Harbeth 40.3's. Should I buy them?

I'm a bit concerned that my 150wpc tube power may not be enough. On the other hand, the Allnic is not your typical tube amp. 

I just don't want to get my passion for this integrated in the way of finding synergy with speakers. 

I have no real expertise knowing is this integrated will move those big woofers with texture. Reviews have warned me of this. 

Looking around the forums, this version of Harbeth, absolutely rocks. I appreciate the first hand experience however.

Also, some reviewers seem to believe that these maybe best as near field monitors.

Thanks for the great responses. 

Allow me to expand on where I'm at with this purchase. For starters, the 40.3 XD is $13.6 used. Now it doesn't matter the price if they won't work in my room, with my electronics and the music we enjoy.

Listening to speakers for going on 6 decades, ya think I would have this figured out by now? And while I'm writing this on my iMac, behind it sits a pair of Spatial X3's that are currently for sale. Great speakers, open baffle (not my first OB speaker) with built-in subs. There's been one problem with these speakers. My wife admitted to me after I - on a whim - dropped a pair of Buchardt S400 MK II's into the audio room. She loved it and I was very impressed. Of course, the Buchardt's were being fed some very expensive gear, heck, the DAC costs nearly 10 times the speakers! 

My room is 15' X 19' with 7.5 ft ceiling. The back wall is nothing but built-in shelves with vinyl sitting in them. Bass traps on the front wall as well as acoustical treatments. Rock wool in one wall, an epic failure of the contractor who turned out to know nothing about building homes nor did he care.

My wife doesn't care what the speakers look like, she cares about what they sound like. If she plays a track and there's distortion, she'll tell you. If she doesn't get goosebumps with certain types of music, she'll tell you. If she can't play it loud, she'll tell you. She's brutal at audio shows. I'm not trading her in.

Seems like most if not all refer to the Harbeths as near-field speakers. Although we have great affection, I'm not sure if I want our heads to be stapled together although, in truth, they often are. Such is the stereo experience.

I think gimmer has good insight as he'd know just how powerful the T2000 is but still feels that solid state if best used with the 40.3's? Not everyone I've talked to felt that way but the general consensus is solid state is preferable. 

And as deadhead said, I'd probably add a sub for foundation, but now I'm getting ahead of myself.

It's sounding like I need to move away from this purchase.

I haven't found our audio room to pose any problems at all. That being said, I would like to REW to see if there are any serious nasties going on.

I've had 4 different pairs of speakers in that room.

Usher Tower XL

Spatial X3

Buchardt S400 MK II

Alta Audio Alec SE

The only speaker that did not work were the Alec's and I doubt it was the room.

Those are bad-ass looking speakers.

I would have 14 days to return them. I would lose on shipping costs, that's it.

Yes, I'm often losing my ass on audio purchases, even used, but I'm gaining experience and knowledge (like I know anything after 57 years in this hobby).

My room was built for audio. Size does not matter. 

The reason this speaker had piqued my interest was that it's a Harbeth, and seemingly a good deal if of course it worked and sounded amazing. It has to sound... amazing.

What I meant by writing "size does not matter" is that I'm not concerned with how big a speaker is in my room, only that it plays well.

And the consensus is that the 40.3 is simply too big for my room.

I'm thinking of the Devore Fidelity Silverbacks as a speaker that might work well. Or Legacy Audio Focus SE.

veroguy. These speakers have definitely piqued my interest. I've always respected Terry London's reviews. 

Tyler acoustics; I actually owed a pair, custom built by Tyler Acoustics. They were big and beautiful with custom outboard cross-overs that I could fine-tune. Couldn't get them to sound right in my room, no fault of the speakers. just lacked synergy in my world at that time.

decooney, TMR's sales guy owns the Harbeth 40 and thought it would work well in my room with my amp. It is too big of a purchase to go by one opinion and AG is the place to go for actual experience and knowledge.

I asked Allnic regarding the damping factor of the T2000. It is -4db. Which means nothing to me.

I have the Allnic T2000 30th Anniversary using the KT170's.

I've written a review on this integrated stating that its sound signature was more like a class A solid state amplifier, than a tube amplifier. It is not at all euphonic to our ears. With 150wpc in pentode, could it drive woofers with texture? I don't know. Maybe. Last night we were enjoying playing music immensely, listening to the little Burchardt's in my main listening room paired with the Allnic Integrated, the Allnic D10000 DAC and fed by a Pro-ject RS2-T transport. As I recall I started with Neil Young - Live at the Filmore with Crazy Horse, then Greendale, followed by Radiohead - The Bends, followed by Bach - Brandenburg Concertos then Sarah Brightman - Haram, then company arrived. Great session.

That listening session had artists that spanned a lot of years. Everything that was thrown at those speakers and they didn't flinch, rather, they dug into the recording and presented it musically. They did cheat a bit using a pair of Adam SW260 subs, small studio subs that always seem to integrate well with anything they've been asked to do. They're like a great session player, "hey where's that amazing bass player"? "Adam is over there".

So you might think well why not a pair of monitors and use the Adams or better yet, a pair of REL's? Because I Macgyver'd the subs into play by using the speaker tap's as an output signal to the subs stapling in a few resistors and bam - output. Probably illegal in the high-end audio community - I know I'm breaking some electronic rule.

Point is that I steer toward full range speakers because I'm not sure that my "Macgyvered" setup is long-lasting.

As far as finding speakers for a particular genre, I sort of agree as there are plenty of speakers that are great at playing a particular genre, well, like the Harbeth's, or the Harbeth's of yore, because the 40.3's have that modern sound... But yeah, I need the jack of all trades it seems.

I had the Wells Audio Innamorata Signature amplifier and their owner, forgot his name, really good guy over at the house one night. We compared his masterpiece (Innamotara) to what may still be the finest sounding amplifiers ever made, the Joule Electra VZN100's. The Joules ended up being the darling of that listening session but Inamorata gained huge respect from my audio clan that night. I would totally own that amplifier. But I'm not selling my Allnic. 

Some years ago after a visit to Siegfried's home, I bought his design, the LXmini which he was using in his system. You'd think he would have all this fancy gear but not, a cheap multi-channel HT amp, a miniDSP using a program he designed and the LXmini's. Amazingly spacious coherent sound emanated from those little guys. I still have the LXmini's and the miniDSP but I somehow lost the programming and the miniDSP forum refused to give it to me. Need to circle back on that.

I have 2 systems, The Burchardts upstairs fed by the Holo May KTE dac, Acoustic Invader FET pre, and powered by a BMC-S1 amplifier. Then my main Allnic rig.

Speakers are tunable to a room for sure. Our room plays pretty clean. I need to deal with the ceiling (the ceiling that was supposed to have rockwool in it) by adding absorbers but reflections haven't been bothersome as they have been mostly tamed.

Well, I owned the MBL 126's. I drove them with a Pass Labs 350.5. They sounded great. I would say the only issue with them is that we often play music loud that we put a strain on the standmounts. Now the 101E would work. Let's take up a collection. The along came the Dynaudio C1's. Driver failed, Dynaudio blamed on my amp. Too much dc or something like that. Yeah, my crappy Pass Labs amplifier was the problem. $500 dollars later and no more Dynaudio.

I like Vandersteen. Nearly bought a Quatro many years ago. I have to relook at that.

Last night my wife and I sat down on our listening couch and pictured the Big 40.3's, well out into the room. It's just not big enough as many have informed. So I have to move on from that. Dang.

Again, my wife cares about the sound. I care more about how they look than she does! I mean there are some ugly-looking speakers out there, let's be honest.

I'm playing the Buchardt's with 2 subs. They're my 'upstairs' speakers that found there way downstairs. They sound great in my 'main' system but ultimately, they are too small for the room and I don't wish to use subs unless for the very bottom of frequency. They're just not an appropriate speaker for north of $60K in electronics. But they sure do shine with all them beautiful watts. 

Tannoy's are beautiful. One could be happy just looking at them turned off. Would have to hear them in person, I probably have for all the audio shows I've attended.

Buchardt's right? They're killing me, I want to grow them in size, and no, not the active 700's.

I may give those Vandersteen Quatro CT's a try.

The X3's have built-in 15" powered subwoofers.

Some nice suggestions. Thank you all.

First, I'm not flush with cash. The Harbeths are $13.6K. But they won't work in my room.

My audio buddy told me the Vandersteen Quatro's CT's sounded lifeless and dull. I for one think he just had one of those at-a-show listening experiences.

I respect horns but doubt I could live with them. Well, there was one...

I like my X3's. They were 4 to 5ft from the front wall. Somehow though, my wife didn't. But she likes them upstairs in the big room. Those Buchardt's really through a monkey wrench at our system.

The X3 is not our first open baffle speaker. I built a pair of GR-Research Super V's. We really liked them! But after a while, the bass irritated me. The woofers sounded one note to me. I think we prefer a sealed cabinet' for all their warts.

Daedalus Audio makes some great speakers. Beautiful too. I'll check them out. Fyne Audio too but I can't hear all these speakers. I mean, there's a picture of a speaker. There are specifications. I just spent $1000 dollars listening to "great" speakers that sucked. At the end of the day, I'm haunted by line arrays. Lots of speaker drivers moving in unison but barely moving.

I was reading some reviews on the Legacy Audio Focus and Signature speakers. I mean, very complimentary reviews from what seemed to me anyway, legitimate audiophiles. Big speakers, lots of drivers, extremely well engineered, soundstage and transparency, bass to die for, and very efficient. Totally customizable to fit any room. What am I missing? 

Regarding the X3's, I shouldn't be running subs according to the manufacturer of my integrated. I currently use RCA's spades at one end and resistors on the other inside the RCA jacks. I do not have preouts on my integrated.  But I'm told that's a bad idea for many reasons. I need to stop that practice.

The foundation is really important to the music genres we enjoy. The reality starts to set in when I look at the 'big picture'. I picture a speaker with adjustable bass, woofers, preferably, almost certainly self-powered so that my tube integrated only see's the mids and tweets. I know by experience too that my wife likes a very dynamic picture. I do too. The speaker has to play Radiohead, Porcupine Tree, Shiny Toy guns, as well as female vocals, electronica, jazz, blues, and classical if it can pull it off. My experience with classical is that only big speakers with lots of drivers can pull off the scale of classical. Well, maybe horns too. I know most will disagree but that's been my experience. 

My room is pretty good. 15' x 19' dedicated with GIK bass traps and acoustic panels at the front, 1st order reflections taken care of, Cement slab, thick carpet, rockwool on one wall,  LCR panelboard but a dead back wall as it's nothing but shelving holding vinyl. So no 'live end - dead end'. I don't hear bass issues with any of the speakers in that room not that they don't exist of course.

Swarms are the best way to get a good bass response, fully agree, but I don't have that option. Another reason why I keep thinking that the Legacy Audio Focus XD's seems to check a lot of boxes.

We're not selling our Allnic gear. Not an option.

Our Buchardts are a 4ohm 88db efficient speaker. The Allnics 60wpc in triode drives them without complaint. The 150wpc in pentode drives mode them louder still. 

The Alta Audio Alec's are 93db efficient. They were driven to thunderous levels with the Allnic. 

The Legacy Audio Focus XD is 95.4db efficient and has built-in amplification for the woofers.

I can't believe even 60wpc in any tube amp wouldn't drive those speakers well.

The X3's were not a problem in our room with 60wpc in triode mode nor were they a problem of course with 150wpc pentode mode. I really like them. I've written glowingly about them. One of my dear friends and audio guru, without me knowing, bought the same speaker! I've even got caps for a planned X3 upgrade. My wife never warmed to the X3's and is willing to work for another speaker, even if it costs more. God Bless her. At least she shares my audiophile spirit.

The strength of my tube integrated does not lie with driving 4 x 12" built-in woofers but it probably would. In Legacy form, a built-in 750watt ice module would perform that function just fine, actually, much better and the digital control it would have on top of that in terms of dialing it into one's room may be icing on the cake. There are many options with those particular speakers. I think of it in a way of having very fast subwoofers that were/are already well-integrated a speaker and not having additional subs I can't use with our integrated.

The problem is, there are so damn many nice speakers out there. (like it's a real problem)

ozzy62. The Spatial's X3's do not need subs. I did feel like they could be improved with a more powerful plate amp, however, and a few X3 owners have done that. I cannot use separate subs in my system due to the lack of pre-outs (although I'm cheating at the moment).

I've listened to Audio Note many times and know their capabilities. I don't believe they are the best option for us. For a second system, heck yeah. I WILL build one of their kits one day. Then I'll get an AN E-D.

I've never liked the Zu sound. But I get their allure.

Allnic A6000's w / an A4000 pre? Damn. That would make my early 60's Zenith clock radio get up and perform 3D music. I might pay just to hear that combo!  That combo might even smoke my former best, the Joule Electra VZN100's. I may have to revisit the AN E-D.

I know a former X3 owner that went the Fyne route.

Thanks for all the great suggestions and comments as well. 

It seems the Harbeths inspire a lot of conversation and rightly so. 
Maybe no speaker can perform at the highest level with every genre. Our long gone line arrays came the closest. When I think back on those speakers, my wife would sit in the sweet spot and become totally absorbed in the music. I too, would relish the sound from those speakers. And to be honest, to me, they only became amazing after I purchased a PS Audio Power Plant Premier. And that after they we’re already sold. Oops. 
Audio buddies tried to recreate the sound in their home. Same speaker, same amplifier. That didn’t work. I’m not going back.

I believe we made a decision. Given our home, our rooms, our gear and our value in what a speaker might bring us, it ultimately came down to one speaker.

The Legacy Audio Aeris.

1. The ability to allow our tube amp to allow its greatness to shine through with a 94.5db efficiency. 
2. The ability to tune the speaker to any room we choose.

3. Will play north of our hearing with great tweeters while playing down to 18hz. 
4. Conversations with Aeris owners rave about the midrange, and well, everything else about these speakers.

5. Bill Duddleson, owner, will fabricate a device that will allow us to tap off of the speaker terminals to send signal to the wavelight processor. 
6. The Allnic allows for a second preamp to be used in line allowing a second path to send signal to the wavelength processor.

7. The wavelength processor stores algorithms in the time and space domain. Too much detail to go into but it seems, if I want to, I could store profiles for rock, vocals, jazz, whatever. 
8. The processor will receive updates via USB. Future proof, I don’t know but this company is constantly testing speaker and room interactions.

9. Is there a more beautiful looking speaker on the market?

10. The choice of finishes is pretty awesome. The problem is choosing one.