Analytical or Musical Which way to go?


The debate rages on. What are we to do? Designing a spealer that measures wellin all areas shoulkd be the goal manufacturer.
As allways limtiations abound. Time and again I read designers yo say the design the speaker to measure as best they can. But it just does not sound like music.

The question is of course is: what happens when the speaker sounds dull and lifeless.

Then enters a second speaker that sounds like real music but does not have optimum mesurements?

Many of course would argue, stop right there. If it does not measure well it can't sound good.

I pose the question then how can a spekeer that sounds lifeless be acurrate?

Would that pose yhis question. Does live music sound dull and lifeless?
If not how can we ever be be satisified with such a spseker no matter how well it measures?
gregadd

Showing 5 responses by phusis

05-19-12: Drew_eckhardt
Neither. A speaker has no business editorializing on what you're feeding it "lesee.. a little brighter here, a little boomy there, etc." You should be caught up in the music it's playing and not notice that it's "analytical" or "musical"

Well put, Drew.

Going to live acoustic concerts I sometimes do a little "mind trick" where, as the music in playing, I close my eyes and imagine I'm actually at home listening to my stereo. This way the reference for what is real is somehow more potently exposed as what to go after at home; the memory of or mental inclination telling me (with closed eyes) that I'm sitting listening in front of my home stereo, when in fact a live symphony orchestra is playing in front of me, seems a much more effective tool or "revelator" than sitting at home trying to remember the live experience, and go from there.

They're either not measuring the right things (on-axis response isn't enough with monotonic power decreases into the first reflections also important) or they've compromised to fit market considerations and budgets (two-way cone and dome speakers with flat baffles and conventional cross-over points are inherently flawed as are electrostatic panels) and done the best they can within those constraints.

I can't help but feel that a level a conservatism has sneaked permanently into the design of speakers in the wake of it initially being a consideration to the market. Even some of the very large "top-models" from many speaker brands continue to adhere to the approach taken with the smaller and cheaper models, as if maintaining design integrity is more important than seeking to "perfect" the sound reproduction from a perspective of non-consideration to aesthetics and mass appeal; now that these speakers are as big as they are anyway, perhaps a more rigid form-follows-function aproach would result in a design that was much more appealing than squarish boxes.
05-18-12: Charles1dad
No one denies there are good sounding speakers that also measure well. The question is why do some speaker measure well yet sound poor.Why are there good sounding speakers that measure poorly. The debate lingers.

The crux to me predominantly seems to be questioning in the first place how good sounding speakers can measure poorly. I can understand the engineering perspective in this; however, it exposes the movement of the technical/theoretical side of things having become the benchmark of making speakers at the expense of actually listening with a (live) reference, and that the "listener," undeterred by sonic evidence, still chooses the adherence to theory. In a more general sense it may point at how people are being drawn away from nature; from what is actually natural.
05-11-12: Gregadd
...

I pose the question then how can a spekeer that sounds lifeless be acurrate?

Would that pose yhis question. Does live music sound dull and lifeless?
If not how can we ever be be satisified with such a spseker no matter how well it measures?

I believe you're shortchanging your own questions in presupposing(via questioning) one and the other being entangled, as if marketing strategies and speaker developement hurdles have found a troublesome entry into your dealing with sound, and eventually music. At least it seems to me you've somehow become problematically intertwined with these issues, being, to my mind, that they're irrelevant and not least a potentially restricting factor into your grasp of music. What are you in this regard, a listener "only"? Then try and stop worrying about how to articulate and equate in words self-constructed oppositions like "live=lifeless"(I mean, what?) or how measurements are thought to be a ruling aspect of your listening enjoyment. These are aspects the ones selling and marketing this stuff are dealing with; don't make them yours. Make listening to music your OWN deal, something marketers and developers would THEN have to deal with. If live music is something you cherish then I would recommend that you attend more live concerts, give into them fully, and gradually "build up" a resoir of experience that more firmly grounds you in a reference point to go by when choosing the equipment to reproduce your (growing) collection of music. I'd say, whipe the board clean and forget about measurements and what can and can't be sold.
Gregadd -

Sorry, my post above is likely out of your context and "flavored" with my own presumptions. It makes it seem as if you are somehow in "trouble" with your questions, which I have no right to assume nor was it my true intention. I guess I simply wanted to instill the feeling of being less at odds with prevailing theories on speaker design and marketing, and cue up the more personal approach to, and trust in sound and music itself; get rid of marketing retorics and price hierarchy, and see their jobs as befitting themselves. Something like that..
On the Speakers front page at the very bottom, why is this thread suddenly relegated to having had the latest post on New Year's Eve Day '69???