Deep Cleaning Records With Steam?


It has happened again. Major tweak and record provider has available a steam cleaner made especially for records. Anybody try steam for cleaning lp’s? What were your results? Since a unit can be had for about $20 at Target, 15% of what the tweak provider is charging, is it worth a try?.
tiger

Showing 9 responses by ghosthouse

Creml -
I had the opportunity to visit Berlin in Sept. '07. What a beautiful city. Really enjoyed it. To make matters even better, there's a great music shop ("Cover") on Kurfurstendamm Strasse with lots of vinyl. Unfortunately, folks there indicated they may soon lose their lease and be forced out. Suggest you serve your time in Berlin but do it soon!
Crem1 - Thanks for your recommendations. I enjoy buying used vinyl at flea markets etc. Have some that really need a good cleaning. Am going to track down a Perfection Steam Cleaner (I do see it on Walgreen's web site).

Just came across this. Thought it might be of interest
http://musicangle.com/feat.php?id=54&page=4

Any suggestions about on-line sources for triple-distilled water?

Thanks in advance
Stelkor & Crem1 -
As a precaution can a piece of metal (nail?) of the appropriate diameter be inserted into the LP spindle hole prior to cleaning? Might help conserve original dimensions.

Just did my first steam cleaning. Treated Steely Dan's "The Royal Scam"...a very noisy LP since bought many years ago. Steaming has improved things beyond what straight cleaning fluid/RCM cleaning did. I'm inclined to give it another treatment and see if the last residual "pops" can be eliminated. No issues with spindle hole dimension changes.
Crem1 - I was trained as a bacteriologist, did graduate work in microbiology and have been employed as a microbiologist. I'll be following this development with great interest!
John of Sunnyvale...
I don't know what the concensus is, only what I've been doing. It probably takes me in the neighborhood of 10-15 seconds to steam one side of a 33 1/3 LP. I start near the center using a Tupperware-type lid to protect the inner label and go round and round toward the outside, stopping only momentarily to get past my finger that I'm using to hold down the lid. I'm still experimenting but quite often I'll steam several times per side (i.e., in between applications of cleaning solutions) followed by vacuuming. I also steam as a final "rinse" and vacuum to dry. It's a pain and may take 15-20 minutes or so to do a side. This fairly aggressive use of steam hasn't caused any damage that I can discern and some very noisy (lot's of pops and ticks) flea market purchases are now almost completely silent. In fact when the stylus gets to the runout groove that's been covered by the plastic lid and not cleaned - the noise is back and by contrast you can easily hear the benefit of cleaning.
I've been following this thread for some time and wanted to offer a few comments. My post is somewhat long but hopefully not too boring. It might even be useful to some following this thread.

Low, ppm levels of phosphate can precipitate with calcium. pH and temperature influence this solubility. Calcium phosphate solubility is reduced with increasing temperature and pH. Some detergents will include additives to address water hardness issuues. Modern detergents are something of technical marvels in and of themselves and along with "soap" and enzymes there will be a whole laundry list (pardon the pun) of other chemicals that would be be applied to the vinyl surface if used for LP cleaning. I do think Jan's idea is worth experimentation -maybe with some heavily soiled, flea market LPs that are beyond any other means of saving. I would probably do a thorough rinse with good quality water before any steaming.

On the topic of best process for producing high quality water...just an observation that for distillation, the number of stages, and for RO, the number of "passes" (times water is pushed through a membrane element) will influence the outcome. Single pass RO may reduce calcium and other dissolved minerals by 90% or so. Multi-pass RO can lead to a significantly better quality water than single pass. RO coupled with demineralization (charged resins that adsorb dissolved minerals) followed by electrically-based polishing steps will yield some of the highest quality water possible. All this to simply point out that citing RO water does not guarantee the same quality product from source to source since there is much potential variability in the process as practiced one location to another (not to mention post-production handling as in quality of transfer lines and storage vessels). Same things apply to distilled water. I'm not coming down on one side or the other of the RO vs distilled water discussion. I believe there are multiple paths to the same endpoint (clean vinyl). Find the best quality water you can afford and easily obtain. During the search, if possible, investigate the details of the process used to produce it. Personally, for steaming, I just use distilled water bought at the grocery store with vacuum as a final/drying step.

On the topic of cleaning LPs with bacteria and how water quality might affect this...
Many common, garden variety bacteria utilize organics [generically Cx(H2O)y]to generate energy and build new cell mass. They do need trace amounts of a range of minerals. The acronymn CHOPKiNS is sometimes used as a mnemonic for nutrients required by microbes: Carbon, Hydrogen, Oxygen, Phophorus, Potassium, inluding Nitrogen and Sulfur. Other elements like Mn are also needed though in even lower amounts. Typically H & O are in abundance from water. Carbon is what usually limits growth since they need more of this than N, P, K or S. If you supply only minerals to a population of microbes but limit carbon source to a specific compound, it is possible to determine whether that compound is biodegradable based on whether the organisms grow or not.

Regarding Charlie's musing about water quality influencing efficacy of bio-mediated cleaning...if water quality is such that the bugs have no other source of organic material than the crud in an LP groove...that can well become the primary focus of their attentions if it is organic and biodegradable. As a closing illustration, various industries require extremely high quality water (chip mftrs, for instance). Water treatment systems at these facilities represent major capital investment and are capable of producing extremely high quality water, chemically and biologically. The manufacturing equipment itself can still experience problems due to biological activity, however. In such systems - as nutrient poor as they are designed to be - microbes can extract sufficent material for growth from various plastics and other elastomeric compounds used in construction along with trace organic contaminants present on surfaces. Use of microbes to clean an LP groove is not far fetched at all given adequate contact time, the right environmental conditions and a microbial population equipped with an appropriate set of enzymes.
Gregm - Do consider adding a record cleaning machine to your process. KAB Electro Acoustics offers a manual "machine" the EV-1 that you use with your home vacuum cleaner. It is vry affordable (<$200). Sucking "gunk" out of the grooves after steaming should help eliminate what you are collecting on your stylus.
Be very cautious with bleach...it is a strong oxidizer and may attack some components of the vinyl if you over do it.
Gents - my 2 cents. By definitiion, steam is pure water vapor just as Sonofjim describes. Dissolved minerals and suspended solids are left behind during evaporation Some volatile organics will be evaporated as well. In practice however, the distillation process is not perfect and entrained liquid bearing minerals and other impurities will carryover - hence the need for multi-stage distillation to arrive at really pure distilled water. Equipment cleanliness, post-production transfer lines and storage vessels also affect product quality. I use the Perfection Steamer with relatively cheap grocery store bought distilled water as part of a muli-step cleaning process. I do empty the steamer after each session so as not to "concentrate up" solids left behind during evaporation. It does spit a bit but I vacuum as a final step - removing any condensed steam phase and liquid distilled water (due to spitting) from the LP surface. This is not to contracdict anyone else's more fastidious or rigorous approach...just what happens to work for me.