2. amps-preamps
  3. 1244811660

Do all Class D amps lack soundstage depth?

Hello!
Recently I bought a class D amp for my friend from Audiogon - PS Audio Trio A-100. In general, I liked it sound very much. Compared to the power section of my much cheaper integrated amp (NAD C320BEE), Trio A-100 sounded fresher, more transparent, richer and juicier. NAD was obviously duller and more reserved. Trio A-100 seemed to energize the air with a sort of vibrancy, while NAD seemed more lifeless. (Of course, I am exaggerating the difference between the amps a bit to make it more clear how they differ from each other.) However, Trio A-100 lacked one parameter, which is very essential for me and without which I cannot truly get lost in the music – namely, the soundstage was flat. It wasn’t absolutely flat, no – but NAD did so much better in this department. When NAD was playing, I heard which instruments and singers were farther from me and which were closer to me. When Trio was playing, everything seemed to be on the same line, equidistant from me.

The previous owner of PS Audio Trio A-100 had told to me about its sound before I bought the amp from him, and he frankly admitted that the soundstage was kind of flat. Before this purchase, I nearly bought another Class D amp – namely, Bel Canto S300. Eventually, this amp went to another buyer, but the owner shared with me his impressions about this amp and, among other things, he wrote: “There might be less depth with some recordings”.

So, at least two owners of Class D amps confessed that their amps lacked soundstage depth.

I wonder – are all Class D amps like that? Is the lack of depth something which is intrinsically inherent in Class D?

My second question is – what if I buy TWO Class D amps and use them as monoblocks – will it solve the problem with the flatness of the soundstage?

Any advice based on personal experience will be much appreciated.
ironmine

Showing 4 responses by ironmine

ironmine OP
41 posts
 
Br3098, you wrote: "As I said and in my opinion, that is speaker issue."

Then, how come NAD creates a deep soundstage through the same speakers?

I have AE speakers, they are 8 ohm and 150 W maximum power handling capacity. So, from the technical point of view, PS-Audio (100W) is better suited for my speakers than NAD (50W). And I could hear it, the sound improved overall in all aspects except soundstage depth.
ironmine OP
41 posts
 
Tholt: "Is there a reason why you're so caught up in class D?"

Because it's easier for me to purchase Class D amps internationally - their are light in terms of weight and they often accept 220V. And because I liked, in general, the fresh and open sound of PS Audio Trio A-100. (I just wonder now - did the sound became more transparent because of Class D design or because this amp was 2 times more powerful than my own?)

2chnlben: "once I removed my component rack from between my speakers, I heard a real improvement in the overall soundstage".

I had the same experience as you! 2 months ago, when I removed a computer desk from between the speakers and replaced it with a much smaller cabinet, I had a substantial improvement in the soundstage stability and depth.

Dcstep: "You guys aren't listening. He's happy with the imaging when using the NAB. It's not a speaker placement issue, it's an amp issue."

Thanks, Dcstep! :) I tried already every trick in the book with speaker placement in my room and their current positioning is optimal. My room is 3 m x 6 m and this is what I have to deal with for the next 20-30 years :)

Muralman1: "I really don't think that amps have anything to do with sound stage width."

We are talking about depth, not width.
ironmine OP
41 posts
 
Thanks, Kenk168! Looks like Nuforce is among the favorites, when it comes to digital amps...
ironmine OP
41 posts
 
Some guys commented that "the other components in your system affect the class D amps more then you would think" (Tan43) and that it "sounds like a speaker placement issue" (2chnlben).

I would like to emphasize that when me and my friend compared my NAD and his Trio A-100, we used the same room, same speakers, same cables, same preamp, same DAC, same songs, etc. We just changed the power amps - that’s all. So, it is hard for me to believe that I have an issue with speaker placement or other components.

I would think that Heavystarch is right – the culprit must be the same ICEpower 200ASC module used in both PS Audio Trio A-100 and Bel Canto S300.

What about PS Audio HCA-2? Does it use the same module as these two amps?

In general, I am looking for a class D amp, which I want to buy used at around $1000 and which can give to me a good feeling of depth in the soundstage. You know that feeling which you get when you close your eyes and the walls in your room simply disappear (especially the wall behind the speakers), because the sound comes at you from places which are much further then the wall behind the speakers. When I open my eyes again I am always surprised to see the wall only 3 m away from me – because, I swear that just one second ago I heard sounds which were coming at me from 10 or 15 meters away from me… I wonder if such kind of magic is attainable from class D amps within my budget...
More to discover