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Does the first reflection point actually matter??

Hello my friends,

So please read the whole post before commenting. The question is nuanced.

First, as you probably know I’m a huge fan of the well treated room, and a fan boy of GIK acoustics as a result, so what I am _not_ arguing is against proper room treatment. I remember many years ago, perhaps in Audio magazine (dating myself?) the concept of treating the first reflection points came up, and it seems really logical, and quickly adopted. Mirrors, flashlights and lasers and paying the neighbor’s kid (because we don’t have real friends) to come and hold them while marking the wall became common.

However!! In my experience, I have not actually been able to tell the difference between panels on and off that first reflection point. Of course, I can hear the difference between panels and not, but after all these years, I want to ask if any of you personally know that the first reflection point really matters more than other similar locations. Were we scammed? By knowing I mean, did you experiment? Did you find it the night and day difference that was uttered, or was it a subtle thing, and if those panels were moved 6" off, would you hear it?


Best,


Erik
erik_squires

Showing 3 responses by ivan_nosnibor

ivan_nosnibor's avatar
ivan_nosnibor
1,047 posts
 
Thank you, sir.
ivan_nosnibor's avatar
ivan_nosnibor
1,047 posts
 
+1 Dennis Foley, he's the real deal.
ivan_nosnibor's avatar
ivan_nosnibor
1,047 posts
 
Does the first reflection point really matter?

For my 2 cents, how sound reproduction interacts with the room is a Very complex subject.

The original problem for the writers back in the day? Sure, they could all see how important it was, but it all covers so much territory. How do you write about such a varied topic every time out without oversimplifying it to the point of shortchanging it? You don't...because you can't. So, the next best thing is to try to simplify it for 'average' or 'typical' situ's. So everyone ended up with their own 'rules' designed to help keep advice simple...only for every rule there are invariably (too) many exceptions.

Think of it as your 'system' vs the 'room'. Every system has its own ability (or not so much) to project into the room. The total ability of which is made up of the sum of each individual component, wiring, power treatments, EQ, etc. Not only is each system's range and envelope of sound unique, but change just one setting or component and that projection into the room changes accordingly. And for every change in sound projection behavior, there is potentially a different room treatment solution, even if it is only based on using the same room treatment components, just rearranged differently in the room in relation to the stereo...or in relation to the lp. Even that doesn't begin to cover it all.

But, in the case of the first reflection point (or perhaps any other), real-world end results are so often all over the map, from crucially important to nearly non-existent. Because there simply Are no formulas for it that can take all the variations of the system into account, even with a microphone. In the end, I'm tempted to say that the best fine tuning is always going to come from first-hand, empirical experimentation, regardless of how many rules, good or otherwise, may be available, or that can be relied upon to get us 'in the ballpark' first.
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