The midrange only sounds aggressive with poor equipment or cable matching. I have heard the B&W 's sound really bad and out of this world beautiful! So much can go wrong before the speakers get their shot! |
I remember when I owned Wilson 6's and reviewers said they were bright sounding....not with TRANSPARENT cables! |
I have the 802D2's...I will go to my local dealer and see what's up with the new voicing. |
Sure....if emotion or tone take a back seat to detail however, then I will be dissapointed. |
Didn't get to do a proper audition of the 802D3's but I did notice how much skinnier they are and how thin the support base is. Also, the woodwork looked horrible...like plastic!! If I were going by aesthetics alone I would say not very enticing. |
Not with my music or rig that I'm familiar with...will return, perhaps tomorrow! My spidy senses tell me that B&W has made an attempt to improve spec's while reducing costs in non-critical areas. It is not what I would consider an all out assault on music reproduction, which is kinda what I would expect for $22k. |
Gonna try and do a proper audition today |
Bo, I find it hard to follow your discourse. Is English a second language for you? |
So Bo, what product did you say you are using/ developing that allows better sound staging etc..? |
Bo, are you Bobby Kingma? |
Sorry Bo, I just can't make sense out of what your saying! Good luck though on your pursuits. |
Ok, Bo...the more you try to explain the cloudier things get. Who is "We"? What is your product? Do you own a business? Are you from Krypton? |
Your right on Rotel Bobby! |
I have rendered a verdict...Bo is full of hooey! |
I have heard the 802D3's and they sound more precise and very resolving with good presence. There is no doubt that they would provide superior sound
reproduction in a high end system. As for me, I am staying with my 802D2 speakers for a few reasons. Foremost is the looks...love my fatter all wood design with larger metal plinth. Second, the metal spikes on my pair could be used to launch a Saturn V rocket! Lastly, the D2's are just a tad more forgiving and warmer sounding with a fullness that I like. |
I agree with cabling suggestion...I didn't realize just what my speakers/system was capable of doing until I inserted my MIT M1.3 loom...otherworldly!! |
Sorry Bo, I owned plenty of Audioquest cables...which are some of my favorite cables compared to others available, but MIT (at least Magnum series) simply destroy all competitors!! My M1.3 loom does 3D Holography with crushing dynamics and accurate tone like none other....but I understand the business end might dictate selling Audioquest in some markets. |
In addition...pure silver anything bleaches the soul out of the music!! |
Bo, my reference is Boston Symphony Hall...one of the best sounding concert venues ever!! FYI, in real life tightly focused imaging does not exist. That said, MIT brings scale and authority to sound reproduction which you can not get enough of in a stereo system.
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Right on about speakers being to dead can sound in-emotional! |
I agree that silver has a place in balance but all silver IC's or spkr cables no! As for the intimate thing...that is heavily influenced by the environment and the material. An acoustically damped room will kill bloom and dynamics. Voice can sound tamped down and localized depending on venue, but it can also soar and bloom and resonate. A single saxophone can fill a large room with dynamics and resonant bloom. To kill the acoustic envelope so you can focus it down to an intimate lifeless husk is not my cup of tea. Live music has explosive dynamics and acoustic bloom and resonance that expands to fill a room...it is not politely contained. |
We will have to agree that we disagree then....I'm assuming that you actually listen to live music and not just your audio setups, right? Even the smallest instruments are extremely dynamic and not tightly focused in a live setting. I understand what your trying to get at but it is unique to Hi Fi systems and not live music being played in a venue, unless that venue is closed in and acoustically damped. Remember, imaging itself is a stereo system affectation and has little application in a live music environment. |
Bo, reflected on our conversation and it reminded me of a similiar situation I ran into with a local audiophile. He had an extremely high end
system with a 20K vinyl rig and Avalon Eidolons etc..., which I thought would be exceptional to experience. Bottom line is that he played music at an extremely low level, suffered severe humm issues and dynamic range limitations. Bottom line is that I am often amazed at how many audiophiles have extremely bizarre listening habits that exhibit traits contrary to live music being recreated. Attempts to controll the acoustic envelope and tighten a systems abillity to fully express the dynamic range and scale of the music is antithetical to Hi Fidelity! |
Bo, I would like a list or a link to the equipment you utilize and the brands you feel are the best. If you cannot do so, then your viewpoint must remain under suspicion.
Regarding MIT cables you said:
"They can create a deep and wide stage, but within this stage the individual focus of instruments ans voices is not as sharp and small as in real."
Precisely....instruments are not sharp and focused or small...EVER!!
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Bo, we get it...you sell MA speakers and AQ cables. I went to my dealer, check in hand to buy the PL200's...they sucked. I owned the AQ cables and have demo'd the recent stuff from the Cable Co.. They are good but not my cup of tea...too tight and constricted. |
Thanks Bo, good stuff but something is off with your preference for Lilipution sound staging! The only time music sounds small is when it is overwhelmed by the acoustics/size of the venue. I auditioned the PL200's seriously once, and they were abrasively coarse in their rendering of instrumental tone and texture. The ribbon tweeter was horrible...perhaps you have mistaken air for the raspiness of the tweeter on the PL200? |
I've heard Rochberg piano music played at my local University Presidents House, and it absolutely overwhelmed her listening room with dynamics and volume...one piano! Try squeezing William Bolcom's Fifth Symphony through your grist mill Bo...maybe when you get done converting it into that 3D sound it will sound tiny enough for you to grasp!
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Some of what you say I agree with, but when you describe instruments as small and focused, that is where we part ways. Sit in front of an orchestra and close your eyes....not much imaging going on. Same goes for most live concerts. I do like imaging in my stereo system, even though it is an exaggeration of reality. A symphony orchestra can not be contained...it breathes, and expands and fills the hall/room. Tympani rool out over the listener. It is awe inspiring....not constrained. |
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I sit about 10ft away myself...speakers are about 11ft apart! |
True...sign of the times. Listen on CT0517...is that your serial number? Your not a robot are you? |
This kind of info only applies to a few of us nuts....and is probably over the head of most average users. Even Wilson Audio relegates this kind of installation info to it's dealers or installation team. |
The 802D3's I heard sounded great but I'm not sure they are $22K great? Can't get over the looks....love the all wood larger cabinets on my older model 802D2's! Mine also seem to have a warmer sound and are more forgiving/musical to my ear. At $15K I thought the 802D series was a good value...at $22K not so much:( |
Enjoy....we have different tastes in what music playback should convey! Cheers |
Anybody find out any information on the crossovers? Seems strange that there is no mention, unlike the D2 series which hilighted the Mundorf Caps etc... Also, the website just took a decided turn toward a Home Theatre vibe! |
Like I said, they made a big deal about the crossover in the 802D2! Not a peep about the 803D3's crossover parts. Also, have you looked at the new website? It exudes mass market! Very little content, no more society of sound etc.. |
In addition the tweeter is now solid body and not tapered tube...something tells me they won't be used in recording studios anymore! |
Lastly, specifications and frequency plots tell you nothing about how they sound..same goes for other gear. It will be interesting to see how they are received over the next year.
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I did say that and it's true...but I also said I likes me some holography in me stereo system. My problem with Bo was that I don't like when the soundstage is squished and the images are small, which is contrary to live music. Imaging itself is cool as long as it is on a scale that convinces me I'm in the presence of live music! |
Listened today to my 802D2's...breaking in my MIT M1.3 cables. Crystal clear, dynamic and 3D sound staging...and the leather is still there bones:) |
I finally listened to the new 802D3's and I have to say, they are one of the best speakers I have ever heard...maybe the best!! Congrats B&W |
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Kot...Macintosh mono blocks and pre with Mac music server. |
