Does a record player make that much of a difference??

It all matters.  I my opinion the cartridge has the highest point of diminishing returns, but you need to have balance among all the components.

My TT is the least expensive part of the system, though no slouch.  Phono Pre cost twice as much as the TT and the carts cost another 33% over that.  But there really can't be any weak link in the system from source to speakers and finding that balance and synergy is key.

 

Dear @joshindc  : " I think the reason record-loving audiophiles put so much more attention and money on record players vs carts and phonostages is because there is more to look at. Not that there is anything wrong with wanting a cool looking turntable… "

Obviously that you are totally wrong and with al respect you have no idea what you are talking about but in the other side is that's what you think your OP thread has no sense because you already have the answer  ! ! ! 

 

R.

Hi Rauliruegas. 

Thought the purpose of these threads was to have fun discussing our shared interest - audio. Or is it to prove how much smarter you are than everyone else?

Lighten up!

 

Well, Vinyl is my primary Source, so...

IMO: OP is correct: upgrade cartridge 1st.

Anyone wanting to get started with vinyl, I recommend this TT. (I had one for years). If they stick with vinyl, then move up. (what, in what order the OP asks)

https://www.audio-technica.com/en-us/at-lp120xusb

It now comes with a VM95 cartridge body, which accepts various interchangeable stylus including Microline or Shibata.

https://www.audio-technica.com/en-us/cartridges/line-series/at-vm95-series

The cartridge has a threaded body, only needs screws from top without nuts.

TT has a built-in optional Phono EQ, so it can go straight to any Line Level Input to start with any preamp with or without built-in Phono Stage.

Direct Drive, removable headshell, (useless speed control we are not DJs).

I definitely recommend buying the Microline Stylus, easily goes into the cartridge body, no re-alignment needed, no potential misalignment for a novice.

It has a lightweight platter, fuzzy platter mat, adjustable feet, nothing special there

......................................................

the VM95 cartridge body specs which relate to imaging are:

Channel Separation 23db; Channel Balance 1.5db. If you check MANY expensive cartridges, they do not have better separation or balance, and surprisingly MANY expensive cartridges are Elliptical.

Factory Aligned, Upgraded Stylus (no-realignment needed) this TT would sound very good, and I would expect the beginner would stick with Vinyl, IOW, not have a poor experience that Streaming is/was far better which happens to many novices.

.........................................

Now, time to move up:

1. Alignment Tools and Cartridge Alignment Skills MUST be acquired, by you, friend, nearby dealer before a cartridge body is changed (MM or MC)

2. The beauty of a cartridges’ sound is separate factor, subjective, but Imaging Capability involves comparable measurements.

I would first change the cartridge on this TT to get improved imaging, i.e. wider channel separation and tighter channel balance.

I always recommend this as a very good MM moving magnet cartridge to start with ($300). The cartridge/headshell combo gives you a spare headshell which will be advantageous later.

https://www.audio-technica.com/en-us/cartridges/type/moving-magnet/vm540ml-h

Channel Separation is 28db; Channel Balance is 1.0db. The combination of wider/tighter makes quite a difference when listening to a superior recording. Again, MANY expensive cartridges do not produce as wide or tight imaging.

3. Move up to a Moving Coil Cartridge and Phono Stage for both MC/MM at the same time.

NOTE: Most people would upgrade the TT first, however, the sound will be improved to a greater extent by MC Cartridge/Phono Stage with MC/MM capability. Then the MC cartridge and Phono Stage can be used later with any new TT

3a. MC Cartridge: I recommend my choice, AT33PTG/2 as a MC start.

https://www.audio-technica.com/en-us/cartridges/type/moving-coil/at33ptg-2

Channel Separation: 30db; Channel Balance: 0.5db. Combined with the advantages of MC technology.

I’ve compared it to my half-dozen cartridges, my friend’s cartridges played here, we all prefer it to the others. I’m never moving up to more expensive cartridges. I wore my stylus out, got another new AT33 at half price thru AT’s MC trade-in program.

3b. ANY PHONO STAGE: get return option, this is the most subjective move so far. Keeping it separate allows use with ANY change of equipment, and future upgrading a separate Phono Stage is independent of other equipment.

3c. OPTIONAL SETTINGS for future MC cartridges. Price definitely moves up, it might or might not be important, in my case, I had a MM Phono Stage I loved, so I added a SUT step up transformer with 4 MC optional x factors/impedances and PASS for MM use.

4. Finally: Better TT and Better Arm (OP’s Question).

4a. my recommendation: go for Direct Drive with a heavy base and heavy platter, superior isolation/leveling capability.

4b. Dust Cover. Surprisingly, many high end TT’s come with no dust cover. I cannot imagine having a superior machined Arm without a dust cover, keeps me up at night.

4c. Arm: go for a TT with an arm with removable headshell. This is difficult as so many upgrade TT’s come with Fixed Arms with pre-mounted cartridges (easy until you need to change the cartridge later).

4d.TT without arm, get/mount your own arm: this is beyond the scope of most, but a viable option if you or a friend or nearby dealer have the skills.

4d. Easy Arm Height Adjustment. Another good reason to get a TT without arm. Important IF you will have a few cartridges, their body height varies, a friend might bring a headshell with his cartridge, you might get into Mono LPs, ......

5. How you gonna keep/clean those LPs? New, Existing Used, new to you Used. Good luck with that, I stick with my manual scrub, frugal and quite successful.

@joshindc  : Well that's your porpose and cratinly no thread forum is to see who is more smarter.

For my understanding in analog we have LP's to listen through our ears not through our " eyes ".

I think that this forum is not just for FUN. Here already posted gentlemans that do not try to be " smarter " but truly experienced MUSIC lover(audiophiles trying in one way or the other to HELP not only to you but to any other audiophile intersted in the subject and nor mally  ( ate least me ) I post and read the thread post looking to learn and not for " fun " as is your target.

 

Only by " curiosity ": do you already took a " look " to the virtual systems of gentlemans that posted in your thread as: @mikelavigne ​​​@mijostyn ​@lewm ​@terry9   and others?

 

Well, just for FUN make you a favor and do it.

R.