Avantgarde..... Still a contender???


I am thinking seriously about a drastic change in my system.... I am becoming very intrigued with the idea of high efficiency horn speakers and low-powered tube amps. If you look at "My system" you can see that this is a big change from my current set-up. The trouble is I haven't heard many horn designs (but so far really like what I have heard) and wonder if the Avantgardes are still thought of to be state of the art. Can I do better (for less money)? Any input from you SET guy's is very much appreciated. There just aren't very many (any) dealers doing horns in my area so I need some help on this one.

Other issues are:
1. Is my room large enough (21x15x11)?
2. What would be a good amp to start with (without
breaking the bank)?
3. Is there a good low-powered amp that is balanced? Or,
is single ended REALLY the way to go? (the rest of my system is balanced, and I'd love to keep it this way)

OK enough for now.

Thanks

Chris
cmo

Showing 2 responses by 213cobra

I've been through a similar transition. I auditioned Avantagardes. The importer and AG contend they are horns that don't sound like horns. I disagree. They are horns alright, and they unmistakably sound like horns, though less so than any other horn I've heard. It's a revealing, highly defined sound, but fairly frigid. The emotion comes from dynamics, not tone. Personally, I could not live with the more-than-a-trace of horn shout. But that was the secondary inhibitor to purchase. The bigger issue for me was that none of the AG systems sounded truly integrated. I was always conscious of the separate drivers and the imaging and tonal discontinuities between them. You have to get very far away from any AG system to ameliorate this, IMO. Even the cheapie concentric 2-way does this.

I found something much better. Zu Definitions. 101db/w/m, 6 ohms, 16Hz - 25kHz in a 12" x 12" footprint, 49" tall. A pair of full-range drivers handle the 40Hz - 12kHz region and roll off naturally on each end. The main band of the music sees NO crossover or filter elements. A supertweeter rolls in on a simple filter at a 12kHz centerpoint, and an active sub-bass array of 4-10" paper cone drivers is filtered in below 40Hz. This speaker has the transient speed and coherence you're accustomed to in your Martin-Logans, with much better behavior consistency midrange-to-bass, and far more convincing dynamic range.

You have some options on balanced amps but it doesn't always sound better. I suggest you first focus on the amp characteristics you need and treat balanced inputs as a mild preference, not a requirement. Zu Definitions really ought to be listened to at least 9 or 10 feet away, ear to baffle. It looks like you have that distance already assumed.

It's hard to say what amp you should start with, without knowing more about your room and how you listen. But a pair of Audiopax 88 monoblocks would be a terric start and finish. Also, there are some excellent 845 options and a few 300B amps worth considering. The Definition has the efficiency for you to consider something really mouse powered like a 45 tube, but choice narrows and you might not find the bass character you want.

You're welcome to email me for a little back and forth on this if you're interested.

Phil
Actually, the lack of driver integration is part and parcel of the AG Duos and the rest of the line. It's just that not everyone is equally sensitive to this phenomenon. Fine tuned to the nth degree, with perfectly matched associated gear, the characteristic remains and in fact, to me, the more finely tuned an AG system is, the more obvious the lack of driver integration. It is least noticeable when other things are wrong. However, I know not everyone hears this or if they do, they don't care about it. It is an intrinsic quality of the AG series however that makes them unlistenable to me.

Phil