraid of. The Ultra series 500 w/ heavy metal body is a very special design and the 400 series also is a different design. And to remind all, to get the best out of MM carts one needs to have the right/most appropriate settings for capacitance and impedance values.
And in general, it´s all about how the music flows... this makes the very best cartridges when the music itself takes over, no listening fatigue you just can´t stop listening your records over and over again.

Henry, I thought so as your approach is usually scientific. Thanks for confirmation. Actually I feel sorry for the Raven as it now can´t give the best out of LOMCs : /

Henry, one question just to confirm the situation: are you listening all the cartridges on balanced mode trough XLR inputs ? I´d assume your great system is fully balanced from cartridge pins to power amps ?

Ah, Frogman now I get it: you use a linear tracker : ) Excellent. 
As for the reference and a reminder, really ; ) for the carts in question, I sold my ACUTEX M320 STR III (short nose, their finest according to some experts) but still have both Grace F-14, Ruby and Boron/ML, both for reasonable prices and only 10 - 100 hours use (grin) thanks to great Victor the Dealer here on A´gon (probably a Russian).

So I would like to hear Grace´s flagship (well, one of them at least) evaluated here someday please ...
What an interesting thread this is... keep them coming .....

^^ Exactly. This means you have so many cart/headshell/arm/deck combinations that is not easy to tell which combination suits best a certain cart, so actually there are several possibilities to choose. Halcro knows his system´s options and has carefully chosen the arms/decks for these evaluations and of course we totally trust him.
Furthermore, as for our home listening situations, probably ALL of us have DIFFERENT combinations of TTs. Not to mention phono preamps, amps and speakers, and cables and our environment. Everything is relative, in the end. So the best cartridge(s) are the best for the listener alone at his/her home, of course two persons may have the same opinion of a certain cart but that´s another thing. This is off-topic of course but true.

Anyway, his tests show the importance of the mighty Decca Reference, but the appropriate arm(s) needs to be chosen carefully. I know one arm that makes the Reference (and the Jubilee) sing but the cart is darn expensive I simply can´t afford it now, hopefully in the future. It has one disadvantage... unfortunately it´s a dust magnet in my system: /

And as for Decca recordings, the original UK pressings never let you down.

Thanks for the latest Decca Reference option, we much appreciate your enthusiasm : )

Very well then, Frogman. That darn cart costs a minor fortune but it´s worth all the trouble, as reviewed by so many over the years. But when will this money-wasting hobby end ... I should have not started to read this thread at all ; )

Thanks Frogman, very very interesting review again and we much appreciate your insight.
Henry, I´m afraid your Empire is 100 kOhm impedance ? And what´s capacitance ?

Well, I noticed the MM/MI superiority (Shure´s flagship, to be exact and thanks to the SME III) over thirty years ago and have lived happily ever since... but I do occasionally give a try to vintage true quality MC carts such as the Highphonic MC R5 that I will evaluate very carefully with modern AT-ART9 in near future : )

Halcro´s experiment removes the gear dependent factor, that everyone has a different analog rig, amps, speakers etc. Halcro´s tool is a culmination of carefully selected components from his experience during the decades. IMHO -Ö- this thread has surpassed the famous MM thread because it´s based on a scientific method that can be observed online in real time by all who have modern computer technologies available.
I personally don´t use that technology (I´m an old hat ;^_ ) and cannot say anything about the carts here in question really but I do take seriously what enthusiasts and musicians/music lovers with decades of experience like Frogman says about.

Keep them coming Henry .....

Wait a minute. My AT-ML180 doesn´t sound that bad. Probably because of its special design with ceramic top and miniature stylus tip it may very well be extremely sensitive to where it´s attached ? Mine has a thin layer of damping sheet between top and aluminium wand and this slightly improves SQ. I´m sure that it will perform better, sound balance and high register presentation with an other headshell/wand. Additionally, IME AT´s best models benefit from very low capacitance and impedance values, I use 120 pF and 33 kOhm. What are your setting now Henry ?  Furthermore, in general on that sensitive level even different samples may have subtle differences ?
Its overall performance is not the finest of cartridges that I have heard though.

Excellent, those are appropriate values. Actually I knew you are aware of correct (lower) values... We discussed this many years ago in the infamous MM thread and that caused some stir for some people as it just recently had become a hype using very high impedance values : )
Hypes come and hypes go... Great times. Thanks again for confirmation. 

Don´t get me wrong, I just found my ML-180 outperforming all the MM AT´s I have tried over the years, hence my expression bad. The same goes for my statement about TOTL ACUTEX models, they are superb performers as you have discovered too.  But not magical IME. And there may very well be a subtle difference between the samples. 

That X-1IIE with titanium pipe cantilever and Shibata stylus ?

Frogman, many years ago I had the AT-ANV150 and it truly was excellent, very very balanced sound, the high register in particular, one of the very finest I have experienced. But it lacked something in the mid range, detail and nuances. I never went excited with so after a hundred hour play I decided to sell it, for a good price.

But it was better than my AT-ML180 in the high register. I started to wonder why that AT´s flagship w/ a very special stylus tip and ceramic top lacks finesse in high frequency area... maybe there was something wrong with my set-up. Finally I thought that ML180 may benefit from extra damping and it did, as seen here:

https://ucarecdn.audiogon.com/e830b57c-0609-4c78-bca4-d41b9402cbda/-/autorotate/yes/

Now its high register is the same league as ANV150´s. Still, however it lacks the magic I have heard with certain others.

My buddy in Norway has covered the whole body of his DECCA Jubilee with that damping material, he says that makes a huge difference : )
Image a dark gray blanket on the Jubilee, looks so funny but not for everyone´s taste : )
So both AT-ML180 and the Jubilee benefit from extra damping in certain systems. And it´s a well known fact that the DECCA carts need well damped arms.

The AT-ANV150 will fit your system just fine, I believe. Also Audio-Technica´s latest technology VM760 is worth to try:
https://www.audio-technica.com/cms/cartridges/6637a2f0787470c3/index.html

Excuse my ignorance, what´s that ` Ö` beautiful edition/pressing exactly ?

Halcro, excellent as always ! That´s a great find ! Looks like beryllium... As you have many beryllium carts can you confirm the material ?? This is extremely important. Thank you

Yes of course the MFG-610LXs top them all, I´ve known that for two yrs now, you see I have the former 1980´s edition 610LX w/ boron and it sounded awesome out of the box (was NOS). Fantastic cartridge in my system, top 5 "MM".
My first GLANZ was MFG-310LX (in early 80´s) and also great, the best thing I remember it had no listening fatigue. Now I must point that the former 31L is inferior and mediocre indeed. 51L is still quite enjoyable, tracks Telarc cannons with ease but nothing magical though.
Seems that the darn Palladian is still a few steps ahead ; )

Me ? I´m just lawnmover and not good at computers, I´m an old hat : ^¨. To be honest, I don´t trust those machines. Btw, without Isaac Asimov´s Three Laws of Robotics the computers and eventually robots will take over, maybe sooner than later; some experts say that we already have lost our control over technology that eventually will enslave mankind. How cares about some unknown author who died exactly 27 yrs ago. Certainly those who are in power are not thinking about Asimov´s Laws ! Let alone Einstein´s or Hawking´s ideas and guidance.

And I have a life outside the internet and activities like marital responsibilities, and in my restricted spare time I´d rather listen some music than argue in dull and endless conversations about divergence of outcome audio quality levels in different Hi-Fi stereo systems especially with besserwissers. And I´m really not good at in social media either. To be honest, just lately I´ve been listening a spectacular vintage cartridge that probably and "seemingly" outperforms all GLANZ models, no matter what styli they may have, it´s just in other performance level. But that of course is a different subject and off-topic.

However, I may have some crucial information of the relatively interesting subject in question. I live in a different GLANZ bubble unlike some others (?), you see I´ve been living in the MGF-XXX bubble all my audio life ; )
Indeed I had an audio life decades ago, my first true HQ cartridge was namely the GLANZ MFG-310LX w/ Line Contact stylus which I bought ... if my memory serves me right late 1984 ... wait a moment ... something came to my mind ...

Meanwhile you could see this more closely and judge yourselves (I still can copy and paste): https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/GLANZ-610LX-Moving-Flux-Phono-Cartridge-/132994137794?ul_noapp=true&n... I asked the seller if this has original manual but he said no. What a pity.

All wrong. Wrong song and I did not buy that MFG-610LX, just asked the seller about box & papers.

Back to square one: 24.11.1985 I bought the GLANZ MFG-310LX w/ solid diamond Line Contact and tapered aluminium (alloy perhaps ?) cantilever.
I remembered correctly that I may still have my MFG-310LX and found it :_). I gave it to my brother who gave it back circa 1990, he had stopped buying records and finally gave up vinyl. It has been in a chest of drawers all these years, in a jewel box. I cleaned the stylus and tried it, suspension is still strong but the sound is quite lame and not so accurate anymore. The stylus may simply have started to wear out as I had played it more than 400 hours + odd hours my bro payed ( I keep record all the carts I play). Ýes I´m sure the stylus profile has worn out. What a pity. The 310LX cantilever is more refined (app 2 times thinner) than 31L´s. And its sound is obviously better, well naturally.

Later in 1986 I was thinking of buying either the SHURE V15V-MR or GLANZ MFG-610LX, both highly acclaimed in the Hi-Fi magazines here. Both "hyped" equally and eventually I decided to go for the SHURE, 5.11.1986.
Steve Howe raves about the 1970´s, as the most adventurous time in music but the 1980´s was fantastic time for Hi-Fi cartridge manufacturing s, so bravo the 1980´s !
And now I have also the mid eighties GLANZ MFG-610LX, after all these years. And I confirm it´s a superb performer for high output cartridge, IME.

I hereby confirm that the earlier edition of the 610LX has a tube boron cantilever, so boron also w/ the 61´s, and a solid diamond Line Contact stylus. Yes indeed, according to the manual MFG-610LX as the most prestige model among GLANZ MF cartridges, employs tube Boron cantilever in order to achieve maximum efficiency at the electromagnetic mechanism.
FR 20 - 20,000 Hz +/- 1.5 dB or less, comp. 45/10 dyne, VTF 1,5 +/- 0,25 g.
According to the manual, the MFG-71L series are highly sophisticated cartridges ... Also, the sharply tapered cantilever with ultra thin end, reduces the mass of effective stylus-tip and increase its strenght. So it seems to me, quite literally in fact that the peculiar Pyramidian aluminium (alloy ?) cantilevers in 71L and 51L are hollow. Otherwise they would be ridiculous.
FR 20 - 20,000 Hz +/- 1.0 dB or less, comp. 50/12 dyne, VTF 1,25 +/- 0,25 g.

So the 71L has the best "specs", in theory. I´ve never heard an MFG-71L though, but might be interested to try one.
Now, if Halcro´s MFG-610LX has beryllium cantilever it is different than mine and Chak´s.
As for the miniature stylus tip in PH, naturally it is the finest of all GLANZ styli. However, it may be a marginal feature in sound quality. I´m referring to the analogy in AT-ML180 and AT-ML170 styli, both of which I have owned. And I confirm that the ML180 is marginally better than ML170 in my system, no more no less. Unfortunately the MFG 61 is discontinued and a mission impossible to find in decent condition .....

Let´s hope Halcro´s sample has a beryllium or perhaps a titanium cantilever, and that can be confirmed some day soon.
The later edition MFG-610LX may very well be the finest sounding GLANZ ever.
So bravo diversity !

Carry on and enjoy your darlings.

Morning Henry,
Now you have new beryllium cantilever (that Grace Level II above) and new boron cantilever GLANZ MFG-610LX that NOS from Japan. Could you tell which one is lighter or darker in colour ? Is boron darker ?

Henry, thanks for illustrating the colour subject. It seems to me that your "later stock" GLANZ MFG 610LX has a tube boron cantilever likewise does mine from mid eighties and beryllium was probably never used. As the original GLANZ MFG 61 is long ago discontinued the MFG 610LX is "the most prestige model among the GLANZ MF cartridges" and it does sound excellent as I´m currently revisiting my sample.
Many audiophiles praise the Grace F-9 Ruby as the best sounding of the F-9 series, I have read over the years in many Hi-Fi forums...

Henry, you are right. I meant "hollow" tube. Both my sample from mid eighties and your "later" stock have hollow tube boron cantilevers. Seems to me that they are exactly the same cartridges, and therefore namely the MFG-610LX may very well be the finest sounding cartridge GLANZ ever produced. For me there´s no mystery anymore. Truly great find.
As for the Grace, the more expensive models usually are better in sound quality... like the Grace F-14 series :__ )

Dover, does your MFG 61 have a rod boron cantilever unlike MFG 610LX ´s hollow tube boron ? And what´s the compliance, is it much higher ? You mean its frequency response is flatter ?
The finer stylus shape of MFG 61 does make a difference indeed. And all these factors together make a difference for sure. But what is the end result, in different TT/TA combos really matters. In your system the MFG 61 wins, so good for you.
Your reference is Dynavector Nova 13D, have you tried the new Nova 17D3 ?

Seems to me that Chak´s sample has a rod cantilever. I was surprised when I firstly saw that huge glue drop on the cantilever, I had never seen anything like that before. Does your sample also have a big glue drop ? Why it´s so big I´m not quite sure of its purpose ? It just adds stylus effective tip mass. I can´t see any traces of glue in my MFG 610LX.
If the 61 has a solid rod cantilever then 610LX´s stylus/cantilever ass´y is lighter and therefore a more sophisticated design. Its compliance is 45 (static)/10 (dynamic 100 Hz) according to the manual. As we know, all these small differences could make a big difference, especially in these higher quality performance levels.
How do they compare to each other in sound quality is another thing, in different systems.
Some Dynavector fans prefer the new Nova 17D3, others the XV1-t. Very interesting.

Dover, I just noticed that there´s a new kid in town: the Karat 17DX
Interesting review here:
https://totallywired.nz/analogue/the-dynavector-karat-dv17dx-moving-coil-cartridge/
"A ruler flat frequency from 100 Hz to 30 kHz under +/- 0.5 dB" and right up to 100 kHz, and that very short and extremely rigid cantilever.
From solely a technical point of view the latest Karat 17D is a very interesting cartridge design indeed... and quite a tempting one ...

Thank you Frogman, we really appreciate your input. Do you have your own samples of Palladian and DLR and what is your turntable ?

Your comparisons are interesting to us as well. That TT/TA combo is a great tool for evaluating these two super cartridges, I´d assume that you may try them some day soon... unless you have better already.
So yes I would be interested to hear what is the best cartridge that you have listened in your system so far ?

Frogman and Cleeds, thanks for your input. I´ve known the MC Sigma Genesis 2000 and its reputation for thirty years and it´s a bargain as the prices for used are quite low today. A Colibri is another superb cart to try in my system but in this price range I´ll go for a Soundsmith FC.
A thin walled hollow beryllium cantilever has a very low moving mass, that ML140HE´s is probably 0.20 mg. Is the HE referring to hyper elliptical stylus btw ? Anyway, interesting to hear the statements about ...

Yes indeed in the glorious 80´s we had hollow beryllium cantilevers with very low moving mass. The finest of SHURE was ULTRA 500´s 0.165 mg and ULTRA 400´s 0.195 mg which is an improved version of the ML140HE.

Found this:
An estimated list of Shure cartridge rankings, best first, rankings based on tip moving mass and trackability, magnetic core type and stylus shape:

1. Ultra 500 (V15 Type V-MR modified for lower moving tip mass of 0.165mg)
2. V15 Type V-MR, Ultra VST-V (as per Type V, MR tip)
3. V15 Type V (HE tip, beryllium tube cantilever, tip mass 0.17mg)
4. V15 Type V-G (as per Type V, conical tip)
5. V15VxMR (similar trackability, beryllium tube cantilever and MR tip shape to V15 Type V-MR, but non-laminated core, so eddy currents in the core will mean a less-flat high frequency response, tip mass 0.17mg)
6. Ultra 400 (ML140HE body with MR tip, laminated core, beryllium tube cantilever, tip mass 0.19mg)
7. ML140HE (laminated core, beryllium tube cantilever, HE tip)
8. VST-III, V15 Pro/S, Realistic V15-RS (same body as V15VxMR, HE tip, beryllium tube stylus)
   
9. V15 Type IV-MR (the MR tip was a later upgrade for the Type IV stylus)
10. V15 Type IV (laminated core, telescopic aluminium tube cantilever with beryllium stub, HE tip, tip mass 0.29mg)
11. V15 Type IV-G (as per Type IV except with conical tip)
12. Ultra 300 (same body as Ultra 400, ML140HE and ML120HE, telescopic aluminium tube cantilever, MR tip, tip mass 0.3mg)
13. ML120HE (laminated core, telescopic aluminium tube cantilever, HE tip)
14. V15 Type III-MR (as per Type III, but later upgraded with MR tip stylus)
15. V15 Type III-HE (as per Type III, but later upgraded with HE tip stylus)
16. V15 Type III (laminated core, aluminium tube cantilever with beryllium stub, elliptical tip, tip mass 0.33mg)
17. V15 Type III-G (as per Type III, but with conical stylus)

All of the above cartridges, except for the Type III models, have Shure’s Dynamic Stabiliser brush, which damps tonearm/cartridge resonance, short circuits record static electricity to ground, and removes dust from ahead of the stylus.

All in all, it´s just such a pity that Shure discontinued their better models.

Henry, didn´t I tell you ; ) Never got tired of listening ..... since spring 1989.
David (dlaloum) also knew it: "sounds good everywhere". Indeed.
Is your Ultra 500´s stylus holder brown or grey ?