Well guy's, I have high regard for both of your opions, I never thought about running a Technics SP10 MKII in the nude. I do have one that I just bought.
Raul what is your idea for a arm pod, what do you use material wise?
I will try this and see.
As for looks Im not too concerned,if it works very well then maybe do some cosmedic dress up.
Lewm I know you like the performance of your big DD Kenwood and someday I will have one also. I do have a Kenwood 990 that will be run with x frame only with the exception of a swinging arm board attached.
Anyhow these projects look to be a load of fun.
David |
Everyone thank you for your comments and for some of you here for sharing your hard work and effort into this hobby on this site
Though at times some of the threads read like a Republican Democrate debate of sorts though there is something for everyone on this site to follow or criticise this is ok
My experience of using direct drive table is coming up soon,first one is the Kenwood 990 in the nude with a swinging arm board off the x frame and a kick ass arm, FR 64s Up next when all checked over will be a Technics SP10MKII tried nude and with heavy vibration obsorbing plinth
Sounds like fun to me. |
Raul ,is there any chance of seeing some pictures of your nude sp10?I just can't wrap my mind around exaclly what you done and I thank you.
Regarding TT mats I have a Micro cu180 my question, is this mat too heavy for the bearing of a sp10mkii? |
Raul is there anyway of seeing pictures of your nude sp10?
Looking at this whole project of vintage DDs from a first time perspective further research I gather Steve Dobbins and Albert Porter chose their plinth material for very specific reasons that go beyond a knuckle wrap test.
Soft slate for Mr.Dobbins design and panzerholz plywood for Mr.Porter. My question did you guys use any sciencetific tests choosing this material? |
Lewm the topic in general has attracted over 3000 views thus far,impressive to me or is this pretty much the norm?
I think this thread may have the potential of some great information and learning,even if the topic has drifted off course
David |
Yes it is the Micro Seiki mat,what mats have you guys tried and liked with the sp10mkii? |
Here is some info for you DIYers that are interested in trying panzerholz .First some back ground info
BKB Industries out of Ontario Canada imports this specialty ply direct from Germany by the skid/ship load
The applications which panzerholz is used mostly heavy industry to Formula 1 including armor car applications ect.
Specification example ,product code B15 @ 2130 mm x 1000 mm x 30 mm, density 87lb/3feet so thats just under 7 feet long by 39 inches wide by 1 inch thick, weight about 130 + pounds cost just under $600.00
Request for sanding @ tolerance of + - 0.3 mm is extra under &20.00
B25 many more laminated layers and weighs in more is $700.00 + a sheet
Now if you wanted or even could buy a single sheet you have to realize what something of this size and weight would cost to ship to your door if it was not feasible for pick up
Briefly speaking with BKB they tell me they have had inquires from individuals from the DIY audio hobby for single sheet purchases ranging in all available thickness all the way to 100mm thick sheets OK looking at the specs of that 30mm thick b15 sheet you need a fork lift for that 100mm thick one and then what.
BKB did indicate to me if there were a standard thickness and size wanted by individuals they would consider a package size and amount cut and sanded but then again size and thickness of b15 or b25 would have to be agreed upon among DIYers in this hobby, another dilemma?
I do have some woodworking skills picked up as a pass time hobby and I understand with further conversation with BKB this panzerholz is not easy to work with and its not just the weight im talking about
On Mr.Porters page here on Audiogon he did briefly mention the difficulty of cutting this plywood, it will dullen the best carbide cutting edges quickly
Another key fact when cutting is using a varible speed carbibed cutting tool used at low rpm,maybe a over head router if you happen to have one sitting around.
Something to think about before calling BKB |
Lewm being a wood base product I think using a waterjet cutter would adversely effect it. BKB did send me via email a product information form outlining specific use of carbide cutting tools,polyurathane adhesives only to be used and to seal the product against moisture, swings in temperature and humidity ect once all cutting is completed
I also thought about a constrained layer plinth using soft slate and panzerholz and yes I agree the panzerplywood would not be easy to obtain and in the end may prove too much for the typical DIY to work with, Mr.Porters plinths look to be a good alternative his pricing for material cost labour intensive job as such leaves little for making much profit. At first glance it looks like a simple thing to make but don't bet on it |
Lewm and John what you say makes sense to me I'll pass on using the micro and try something close to the weight of the original mat when I get to that stage
Mikelavigne interesting line up of arms and tables I take it one or two in your line up plays large scale music better then other? |
Logenn both your Technics tables and your Gerrard did you change over to panzerholz plinths from other custom plinths? |
Logenn thank you for your response Yes good a.c. when its bad everything suffers |
Mr Weiss lovely work you do. Your choosen plinth material Pennsyvinia soft slate did you select by scienctific methods or guessing this material maybe be good and simply trying it. |
Initially Albert favoured a Technics MK2 model in a newly constructed plywood plinth then later moved onto panzerholz with much differant results
It was also pointed out over the course of time some of Alberts listening group involved also switched from their long standing turntable preference to a MK 2 or model 3 Technics.
Some of you here have multipal direct drive and prefer other brands over the Technics sp line
Common knowledge among us here simply points to personal preference's,and as Mike Lavigne points out,choose your colourations wisely |
Albert and Jonathan, Just out of curiosity regarding your chosen plinth material Did either of you use or have commissioned any sort of measuring test on panzerholz and soft slate?
I ask this because of the near endless material one could choose from for a mass loaded constrained layer plinth be it man made and or ftom mother nature
My research these past few weeks into the history of speciality plinths shows a long list of methods and material from manufactures and especially the DIY communities that goes back decades
I just find this whole subject of vintage record players interesting that in these modern times one can in some cases like yours Albert advance their vinyl play back using select material with a vintage tt.
On a final note Jonathan mentioned above a denon cartidge body made of panzerholz indeed interesting material. |
Jonathan Im well aware why a musician would want to play these irremplacable instruments. Im sure these master craftsmen centuries ago did have a method of tests but long forgotten.
Why not put them on display and have a new one built for a tiny fraction of the cost? If needed to try to replicate the tone of these old instruments, ancient wood is available to purchase today
I simply asked,please read above again and I,m not looking for a fight its just that I disagree about test methods.
250 pounds of mass loading with slate is one method to do I guess and Alberts plywood plinth for his sp10mk2 was the beginning of the end to his Walker table.
To have answers why these vintage tables react so positive to certain material and built methods would be of interest would it not? |
