Fuse Direction for Pass Labs Amp and Preamp

I don't think a single person HERE is implying Atmasphere or the product he manufactures is anything but "Top of Line", "Best in His Field". Please understand other professionals do exist outside the audiophile community that also encompass most of the disciplines for building stereo related gear, including the furniture audiophiles use.

Audiophiles may be a select community, but they have reached way beyond a lot of the older facts that use to be accepted as gospel.  Cable is cable. Fuses are fuses. OAK is the only speaker finish. Class Ds suck. Why are you still using tubes? Concrete everything to the floor. Speaker spikes work. and the biggest of all, Come to AG and get a blast from the past.

Everyone has peers. I don't want to equate emotional attachment to a great person in leu of the fact, other people build crazy good amps TOO. Some not for a living but for pure pleasure and because they can take the time a lot of great production manufactures, CAN'T. If they did it would cost me or you 60K plus ++++. 

I can't afford Ralphs Best and a 2+ year wait. At least his company offers it. Most don't.

I like Dodd's mods. Try to find his work. Samra's Mac builds, Herron's,  there is a few great builders and more than one size fits all. 

I like things MY way, when I pay.

From OHM mouth to this screen verbatim. I'm on line with him in real time face to face.

"The Finnish people have BIG rabbits" "They eat a lot of duck eggs too."

"I wonder if they quarantine rabbits? I bet they do. Get a bill for 20K behind a rabbit." 

"The Finnish people have LOTS of tubes too. They could hold out until the second coming. The Finns are hoarders, Thank God. They actually laugh about Putin's Russia. They have a lot better equipment too. 7-800 miles of borders with that Bully for years. It's no big thing to them. They HATE Putin's puppets. Seagal is the NEW word for $hit in Finland. Get the Seagal off your BOOT"

It's all the time I have, back to work. SLOW day.

Fuser? George is wearing glasses again. It is bright down under. I know rectifier valves are not in the signal path so they can't affect the sound. OK!! You win..

You're smarter than me.. 

Now time to get ready for work.

BTW oldhvymec sends his LOVE to all. He say's it is COLD and WET. The Fins are ready and so is the crew. He found a rabbit of all things, of course he's trying to figure how to get it home.. They EAT rabbits over there, A LOT.. I don't know how that is going work out if someone eats his rabbit. WWIV the heck with WWIII. :-)

"It’s funny that us audiophiles sometimes believe we understand electronics better than electrical engineers do. If DCS, Pass, and other good brands ship their products with standard cables and fuses - shouldn’t we be able to reject the urge to upgrade those?"

If you leave the "US" and "WE" out of the post you might be close. I’ve worked around a lot of different engineers. Every sound engineer was working on sound walls and every EE was working on CANN Buss/OBD2 equipment. They normally were working out a way to add another computer to the mix.

Sound is as subjective as anything on earth and very prone to BIAS. I understand that. The difference with people that are PAID to listen vs people that PAY to listen is pretty simple. Music SQ vs a strange noise in the engine compartment is just a little different skill set.

It took many mechanics decades of learning to hear and then feel a potential issue.

I bow to only a few when it comes to better hearing and with better skills.

I suggest many people and the way they learn to listen is the greater issue. It’s only a problem if "WE" can’t learn to change and learn a BETTER way to listen.
I understand just like fine wine, eventually it all turns to vinegar (hearing).

With that said, what can I say about this:

"Our customer that brought them in exclaimed how they were so transformative. We ran a comparison, just for fun, between them and our shop cables, which we made up from 10ga oxygen free copper wire. Everyone in the shop was challenged to hear a difference. Our speakers though are 16 Ohms and speaker cables are far less critical when driving 16 Ohms as opposed to 8 or 4 Ohms."

OK you got me, you win, 10ga OFC spools cable is just as good as SRs speaker cabling. I suppose you hooked it all up and did a side by side on two identical systems too? GIVE ME A BREAK, you did NOT. Second if you can’t hear the difference in a UP-OCC/teflon weave from your 10ga OFC spool wire. QUIT trying your hearing is SHOT. Stick with the old scope.

The thing about any mechanic worth his salt is to question his/herself abilities before others do.. I’m not the one that couldn’t hear the difference. I suggest a little training is in order. Start with the easier ones first. 2-4ohm 90-92% efficient speakers. The more efficient the speaker, the easier it is to learn about cables, not WIRE.

It’s not hard to understand that a mechanic is usually a pretty skilled engineer with dirt under his fingernails. Certainly had to go to school a LOT longer. I still attend 3-6 classes per year, 40 years after my Master Certs (7 years). I taught hydraulics with OHM for over 20 years.

We both worked with James Bongiorno and a few of his crew. He would chew anyone out for not paying attention to single wire or cabling. 35 years ago? He did some amp board work for a series of cranes we has issues with in the heat..

Carver use to teach a winding class for 2nd year guys. Cheapest guy I ever new, but not with other people’s money.. :-)

Can’t hear a difference? "just for fun" try to learn a new skill set.

My best to you all.

PS Ralph, I think you're one of the finest contributors to the forums with a wealth of knowledge and as always a gentleman all the way.. We've met in passing many years ago..

An there's the rub. You THOUGHT, but not quite long enough. It's ok you are the very first one to ever say that. If you keep walking you will fall off the edge.

I really thought this forum after all these years had finally turned the corner. It's stereo equipment. We (mechanics) put them in the dash of vehicles and install generators as big as a pickup truck to power 400 stereos as CES. I work the shows that supply the power for the equipment. DC? That is just one side of most heavy equipment.. 

Mechanics PLAY with stereo equipment. I can honestly say, most first year apprentices have enough skill to be a very good stereo repair person. He/she only has 3 more years to Journeyman (to be a mechanic), one more for Aviation or Marine and then 2 more for his masters.

DC is HARD it stumps more people than you think... Most AC guys haven't got a clue with marine electric. AC/DC.

Most mechanics I know were building amps as kids and cars as teens.

BTW it does the Cha Cha 50 OR 60 times per second. You stand still when you dance? That must look weird. :-) The Conga line MOVES forward and then back, just like AC, always towards the source.

AC on the outside, DC on the inside. That was a tough one to learn..

BTW another mechanic loaned me the book, we're both into stereo equipment. He's almost 70. Western Electric nutter. AC/DC speakers.

I’m really surprised to read atmasphere say that a fuse can’t have a preferred direction. That is also telling me you don’t look at the wire and how it’s pushed through the dies before soldering them in a preferred direction. Is that right? You don't care which direction the wire is soldered in? I do! 

Second if a Rectifier tube can have such a great affect on a valve amp, what makes people think a fuse, power cable, wall outlet won’t. Not only is there a difference in the sound, there is a reason why. The properties of two different end caps and the way the thermal filament is constructed along with how it was pushed through the dies. AND there is no direction?

Oh YES there is.

It’s simple AC moves in a direction towards the source, period. When it gets there it produces heat if it’s used and it’s moving in that direction because it is being used. The chicken or the egg. Heat is the result of use.. It’s certainly not hot to the tough at the receptacle is it? NO it’s hot where it’s working or producing heat.

You build amps I build cables and equipment. We even have direction on our inline DC fuses.. AC on the outside, DC on the inside.. That’s what is preached by most mechanics.

No direction? WOW! I thought that was figured out 30 years ago, from the 1800 old tech teaching. Things change. I’m actually reading the EE 2020 addition updates, Nano arcing and the quantum effects, Chip mortality # 1 killer, nano arcing and how alloy treatment prevents it. No bare hands anymore. The acid in your hand causes issues in the solder. Hand acids can actually etch a bearing face and cause a failure.

Most of the kooky, loopy stuff audiophile have been saying for 30 years is published reading for Electrical Engineers NOW to keep up.

I rewired two sets of Cary MB. Great result. I’ve seen 30-35 amps redone in our little group. Brian Cheney from VMPS was one. James B, did the work before they both passed in 2012. Cool tea for me.. I'm off work..

It’s not a question of truth, it’s a question of weather you keep up with what the heck is really going on. Haven’t you seen great strides in cables alone or are you STUCK in the 1800s. It makes no difference to (I suggest) millions that can and do hear a vast improvement over the last 40 years.

A FUSE in a valve amp that cold starts, may NEVER recover or cool enough to remove the resistance and chaos a bending and heaving thermal wire is offering from a stock fuse. NOT SO in a lot of after market fuses. That bit of thermal overheat I can hear for over an hour in most of my valve amps. The summer time they never recover. I bypass the fuse in the summer because of that reason. I’ve never lost a valve amp or SS amp by doing so.. 50 years. and 100s of amps. The fuse protect the equipment ONLY. Most mechanics know what fuses are. They are the point of preferred failure, certainly not a way to hotrod something.

None the less saying something is hogwash, is hogwash especially when it comes to cables and wire direction. It’s simple, cables sound and work differently in one direction than the other. The reason to condition cabling the direction it is pushed through the dies. It not only matters, it’s the difference weather I buy your STUFF or not.

Ted Denny hasn’t said a word, yet you bring up his products as if YOU tried them. I’d really doubt that one.. Great products at an astronomical price. Still great products with a FULL money back guarantee. There is NO reason for anyone to complain about that.. You don’t KNOW about a product so you get to slam it. No!

So we are clear I’ve NEVER paid more than 200.00 for the best cables on earth, or over 40 dollars for a fuse. That 40 dollar fuse was well dampened with almost instant thermal transfer. In other words, it NEVER had to recover, because it NEVER got hot..

It would be kind of silly to imply a 5 cent piece of thermal wire made no difference, you ever put a radial tire on backwards? Direction matters.. Even crazy GK new that.

Never keep reversing the fuse, NEVER wipe the goo off the fuse, NEVER.

Install the fuse and let it play if you think it's wrong, wait for at least a day. Then with fresh ears reverse the fuse. IF it sounds better leave if it doesn't put back the way it was. 

The fuse holder should have been inspected before you installed ANY fuse and replaced if there is damage.

The main reason for a phono sections lack of change is because the very low current draw they have through the wires. I've rewired tone arms that took 500+ hours to break-in, the fuse took at least 1/2 of that time.

Power amps, put it in, if you can't hear a difference, get your money back, it's as simple as that. The better the Power supply the less you'll notice it..

Big Macs and Pass amps, LOL who has better power supplied? Not many.

Even Mcintosh finally got it through their thick heads, they SELL cables NOW and I'm a huge Mac fan. 

As I look across the very flat earth. It can't be round.

I thank everyone for a little spring in your step.. I thought I was going to fall into a coma these last couple of months.. :-) LOL

From Kimber about Kimber KAPs:

"All values of Kimber Kap have a red lead at one end. The red lead should go towards the +DC voltage, or away from the –DC voltage. In coupling (DC Blocking) applications the red lead is the signal output end (it will be the same as the +side of an electrolytic capacitor in this position). In a loudspeaker crossover, the red lead should go towards the drive unit + terminal.

The capacitors can be used safely in either direction but the marking indicates which way will minimise hum pickup."

This can be figured out with 99% of NP caps. Kimber just realizes some measurements aren’t accounted for in the OLDER "this is how it works" crowd. Does it make a difference? I repeat from KIMBER. "indicates which way will minimize hum pickup.".

It’s showing where the outside of the film wrap is. Kimber seems to think there is a direction in a NON directional cap. :-) I just happen to agree with the manufacture too. Stealth Caps work VERY well in the right direction. I just installed a set in the Cary and added Deulund .01 bypass (in the right direction).. The umbilical cable was replaced with Kimber and I rewired both preamp and power supply in the right direction. It was wired in both direction from the factory. It’s not now. How does it sound?. Like it need 200 hours to break in.

BTW I’m running my monitors at 12 ohms (static). 400Gan for the summer. What a nice sounding amp.