Audio Science Review = "The better the measurement, the better the sound" philosophy


"Audiophiles are Snobs"  Youtube features an idiot!  He states, with no equivocation,  that $5,000 and $10,000 speakers sound equally good and a $500 and $5,000 integrated amp sound equally good.  He is either deaf or a liar or both! 

There is a site filled with posters like him called Audio Science Review.  If a reasonable person posts, they immediately tear him down, using selected words and/or sentences from the reasonable poster as100% proof that the audiophile is dumb and stupid with his money. They also occasionally state that the high end audio equipment/cable/tweak sellers are criminals who commit fraud on the public.  They often state that if something scientifically measures better, then it sounds better.   They give no credence to unmeasurable sound factors like PRAT and Ambiance.   Some of the posters music choices range from rap to hip hop and anything pop oriented created in the past from 1995.  

Have any of audiogon (or any other reasonable audio forum site) posters encountered this horrible group of miscreants?  

fleschler

Showing 5 responses by tantejuut

I read the reviews on ASR and take the measurements seriously. Why wouldn’t I. I am an engineer myself. But there are a lot of parameters that can’t be measured (yet), or people are not up to date with there skills. I am not on the same level as great designers like Nelson Pass of Bruno Putzeys and I love to learn from them and other great designers on diyAudio.

ASR should take a look at DIY audio forum.The problem is the attitude towards ’audiophools’. Not respectful and sometimes plain arrogant, just like some posters on Agon. More modesty and an open mind would be a good thing.

Don’t tell me what I hear or can’t hear, based on "whatever". Some people don’t like exploration and discussion. They just want to be an authority because there ego is to big (and brittle at the same time). There is no 'one nerd to rule them all', we are all just a bunch of nerds with toys.

The problem I have is people telling me what I can not hear. If I hear differences in cables, I want to learn what is happening. If other people tell me that it is impossible and I am delusional, I find that not the right attitude for investigating the parameters for what is causing that effect. (geometry, dielectrics, purity, etc...). 

Good scientists push the envelope, share knowledge and are humble. Measuring things is just measuring. Nothing more, nothing less. Measuring is not a sacred, end to all discussions, type of knowledge.

@prof 

it is not about expertise nor a defensive reaction to scientific explanations. If I hear more detail, I hear more detail. Simple as that.  Calling that delusional is wrong. The assumption that I really don't want to learn is incorrect. I learn everyday. From diyaudio, Agon and ASR. I am an open minded engineer. Maybe iIt is difficult to accept that some people have better hearing skills. Other people have beter measuring skills. 

 

 

 

So tantejuut, is it your contention that, unlike the rest of the human species, you are totally immune from perceptual bias effects?  That you just couldn't be wrong in what you perceive when you "hear" something?

No. The assumptions about my hearing capabilities and my openness to learning sound a bit dogmatic. I think being right is more important then enjoying audio for some people. Have fun measuring while I hallucinate and trip on my silver wires ;)

As I cannot claim to have absolute hearing, another one cannot not claim that my observations are 'wrong' from the start because my observations are not significant enough  (just anecdotal 'evidence'). I A/B a lot, but don't tell me from the start that my observations are delusional. It always comes down to cables because of the tiny advantages there are to gain in contrast with components. Let's asume that I might be right (huh no, the horror), are you willing to learn from my experiences and try to examine and study the differences. Or better, to learn from people like Galen Gareis, Garth Powell or Max Townshend. People that say I am rejecting science are incorrect. I combine technical information and measurement reports with common sense and good hearing/golden ears :)