Audio Science Review = "The better the measurement, the better the sound" philosophy

In a recent discussion there was a comment about the Coincidence 300B Frankenstein MkII. I dug around and found this study that was VERY detailed and yet does it cover every aspect that can be calculated, NEVER!

COINCIDENT FRANKENSTEIN 300B SET AMPLIFIER (high-endaudio.com)
But one thing I wanted to extract was about one particular capacitor. It was a .47 uf Teflon Foil film cap. Now do they measure the same? for most aspects they are identical, but most people know that different manufacturers make their products slightly different and the items that we measure are not even part of the consideration. Like what is the gap on the layers of films? What is the length of the film? There are so many factors that make one just slightly different to another. I can’t tell you haw many times I have played with different caps in my speaker crossovers achieving different results and sometimes a lesser expensive one does something more desirable. On the opposite end, often choosing an elite name like say, Morel over a Solen, well not all Morels are created equal. For a fact there are dozens of different grades of Morel caps of the exact same value, and one might fit the bill very well and another totally creates a trashy sound. It depends on the purpose, the design, the expected outcome... and yes often just plain outright COST effectiveness. Also you need to ascertain how a particular component compliments another. Sometimes one more expensive device might have a slight advantage due to something as simple as the reluctance of the binding post, or a .001 uf difference in capacitance, or the type of architecture of the device. We all know it isn't the most advantageous thing to do by putting Digital components with Valve components. You can't just say because of Ohms or watts or $k something is going to be the best choice and something else I seldom see discussed beyond speaker wires is, How long was a combination of components burned in together before it was given its final sanctification. And don't leave out room treatments.

Thank you Sgreg1, that is one of the biggest reasons I don't even like looking at some of the posts here. This has turned into more of a Trolling site that one for help and education. I find it ironic that people will purchase gear for $100s of thou and think that the great stuff they like bragging about never had any science or engineering behind it. None of that gear was made without carefull adherence to the science, calculations, comparitive measurments, and so much more before the FINAL ear ever heard a single note. Often we can't come up with a particular reasoning as to why something worked the way it did. At least on a moments notice, but that is what the GOTCHA crowd depends on.

@goofyfoot
lets look at your comment in detail. “How would a purchaser know…”
That is really simple, there is this thing called the World Wide Web. I don’t want to sound like I am trolling you, but You asked the question. There is tons of information available on the web for anyone who cares how he spends $100k. For some that might not be a problem and that person is likely going to listen to his pal Joe tell him how he should spend his money. Now that isn’t always a bad thing. If you have shared experiences with a particular person and know what they like and you have similar likes that is good information, but not all have this type of familiarity. O the other hand EVERY manufacturer puts out some sort of fact list on what their equipment does, then after that you start your research.

I know that there is a big push on buying a car on your cell phone never having driven it, but how does that work when you finally get to drive that piece of junk that the previous owner put cork in the transmission to quiet it?

Then I go to a store to TRY to get hands on idea of how a particular system works but that is getting to be impossible as you don’t know what types of accessories are included. How long they have been burnt in together. What kind of JUNK the sales person is expecting you to listen to. I recently went shopping at one of the better and OLDEST stores in Denver and the sales person had NO WEAY of playing the sample disks I took in with me. He couldn’t even pull up the groups or selections on any of his streaming sources. He then asked me what I was using in my current system which I told him my background in designing speakers for over 40 years and that I had some GREAT, full sized towers. So what did he do? He connected some 4” B&Ws. I have nothing against B&Ws but they sounded like 4” bookshelf speakers PERIOD. He by the way lost that sale.  Another shop was able to play my disks but on an Xbox. For Crying out loud. They called themselves a HIGH end Audiophile store. This store I called ahead of time to arrange an APPOINTEMNT and explained EXACTLY what I wanted and expected. They said this sales person is their go to guy for Anthem. He sat me down to listen to some Junk SMALL towers connected and when it couldn’t produce one note below about 80 hz he proclaimed that he had recently taken off the Subs and never ran Diraclive again. Why should I take hours out of my day, drive across multiple counties, and even expect to listen to the JUNK that modern sales people, and I use that term VERY loosely, set up for me to listen to. There are virtually NO PROFESSIONALS anymore.

Now your next comment, “There may be some designers who volunteer that information to the public domain but most do not for a variety of reasons, like not wanting their work to be pirated. “
As stated before there are a multitude of places you can find information. Places like the Audiogon Forums and many more. And concerning piracy, well yes there are some trade secrets but some people actually have a screwdriver and friends who have used their screwdriver and taken the lid off their BLACK BOX to see what is on the inside. Also much of the time all you have to do is look a the products sold like say the idiots at BOSE who have Never had an original idea EVER. Everything they have made is either publically available designs that they have at Best made slight mods too, or hopefully improvements to, and of course the designs that they have outright pirated from others designers. Some examples are the huge variety of slanted and angled speakers that they did not originate but only went off the deep end trying to find something that might work. The Noise canceling headphones which came after MANY years of Aeronautical experimentation on noise canceling tech they created for the Airline industry. And then the Bose boom box with the folded horn design what I believe either JBL or Altec Lansing created the first successful folded horns.

Finally your comment, “Designers have to use testing and measurements to build their products but scientific data isn't what they're selling.” To some extent yo are correct. The final test comes down to personal taste and hearing a product. But as mentioned above how do you go about that? Also some of the best companies use their engineering designs as a MOJOR selling point. I don’t have to go more than about 15 miles from home to visit ‘PS Audio’ of Boulder, CO where they will WOW any learned or beginner with their advanced tech and design, should you desire. They will go into details that most people never knew existed or cared to know about.
 

 So the bottom line is do you care how your money is spent, do you even know what music is? You might not like my Jazz and I might not like head banger tracks. It’s an OPINION. Are you willing to even investigate what you want? How well do your friends opinions and tastes inter into your decisions on products you purchase?

@mikepowellaudio
 As far as your four questions about how precieved things like Soundstage are measured? I guess you don't like or have any room in your life for Diraclive! Which by the way seems to do a pretty dang good job at not only measuring room accoustics, but also Width, Depth, Soundstage and so much more. THis is not saying that I agreed or dissagree with ASR. I wouldn't know one of their people if he fell from the 4th story in front of me. I just think that many of the comments here are as assignine as what ASR is said to quote. The lack of technical knowlege of these people astounds me.

@fleschler I don't know anyting about ASR but the numbers of people on the chat that have no clue about the making of high end audio is astounding. Just like your comment about PRAT. Can you mix metaphores any more? I love PS Ausio's response to that question. That is like comparing Horse power to tire pressure.
https://www.psaudio.com/askpaulvideo/what-is-prat/

I don't mind a helthy back and forth on a topic but this is nonsense for the most part and just more Cancel Culture nonsense form people that I would like to respect but as I told the moderators, it is getting hard to respect many of the people here anymore. Most of the time  I spend trying to bring some ballance to the conversation and I only get called out and told that I don't even know my own words. Like on this very post were one person told me that I actually meant to say something different than what I said. I think I know  what I meant to say.