Duelund conversion to DIY Helix Geometry Cabling

@williewonka - I always wanted to understand the signal flow and what is claimed to be directional wire.  I know when you get to OCC quality the wire is drawn/produced in a certain way and there is a consensus that signal flow should follow that direction.

My specific question for DIY speaker cables - If you buy into this directional approach, should you have positive and negative runs in opposite directions?

I have used a lot of Furutech Alpha hook up wire and have followed their directional arrows.  

Can't claim that I can tell a difference, but this one kept me up thinking last night....

Marty

@williewonka -Thanks for your feedback. Lots of different parameters that can affect the sound. For me, I rely on good conductors, low mass connectors (or no connectors), and secure connections. Rather be listening to music than pondering all the variables....

I like building cables, not as extensively as you, but it’s a nice hobby.

Helix build with the bare UP-OCC is in my near future. Although, after listening to some Zavfino stuff, I’m really impressed. At their price points, I’ll be hard pressed to build anything that looks and performs as well.

Appreciate all your attention to the details and real world feedback.

Marty

Hey Steve,

Thanks for the update. I was ready to pull the trigger on a copper build. Your comments may sway me toward the silver.

I’m planning an XLR version, assuming you would use two silver conductors for the signal wires and the 16awg for the Helix neutral.

Also thinking about a hybrid version that uses Chris’ v-quad wire and then do a helix wrap.

Steve,

What type of wire is the 16awg UP OCC?

Thx.

Sorry.   Where do you source the 16awg wire?

@williewonka    Thx...

@pindac, @williewonka 

I have ordered some of the CCC wire.   I'll plan on building two versions of the XLR Helix.

1. partsconnexion bare PC OCC

2. PC CCC

I have no idea how long it will take to get the CCC.  Should be able to build the OCC Helix next week.

Marty

@williewonka Just completed my first prototypes of the Helix XLR and PC.

I have uploaded a couple pics up on my system page.

I used some older silver wire and stripped off the insulation.  Bought some cheap tubing off of Amazon and wrapped it with solid core 18awg wire (not even OFC).  Basic Neutrik connectors.  Just hooked it up and will let you know how it sounds.

For reference, I have the following:

1. Canare 4E6S wire with Xhadow XLRs

2. Viborg 5N OFC

Waiting on my OCC (partsconnexion) and CCC (Japan) stuff to build the next sets. Saving my AECO XLRs for these builds.  

I hooked up the VenHaus PC and really liked it.  Viborg plugs.

Quad 12awg = 9awg for L&N

dual 13awg Helix wrap = 10awg ground

Marty

@williewonka Just completed my first prototypes of the Helix XLR and PC.

I have uploaded a couple pics up on my system page.

I used some older silver wire and stripped off the insulation.  Bought some cheap tubing off of Amazon and wrapped it with solid core 18awg wire (not even OFC).  Basic Neutrik connectors.  Just hooked it up and will let you know how it sounds.

For reference, I have the following:

1. Canare 4E6S wire with Xhadow XLRs

2. Viborg 5N OFC

Waiting on my OCC (partsconnexion) and CCC (Japan) stuff to build the next sets. Saving my AECO XLRs for these builds.  

I hooked up the VenHaus PC and really liked it.  Viborg plugs.

Quad 12awg = 9awg for L&N

dual 13awg Helix wrap = 10awg ground

Marty

Steve - Yes. I had some older star quad and figured why not try build a Hybrid Helix PC...

The Star Quad construction utilizes 4 conductors in a "Star Quad" geometry that has even better self-shielding than a simple twisted pair. Each of the 4 wires in the Star Quad bundle has a low strand count (19 strands) of Deep Cryogenically Treated Oxygen Free Copper conductors. Each conductor is insulated with VH Audio’s AirLok™ dieletric, a proprietary form of foamed/cellular Fluoropolymer insulation with a dieletric constant (D.C.) of less than 1.5. A clear FEP Fluoropolymer jacket is applied over the Star Quad cable to keep the conductors stabilized. >>> Available in 4 x 12AWG or 4 X 18AWG <<< Maximum Cable O.D. for each is as follows: 4 x 18 AWG = .235", 4 X 12 AWG = .365"

@williewonka - Added a pic to my system folder.   I paired based on "adjacent".  Although, based on the quad twist, it might actually look like opposite??

I do have some Viborg solid core OFC PCs. At some point I'll try a solid sore OCC Helix version.

Going to focus on these XLRs for the near term....

Steve,

Received the partsconnexion order and put together the following Helix XLR.

18awg bare OCC with teflon tubes for the positive and negative

16awg Neotech for the ground (spiral)

AECO XLRs:   I really like these....

Looking back, the Neotech is really high priced and don't know if it is justified for this build.   

Hooked them up and will provide my thoughts.   Swapped my proto silver build as I described earlier.

Threw a couple pics up on my system page.   Maybe I'll put some tech flex around it and we can tell people that it's a $5K interconnect.....:)

@pindac 

I have not received my AR CCC bulk wire.  I ordered fromjapan.  We'll see if it ever shows up.

As an EE, I do like some of your terminology (Eddy properties).  Not an analog/vinyl person, so my only interest in these cables will be an XLR connection from a streamer to amp.  Maybe a speaker cable...

@williewonka 

I recently listened to a Buchardt WiSA system.  No cables...sounded awesome.

The days are numbered...

@ketchup 

good question...I would say that the positive/line conductor should be twisted in the opposite direction of the negative/return conductors.  Basic current flow...

@williewonka 

I have tried many cables with this orientation and really never could tell a difference.

Marty

Steve,

Not sure what you mean by "this orientation"

• are your referring to the rwo stranded live and neutral wires
• or the bare wire inside teflon tube ?

I was referring to the first one. Two stranded L/N wires.

Also with speaker cables. I used to always twist in the same direction. Tried several with opposite twist and continue to do this now.   Can't confirm that is does make a difference...

Marty

@mbolek The Threads been quiet for a while, I have a question for you.

Did you receive your PC CCC  Wire Order?

If yes, has it been used and you have formed an assessment of it.

I have now been able to have been demonstrated the wire in use, from Source to Speaker on a friends system who I introduced to the wire.

The Vinyl LP as a Source on my friends system, now has developed to the wire being in use as an internal Tonearm Cable, Interconnects with Selected Low Eddy Connections on the Cables and Phonostage Chassis, Internal Phonostage Hook Up wire and the Power Cord, the Speaker Cables are also using the same wire.

This is a system I am very familiar with, and when presented as the system owner had wanted it to be heard, it was without doubt, the best I have ever heard this system.

I was gobsmacked at how a Cable that sounded very good when demonstrated, was shown to be presenting as quite inferior when compared to the same Cable ng with a different RCA Connector, especially a RCA selected for the Low Eddy Properties. This is indescribable and is needed to be experienced.

When the exchanges were carried out, the Low Eddy Signal Path was able to present Notes and Vocals with a Envelope Shaping, in a manner I don't ever recall being able to perceive.

The system owner has also made it known, the wire has created such a positive impression, if the wire could be discovered to be purchased in a gauge to suit a MC Coil, they would send a Ortofon Cart' away as a Donor Cart', to a rebuild service, to have the Aucurum Wire replaced with it. That is quite a serious move toward this wire type in anybody's assessment. 

The wire is available in very fine gauge 0.03mm as a Screening Mesh, but is only found in assembled cables, a 0.18mm is the finest I know of in a stranded wire. 

Finally received the Acoustic Revive PC CCC.  I'll look at building a Helix based XLR and see how it compares to one of Steve's variations.  I don't think I strip off the insulation and just pull the conductors apart and do a simple twist for +/- signal. Ground using the Helix wrap.  Will use AECO XLRs.

Each conductor is 19awg, so don't know if this one would be a good candidate for speaker cables.  

@pindac

Cables done. 30" length, 19awg AR Triple C for +/-, Neotech OCC (16awg) ground.

Stripped the AR shielding (teflon tubing), config using Steve’s Helix design....

See my system for pics.

Have to say, listening to my go to songs, maybe better than regular OCC..

@clsidx - Assuming that was directed to me.   It is AR SPC.

here is a description link

@pindac After reading through some to the cable description, AR seems like they prefer that the conductors are run in parallel.  May have to try another version with this config and leaving their insulation intact.  

Marty

@pindac reposting here..

I like the Triple C XLRs very much.   I believe they out perform my previous OCC builds.  Just sensing more clarity, better voicing, overall info that I haven't heard previously with my go to music.

This is a 30" cable with AECO copper/silver XLRs.   (2) 19awg bare Triple C conductors (+, -) inside teflon tubing.  Neotech 16awg for ground (Helix wrap).

May look at replacing some internal hookup wire with the Triple C.   Good stuff...