845 Tube vs KT90


Thinking about auditioning/purchasing a 845 mono block, may cost me big money, so i'd like a few ideas on what to expect from the 845 tube image.
I have a Jadis OR with KT90 and really offers me pretty much what i love in my classical music, each orch section is heard distinctly from the others, IOW the sound stage has presence. However I've heard such wonderful comments about the "king of all tubes" the 845.
I'm wondering though, will the single 845 tube deliver the same separation of fq's as well as the dynamics of the mids are separate from the highs and lows. I do not like at all the image presented by the KT88 tube, nor the 300B tube for classical. Both from my experience have presented classical/orch as a flat one dimensional sound. A total flop.
For light rock , jazz, blues these tubes seem to be best.
So what should I expect from the 845 on classical, though I realize not every 845 amp will present the same image, inner components quality also play a big role. Just looking for general characteristcs as concerns the separtion of the 3 main fq's/lows/mids/highs.
bartokfan

Showing 1 response by arendtallie

I can't comment on the KT90 tubes, but I do have some experience with 845 tubes in different set-ups, and I think it could be of help.
A while ago I borrowed a well-designed and well-built pair of 845 SET monoblocks from a befriended dealer. It had 300B's with anode choke as driver, and a 6SN7 first stage. On his own speakers they performed well. On my ESL57's they gave a very flat soundstage, same as you describe. Even the general direction of the instruments was very vague. The instrumental timbres were not natural; everything sounded alike.
Earlier I had borrowed a 300B SET (again with 6SN7 as first stage), and that gave the same results.
But: I have also listened to 845 push-pull monoblocks (Mingda MC300845-AB) on my speakers for a few hours. Apart from being a push-pull amp, the tube line-up was very much the same as the 845 SET's: Anode choked 300B as drivers, first stage with 6SN7, and no global feedback. The result was fantastic, with good depth and placement, and a very good rendering of the instrumental timbre. The most lively and involving sound quality I have experienced so far, while the other amps with exactly the same tubes were the biggest disappointments I ever had.
The only reason I didn' buy them is that I can't stand the sight, especially with their protection cages. Every now and then I still think of buying them and have something different made.

Same as other people have commented: It's not just the type of tube that means success or failure. I do have some idea what it is that makes the difference with my speakers. ESL57's are a reactive load, so the amps needs to be able to deliver a good peak current. That makes SET's not very good candidates, because they are low-powered amplifiers with a relatively high output impedance. The push-pull 845 amp had 70 Watts, so could still deliver enough peak current despite its high output impedance. My own Fisher SA16 (EL84 push-pull) has low power but with a very low output impedance, which also makes it work well. Until it runs out of steam in really big orchestra pieces, that is...
I can't really explain how this translates into things like soundstage, so it's not a proven fact but an idea that seems to make sense. And, I am not familiar with your speakers so perhaps your experiences will be different if you would try an 845 PP amp. Don't jump to conclusions just because I had a good experience with these.

The best thing is to listen to as many different types of amps as you can on your own speakers. I hope you have a few friendly dealers near you. Learn what works well or not: SET's, push pull, OTL, high or low power, whatever. And trying to get an idea what makes the difference can help you find your way through the wilderness.
I take my speakers to the dealer if he won't give anything on trial, which is not very practical with ESL's but well worth it in the end.