B&K 307 vs. Denon 5800 Debate

Ears for better information on DVD-A go to http://www.digitalaudioguide.com

It seems that very few (if any) players are available and even there are fewer than 40 DVD-A releases available.

This makes a true comparison between SACD and DVD-A very difficult and speculative.

The true "format to own" will be dual format capable and dual capable disks SACD/DVD-A!

The JVC 723GD and the Denon 3300 and the Panasonic A7 are a few that can be found on the net. As far as software goes go to KenCranes.com to the DVD audio section. Some are DAD's but they have DVD-A discs from Warner and 5.1 on there. Also I have a few from DTS that I picked up at the CES show that should be available this month from their website.

Oh btw I say B&K all the way as I own a ref 30 but haven't compared the 5800 side by side with the 307.

I saw some of the debate going on previously so here's a few thoughts about the extent of the upgrades possible.

B&K is hardware and software upgradeable

To upgrade a 5.1 reciever to 7.1 just isn't going to happen as the cost to do it and the practicality of doing it would be harder and more expensive than buying a new receiver. So what is upgradeable?

Now some B&K amps use the same chassis for different channel configuration and to add a channel or two wouldn't be a problem.

B&K is an Alpha site for Motorola and the DSP's could be swappable to add Dolby pro Logic II, SACD or MLP decoding, the dacs on the 307 are also swapable to add 24/192 dacs with the same pinnout. The operating software is also swapable to add things to the current system. MP3 decoding could be added.
B&K gives you this and a great performing product at much less a price than the traditional upgradable companies (Lexicon, Meridian)

I read on Meridian's website once about how they target their products to have a product life (upgradeability) of 5 years. Not saying it's going to break in 5 but that there comes a time when upgrades don't make sense (just like computers)
B&K says the same, that they want there product to last more than one generation before you have to buy a new one.

I think we have hit a point where the technology expansion will slow down. It went so fast when DVD's came out that we first had DD coming and then DTS and THX EX and DTS ES and now all I can see on the horizon is SACD and DVD A and then I think there will be a stability in these things as the technology catches up with DVD. Not that there won't be advances but that they will take some time to come to market as there comes a point where even if it's better consumers won't buy into it (beta).

I think we are hitting that point now with DVDA and SACD as how many of the general consumers are dying to have one? How many know what it is? They are just getting their first DVD player let alone going to get another one to play music.

Just my thoughts.

Phyre3, Finally a reasonable explaination. Thank you!
So what if I bought the high end of the B&K amplifier line (the one with the same chassis as lower end ones) with all the channels... What is my upgrade path? I presume NONE
other than buy new.

Traditional "upgrade" companies upgrade the processors and do not ADD amplifiers to their products. Before home theater, there was never a need to upgrade your stereo to a "trieo?"... Whatever... three channel sound.

My whole point on this issue is that since HT is SO relatively new and formats are changing so often, a firmware upgrade may do nothing becuase in order to
enjoy your new firmware/format, you need additional
hardware to support it.

Just like your point of SACD "upgradability". Upgrading
my Receiver to be able to decode SACD will give me no benefit since my current sources DO NOT READ SACD. The media first must be read before it is decoded.

And... if you buy a SACD player.... guess what comes with it? A DECODER!!! I seriously doubt we'll be seeing SACD transports in the near future. But... who knows, this is a strange industry.

Bwhite,
You make some good points. If you are talking about upgrading a receiver to more channels then yes a firmware upgrade to a format of more channels may not be the best route. But there are other format upgrades besides adding channels.

Yes you are correct that you don't traditionally upgrade amplifiers but processors though many companies are making modular amps to accomodate more channels in the future.

SACD players do come with their own decoding so it may not be worth it for that but Dolby Prologic II is a different story. It is closer to a Discrete 5.1 than any other algorythm and is designed for music as well as music. I would love to hear my broadcasts and VCR tapes and some CDs in this format and from other reports it is going to be great. Of course you may say DD and DTS is better. Well yes but how much 2 channel stuff is out there that will sound great with this?

How about the rumored upgrade of DTS ES to DTS ES discrete. Now there is some real benefit to B&K upgrade program because for a smaller fee I can have my processor upgraded to a Discrete 6.1 system without droping 3K to get a new one. I believe Dolby and DTS have also released upgraded decoding for better performance and there is something else that would be nice.

But yes eventually the upgrade path will be used up and no longer worth doing which gives some of us a perfect excuse to buy new gear. But like I said in my preivous post I don't think your going to see that much more coming out in the way of new formats as the industry has seen a fair share and more than 8 speakers in a room is an impracticality for a great many people no matter how good it sounds. I do think there will be much more integration of the components and that could be the future of av components not adding more channels than 8. A 10.1 channel receiver would be huge and cost a ton if it was any good and a $1000 one would be cheap and probably sound bad so I don't think that the industry is going to jump onto that. I think they will spend more time improving their formats and probably Dolby will introduce a Discrete system as well which B&K should be upgradeable to but you never know for sure right?

Anyway more of my thoughts.