Tvad,
How would you compare the Bryston with the VAC Tube Amp.
Forget conventional wisdom and all the techno talk, just, how do they compare?
Which is better in your humble opinion, why, and so on. |
My assessment, humbly is, that the Bryson sounds, although, I dislike this characterization, slow and lacking in fine detail.
Inasmuch as tubes are finely detailed though somethat flawed in the bass region, the Bryston sounds unrefined and slower than I would characterize as being accurate musically.
It is the proverbial workhorse versus the thorobred horse.
It lacks refinement and detail, but has good bass and other good qualities. |
I've thought about the 'slow' comment, and it is admittedly vague. I think I always thought of the Bryston as less refined sounding than some others. For example, many will disagree, but I find the Levinson to be uninteresting, musically. I am not sure if it lacks dynamic contrasting, but to me, (just to me IMHO) not interesting.
The Bryston, (and I was a dealer for them for a short time) many years ago; the same characteristic sound is found for me in their OEM Lexicon Amps. Solid well built, probably never break, but not as detailed as some others I like more. Hell, maybe it's just neutral.
Just, not a fan of it's 'sound' perhaps. |
TVAD I don't know why I softballed your question, when you said, "I don't know what slow means" or words to that effect.
For many years now, rise time, slew rate, have become lesser talked about figures in some circles than in others.
I think the now deceased John Ivorsen of Eagle, was the first designer to talk to me about the speed and relative speed of amplifiers, and how capacitive loads dramatically effect the measurements: which is why different engineers have different measurements for seemingly the same product.
He also, this was in 1986 talked about how most designers did not understand the proper utilization of 'current' in design work, then he started losing me at that point in my career. At that time his amp was vastly 'clearer' and I guess therefore sounded 'faster' to me, in the way that tubes offer more delicacy (to me) and low level resolution.
My early days with Bryston date to 1985, then as I traveled the country for THIEL. Their distribution became spotty when the brothers split and Chris and John went separate ways, Chris going with Classe I believe.
But explaining speed is almost like explaining, as I said, tube delicacy. It's not that it doesn't exist, its just hard to make clear.
That is as when people talk about S/N ratios and they don't realize that 80db s/n ratio is 1/10,000th, then begin to what seems like a nit pick, with 80 db versus 100db, once you're already at 1/10,000th, isn't that already good?
So speed--yes, I think, that to me Bryston sounds softish, and slower than many other good amps. If that sounds like an indictment I apologize. But we ALL hear things so differently, one thing that is obvious to one person is not as obvious to another.
At 56, I had a hearing test, and my left ear was rated, according to the doctor, as 'perfect, and really remarkable', (he had the good grace not to say, for your age.) But the scale was not age relative, it was just perfect. I now realize why 'possibly' I hear and quantify things other people don't. Please don't take that as bragging since most of the things I hear, are unpleasant, so perhaps a curse in some ways.
I am sure your amp is excellent, just not my personal favorite.
Spectral, probably sets the world on fire with it's recovery times, yet to me sounds stark, and dry. So what does that tell me? Who knows? |
Actually I did, in that I (even though I did not include the dates) stated that I heard plenty of Bryston's and their current Lexicon which is their OEM product.
Bryston is so damn good, that it is ridiculous to have any nit's but if you can imagine a square wave with the front part rounded, that is what I hear. It doesn't sound like a square wave, but a 'rounded' wave to me, with the leading edge missing.
Hope this helps, AND we still have the offer of the master bedroom for you and Chris to visit you dog. Please come to Louisville, hear my LSA's and let me show you Louisville.
You can meet the entire LSA crew, and take home a pair of LSA 3's in Rosewood.
Larry |
I might point out that Bryston, in an effort to justify their pricing and quality differences, other than the obvious warranty differences, would intentionally show much better spec's than their OEM Lexicon counterparts.
I would bet that the spec's are identical on both pieces, and that the difference is one of marketing. Smart, and meaninginless in terms of differences.
I. E. Why buy a Bryston, other than the 20 year warranty unless the spec's are different?
I know you like the Bryston, and well you should. It has been a staple in the industry for years, and only a 'taste' difference, in terms of 'sound' would lead one to a different product. I prefer it overwhelmingly to Krell's high frequency 'hash' for example. My preferences lean to tubes and their delcate presentation relative to solid state. The distortions of tubes are pleasant versus, unpleasant in solid state, with odd order harmonics.
Think about your system, and how the Bryston sounds better in some ways. That has to do with the speakers, capacitance etc, as much as anything. |
Musical Fidelity is overrated but more musical to me than the Bryston.
Yet there are many tube amplifiers that have more musicality than either. So I guess I am a tube groupie, in that regard. Tubes sound more like music to me than solid state, and further, hybrid combo's of tubes and solid state, with tubes as pre's and solid state as the amplifiers sound most life like.
For example, in the past an Adcom amp, with a conrad johnson amp had a more palpable sound with regard to sonic realism to me, than many other combinations.
There is a reason why amps use mosfet designs, and it has to do with the sense of tube like sound. |
The question is, what do I recommend. VAC is a good place to start. Oftentimes Kevin Hayes of VAC has used pieces for sale on his website. Or just call and talk to him. You will learn more about tube gear from him in minutes than I could write in hours. |
First of all, I never think in terms of an 'amp' as a separate entity. My experience tells me that matching of goods, that is amps and pre amps are more important than just the individual piece. For example, while an amp may sound great, it only sounds great potentially, and that if it's matched with the correct pre amp, speakers, and so on. I am a fan of matching tube pre amps with solid state amps, though, with the 'neutralization' (just call me Ogden Nash) of some tube pre amps this has changed radically over the past few years.
Now, with that said, what SS amp do I recommend? As much as I hate to kill retail sales people, a used Ayre amp, with the bias set to 1400. instead of their ususal 900 works great for me. It sounds like tubes, though not as much as people say. Black background, detailed, articulate sound stage. On Audiogon right now there's a V3 for sale for 1325. I believe. And if you call the factory they will do some things to the amp, making it much better than anything near the price, IMHO.
Again, speakers, amps cables, and so on are always a synergism. It is impossible to simply tell someone (for me) what an amp sounds like. The variables are simply too great.
Also, when someone 'tells me' they 'need' 300 WPC, I ask them more questions. How big is the room, what is your speaker, your listening tastes, music preference, and what do you think is loud?
IMHO people give out too much even though it's free, cheap information.
Then there are some of the newer, but used McIntosh's which use the Toshiba transistors, which are detailed and sweet at the same time.
Not thought of as an audiophile product for a long time, McIntosh has really come light years recently.
The choices are endless |
