Does Everyone Use 2 Phono Cables with SUT


I just learned a rather expensive lesson from my audio dealer. I always thought I only needed a phono cable from my turntable to my SUT. By adding another phono cable (not interconnect) from the SUT to the phono preamp, I got a nice improvement in “efficiency.” Everything just flows better.

 

I guess everyone uses 2 phono cables? 

 

 

labpro

Showing 3 responses by elliottbnewcombjr

Huh?

that cartridge has a difficult combo of high 16 ohm impedance and low .23mv signal.

It is the type that might need a SUT with individual gain adjustments and individual impedance

what SUT are you using? You need to know the x factor of it’s input(s).

cartridge .23mv; allowing for some loss: an x factor around 20: that would give you a signal of around 4.0mv., plenty for a MM Phono input.

resultant impedance of xfsq 400 shown to a 47k mm phono input would be 117.

guidance for your cartridge, 16 ohm x 10 = goal of near 160 ohms shown to MM Phono input..

to get ’shown’ impedance up, you need to lower the x factor.

x factor 18 signal after bit of loss 4.0mv, still plenty

xfsq now only 324, 47k/324: shown impedance now 145. closer

x factor 16, signal say 3.5mv, many MM and High MC have this or a bit less. your MM stage has a ’sensitivity’, that is just above too low.

xf16, xfsq 256; now ’shown to 47k input would be 183.

now back to the issue of cable loss!

 

PHONO: basic advice: do not use interconnects to avoid potential problems. if so, as short as possible. 

SUT: tonearm phono cable with ground into SUT. Phono cable with ground out of SUT to Phono MM input and a ground somewhere nearby. I have had to extend a few din cable's ground wires, they were too short to reach a poorly placed ground too far from the phono jacks.

Surprisingly/Confusingly: Fidelity Research FRT-3 has no ground attachment fitting. It's captive output cable has a ground wire with spade. Meanwhile, FRT-3G version has added a ground terminal on the back of the SUT. Captive output cable same, has ground wire with spade.

 

Tonearm ground wire can be separate, bypass the SUT, and go from the arm directly to a ground anywhere if needed. 

Some equipment, phono stage, etc have 'ground lift' to solve 'ground loops'.

 

 

dover, mulveling

You both know more than I do. Understanding SUTs and MC Phono inputs or MC Phono Stages or MM/MC Combo units (individual selectable, one input and a switch somewhere) is one of the trickiest parts of moving into MC cartridge(s).

IF an advanced stylus is not properly calibrated and aligned, it’s advantages won’t be heard, and damage can occur.

Wrong x factor, wrong impedance, an advanced MC cartridge could be a little or a lot ’off’ of it’s designed potential superior sound reproduction.

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I don’t like letting machines beat me, nor taking advice on faith, so I dug in, researched, read, found charts, surveyed the heck out of makers sites and vintage variations on hifishark.

Most people, especially still working, don’t have the time or inclination, so they are at the mercy of .... That SUT is very expensive, has no adjustable parameters. OP may have already had it or been given it, in any case he is aware of the large impedance mismatch.

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I had a friend tell me his cartridge was MC low output. I checked it’s alignment on one of my arms, ... set tracking and anti-skate, and tried the same setting on my SUT as my MCLO, so we could compare them..

Not only too much volume, the entire frequency range was shifted. It had very nice range, imaging was there, but Annie Lenox; Sade, any voice was easily different. Weird. Everything was shifted in frequency together.

I spoke to the person who rebuilt it, it is MCHO high output, we should have been using the PASS (skips the sut’s transformer, just sends unaltered signal thru.

He brought the cartridge back, using PASS, everyone’s voices were ’right’. Now it’s full frequency, imaging, all there: it was hard to hear any differences between his and mine, after a while we both described what we heard from each similarly.

The mismatch was not x factor/not too much signal strength, my mx110z phono input can accept strong signals, the IMPEDANCE mismatch was what made is sound significantly different, significantly 'wrong'.