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Duelund conversion to DIY Helix Geometry Cabling

I have been an avid user of the Duelund cabling for over two years now and have used them exclusively in my system with great results. I have built many for friends and have used a full loom of interconnects, speaker cables, power cords and an extensive wiring modification for a previously owned balanced power conditioner utilizing Duelund 600V PolyCast wiring which was transformative. My cabling desires can be a little addictive as I have owned and evaluated 40+ brands of cabling costing more than an entire stereo system!

Over the past six months I stumbled upon a thread here on Audiogon in regards to a Helix designed cabling and as you probably already know, I just had to look a little deeper into this cable design…After a month of studying and sourcing parts, I decided to reach out to the designer/architect, Williewonka who gave more insights and philosophy on how the cable came into existence.

That conversation got the ball rolling in converting one of my KLE Duelund interconnects to Steve’s Helix designed which only entailed replacing the neutral with a Mil-Spec 16 AWG silver-plated copper wire with the neural wire being 3 times longer than the signal wire and of course the “Coiling” of the neutral wire : )

After the modification was complete, I was not sure what to expect from the Helix cabling but I was quite shocked with the results with “ZERO” burn-in time…The sound stage became much wider/deeper with a much tighter/focused image and clarity/transparency is like nothing I have ever heard in any cabling regardless of cost. In fact, I just sold a full loom of a commercially designed Helix Cable that’s renowned around the world and has more direct sale than any cable manufacturer; these $200 DIY Helix Cables walked all over them…

I believe you will hear the same results as I have and have heard back from friends who have already modified their Duelunds with the same results; WOW! Remember the cables will need 200+ hours to burn-in and settle into your system. My system is now 90% DIY Helix to include IC, SC, PC and Coax with each cabling adding its beauty of an organic and natural presentation that draws you into the fabric of the music.

You can tailor the sound of your cables using Duelund, Mundorf silver/1% gold, the outstanding Vh Audio OCC Solid Copper or Silver with Airlok Insulation or your favorite wiring and you can change it at any time…

 

http://www.image99.net/blog/files/category-diy-cables.html

https://forum.audiogon.com/discussions/difference-in-sound-between-copper-and-silver-digital-cables

https://forum.audiogon.com/discussions/adding-shielding-to-existing-cables

 

Enjoy,

Wig


128x128wig
williewonka
3,075 posts
 
@aniwolfe - the quick answer - Not in the Teflon tube.

I did use the Mundorf 2 x 18 gauge Mundorf Solid Silver + 1% gold in cotton sleeve for IC's a couple of iterations ago
  • that was replaced with 2 x 18 gauge VH Audio UP-OCC solid copper with Air Lok Insulation
  • and now 2 x 18 VH Audio or Netoech NAKED UP-OCC solid copper in Teflon tube
  • both were superior to the Mundorf
Since I now had  surplus Mundorf Silver+gold wire, I decided to recycle it by replacing the1 x 12 gauge Duelund stranded tinned copper wire that was inside my power distribution box with 4 strands of the Mundorf wire in cotton sleeve - which did improve things
  • that has now been replaced by 1 x 12 gauge Neotech UP-OCC solid copper with the Teflon insulation.
  • which proved to be superior to the solid silver
Each time, the UP-OCC copper outperformed the Mundorf silver+gold wire.

based on those observations I believe the OCC copper provides superior performance over most solid silver wires available 
  • with the exception of UP-OCC silver wire from VH audio.
  • Neotech also produces UP-OCC silver but in a much lighter gauge

I did try 1 x 18 gauge VH Audio solid silver wire with AirLok insulation in two power cables for my low power source components, which provided better sound...
  • but that has now been replaced with 1 x 12 gauge Neotech solid UP-OCC copper inside a PVC tube (but Teflon would have been a better choice).
RE: NUMBER OF STRANDS...
Whilst it appears that a double strand of wire seems to be beneficial, increasing the number of strands beyond two does not appear to provide much more in terms of sonic performance - it just costs more
  • at present the VH Audio UP-OCC solid silver is only available up to 18 gauge
  • the Neotech UP-OCC is an even lighter gauge
  • so to use it for power cables would require 4 (or more) strands to equate to 12 gauge
  • this would increase costs significantly
  • but would it provide much better performance?

I do have a $LIMIT to what I am prepared to spend on cables and I think I may have reached it.

You also have to consider diminishing returns
  • the naked UP-OCC copper in Teflon tube  is providing stunning performance
  • so how much improvement would UP-OCC solid silver achieve???
RE: OXIDATON...
SO how much of an impact might the oxidation on the solid copper in Teflon be???
  • to this point that is the BIG unknown
  • but if I think about the copper used on buildings - it takes about 5 years exposure to the elements for the green patina to take hold
  • my wire is inside is sealed Teflon tube with very little space for air
  • I do not think I will be replacing wire within a 10-15 year period
  • by then I will probably be past caring
  • but I am monitoring its progress monthly
  • to date (after a month) it seems to have stalled
  • The speaker cables have been several months and still very bright

However - If anyone has the budget to try the VH Audio solid silver - give it a try - you'll probably get 20-30 years before the silver sulfide (i.e. the black tarnish) impacts sound quality.

Hope that answers you question :-)

Regards - Steve

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massagevermont
9 posts
 
Steve,

How do you remove the Teflon from the Neotech wire without damaging the wire itself? I think what I'll do, when I purchase more wire, is buy the Neotech in PVC to save some money. The PVC is just going to be stripped off.

Thanks, Chris



lyfhk
2 posts
 
There’s SOST-12 listed on the official site of Neotech, though pretty much nobody would like to import such 12 gauge UP-OCC solid silver wire for obvious reasons:

http://neotechcable.com/product9.php
https://wp.neotechcable.com/up-occ-hook-up-wire/

So far I could find a couple of online stores with SOST-12 and we’re talking about 3,500 RMB / meter here:

https://item.taobao.com/item.htm?id=630686893004

And then it’s NT$11,033 / meter (almost 400 bucks) here but as usual a certain agree of wiggle room could be expected:

https://www.ruten.com.tw/item/show?21821076194416

Finally it’s kinda like "priceless" on this Polish site:

https://diraudio.pl/diraudio-jako-autoryzowany-partner-marki-neotech/

Like what Steve mentioned before, it ain’t exactly practical to go for a price range like that unless we could somehow justify the expenses. Maybe an "extremely resolving" system would still benefit from such a substantial investment, though going THAT far might not be worth it.

When it comes to expensive parts, Duelund might not have the best wires out there but their CAST silver / copper caps should be fantastic choices as bypass caps. I guess that we should also pay quite a bit of attention to the PSU side once our cables are mostly taken care of.
williewonka
3,075 posts
 
@massagevermont - Chris - all I do is take a Utility knife like this one

Internet’s Best Snap-Off Utility Knife - Regular - Set of 3 - Belt Clip - Retractable Razor Knife Set - Box Cutter Locking Razor Knife, Utility Knives - Amazon Canada

  • lay the wire on a flat surface - you only need about a 12"-18" surface
  • Lay the blade flat on the wire and then lift the blunt side of the blade up to create around a 5 degree angle with the sharp edge on the insulation
  • slide the blade along the wire to remove a thin strip of the insulation about 4-5 inches at a time
  • Once a thin strip has been removed for the entire length - peel off the remaining insulation
It is very easy and does very little damage to the wire - much better and a lot faster than wire strippers

Hope that helps - Steve


williewonka
3,075 posts
 
Just to clarify - I am not "anti-silver" - I used solid silver for many years and preferred it.

But the UP-OCC solid copper is so darn good, I now find it difficult to justify the cost of silver, for what might be a small ROI

I know others on this thread prefer silver and perhaps I would spring for it if I didn’t have a couple of other expensive hobbies that take some funds away from this one - oh, and a happy wife - at present :-)

If it weren’t for that I would probably try it

Just thought I should clarify things - Steve
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