2. speakers
  3. 124249-1529

2 subs in a small room?

I recently added a REL T/5i sub to my system and have been very happy with the results.  Integration was a breeze and I am now more engaged in my music than ever.  So of course being a typical audiophile, I got to thinking if 1 sub sounds this good will 2 sound even better?  The challenge is my room.  Its very small at 9' w x 10' l x 9' h.  The back wall is about 3' high, above which it opens up to the rest of my house.  I have bass traps in this room.  Right now, using just 1 sub, my freq response from 20-1000hz is +- 2db with a -4db dip at 200hz and a +4db hump at 40hz.  Not perfect but my system still sounds amazing.

I know the general consensus is a second sub will sound better but I am concerned with the size of my room.  Will adding a second sub in such a small space over power it or will it actually help to smooth out nodes?


128x128tboooe

Showing 10 responses by tboooe

tboooe's avatar
tboooe OP
1,009 posts
 
Can someone pls describe what the benefit of adding a second sub would be over having just one? Is the bass tighter, deeper, clearer, etc?  Is the rest of the frequency range also improved somehow?
tboooe's avatar
tboooe OP
1,009 posts
 
Thank you for the great response martykl.  So how hard is it to integrate a second sub?  I have read from others that setting up a second sub is difficult and an EQ is a must.  
tboooe's avatar
tboooe OP
1,009 posts
 
martykl, I do have an SPL meter but I have been thinking about using room correction with something like DIRAC.  At the very minimum I am going to get a USB mic and measure properly measure my room using Room EQ Wizard.

jafant, I appreciate the compliment.  Long Duc Dong is my personal hero.
tboooe's avatar
tboooe OP
1,009 posts
 
lancelock, may i ask where you placed the second sub relative to the first?  I understand the second one should not be placed in the same mirrored location.  
tboooe's avatar
tboooe OP
1,009 posts
 
perfectpathtech, may I ask where you placed the second sub relative to the first? I  know each room is different but I am just trying to get a feel for sub placement.
tboooe's avatar
tboooe OP
1,009 posts
 
perfectpathtech7 posts04-22-2016 3:08pm
I recently went from a single to stereo pair of subs, wanted to move more air, what I was not prepared for was the startling effect on midrange to high frequencies! More detail, wider stage, no joke it was jaw dropping. The explanation I found was there is a phase shift from summing 2 channels into one sub, or mono, masking information, had I known this years ago would have done a pair right from the start I second meerzistar’s advice!
Forgive perhaps the dumb question. I assume what you heard in the mids and highs are only present when the subs are playing low frequencies which is not all the time. So does that mean for parts of the music when there is no low freq information you do not have the improvement you described? Or is the improvement due to you crossing over your speakers at a higher freq?

I understand the idea the idea that multiple subs can help to smooth out modes but of course subs can only do this when they are outputting sound at and below the crossover point right? If the music I am listening to do not information at and below the cross over point throughout the song then will I hear differences in the mids and highs depending on if my subs are outputting sound?
tboooe's avatar
tboooe OP
1,009 posts
 
ptrck8874 posts04-22-2016 7:15pmI have 2 Rel G2's integrated with a pair of Sonus Faber stand mounts driven by a pair of McIntosh 601 mono blocks.  Tons of power for a treated 11'x 16' listening room.  The REL's are crossed over 55 and volume quite low at 8 to 10 on the REL volume setting. 
Do you mind if I ask which Sonus Faber monitors you have?  I have the Evolutions and cross mine over at around 35hz.  At least in my room the Evolutions have a flat response down to about 40hz.  BTW, the G2s are crazy! 
tboooe's avatar
tboooe OP
1,009 posts
 
martykl3,308 posts04-23-2016 8:37amTbooe,

I find that there is usually a major improvement in the upper bass and much of the mid-range (say the two octaves below middle A and a fair bit of the octave above) when you get the subs integrated properly.  "Properly", in this case, includes smoothing frequency response thru the x-over point.  That smoothing can be done with more subs, EQ, or room correction (or any combo of the above).

I can't specify exactly why, but I'd speculate that it's probably a matter of cleaning up hash and overhang around/above the crossover point. 
 Based on your explanation does that mean these improvements to the mid and upper base is only present where the subs are actually outputting sound, assuming I am not using EQ, room correction, or digital Xover?  If so, when the subs are not smoothing out the sound with their output, that the improvements to the mid and upper base is not present?  Since there is not sub information throughout a song, does that then mean the mid and upper base will have inconsistent sound depending on whether or not the subs are outputting anything?
tboooe's avatar
tboooe OP
1,009 posts
 
Thanks guys.  I am just trying to understand the phenomena people describe that subs can help with other areas of the freq response.  To me, this can only happen if the sub is outputting something unless you are using an EQ or room correction.  Anyway, I am going to buy a usb mic and use REW to measure my room.  I am curious to see how the freq response looks.  Regardless, I am very happy with the way my room sounds now after re-positioning my speakers and adding 1 sub.  I will definitely plan on adding a second one later this year once funds become available.  Merry xmas kids!
tboooe's avatar
tboooe OP
1,009 posts
 
perfectpathtech8 posts04-26-2016 8:51am ...The improvement in the upper end is a 
constant regardless of whats played.  
Thank you for the reply and I hope the wife feels better.  
This last comment is what gets me so confused.  I get how a sub can help with smoothing out the sound when playing.  But in the absence of a xover or room correction, how can a sub help with other areas of the freq range when it is not outputting sound?  I am assuming of course that during a song, the sub is not always playing anything.  What am I missing here?
More to discover