Would Like To Hear From Strain Gauge Owners

Dan: Btw, which is your point?, please try to enrich the thread and tell us something " new " and coherent on the main subject, I think that we could learn if you do it.

regards and enjoy the music.
raul.

Raul, my point is that you have shared your opinions rather strongly about your business competitors product in a public forum that is read by people all around the world without once even mentioning that fact. Peter clearly identified himself, why don't you do him the same courtesy?

I have not disputed, nor do I disagree with, much of what you have to say regarding the RIAA curve and the strain gauge implementation.

I completely agree with you. I am not qualified to debate the merits of strict adherence to the RIAA curve, which you constantly tout as one of the major features of your own product. Nope, I won't do it. But I will offer up this link to a thread for those who really want to know other opinions besides just yours.

What Makes a Good RIAA or Line Stage?

That's it, I'm done. For me to continue in this thread will only offer Raul more excuses to hijack this thread even more.

This thread has veered off in a weird direction. Here's my attempt to inject some objectivity and balance.

I own a Soundsmith Strain Gauge and have also had the opportunity of playing The Voice cartridge in my system. Further, I've heard others' Strain Gauges in five different systems/rooms.

What the Strain Gauge cartridge does uniquely is track better, with less groove noise and better transient response than any cartridge I have heard, period.

Talking with Mr Ledermann, I believe this is due to the very low effective moving mass - of the order of a tenth of the best moving coil. With so little inertia, it is inevitable that the stylus traces more accurately. A consequence of the lower moving mass is the cantilever assembly's resonant frequency is way out of the audio band. It is thought by many that what we perceive as groove noise is in fact resonances from the cantilever/stylus assembly.

To shed some light on the RIAA debate - my understanding is that the strain gauge, being a displacement device, has an inherent roll off of 6 dB/octave. Mr Ledermann has made an engineering decision that the cartridge's frequency response is sufficiently close to the RIAA curve that it does not require equalisation within the preamplifier.

So the preamplifier contains only gain stages. This means an absence of reactive components in the signal path (i.e. capacitors - which introduce phase shifts). The argument (to which I subscribe) is that the ear is far more sensitive to time/phase anomalies than frequency response anomalies. Let's face it, even the best "reference" speaker has a response curve that looks like a mountain range - with way more influence on what we hear than a deviation from the RIAA curve!

In my view, RIAA compliance is a red-herring (unless you are promoting a product that has it as its main selling point). Choosing a product on its RIAA performance would be like checking the temperature inside your fridge before deciding what to wear outside.

So, what's the consequence of Mr Ledermann's design choice? I would say better insight, a total absence of "veiling" with remarkably precise image placement and three-dimensionality and a sense of "rightness."

Let me share an experience that I think illustrates the paradigm shift that the Strain Gauge represents. I was invited to take my unit to the home of a highly respected British audio reviewer (he writes for Stereophile plus several UK audio magazines). On intial hearing he was quite uncomfortable because "it didn't sound like vinyl."

He played some reference LPs and then compared them to his current reference - a Japanese moving coil. He then fired up his custom modifed CD player, which he regards as the best in the world. He played the same reference cuts on CD then on the Strain Gauge. His conclusion was the Strain Gauge was better than his CD player and got closer to the master tape than anything else he had heard.

I think this illustrates the difference between the Strain Gauge technology and all other phono cartridges. I can understand some comments about it sounding like digital - you do get the detail and speed of digital but it's way better than CD - it is less fatiguing to listen to (none of the hardness of CD) and there is a delicacy and nuance in the higher frequencies that is totally absent from CD.

On many LPs, The Voice runs the Strain Gauge very close. It doesn't quite have the same ability to extract the last detail and nuance and it isn't quite as explosively dynamic. However, due to it having the same stylus and cantilever and a lower effective moving mass than a moving coil, it shares the same traits and strengths as the Strain Gauge.

I believe it is the "softening" effect of the magnetic induction process with The Voice (remember the Strain Gauge is literally measuring precisely the undulations in the groove whereas there will always be some third order distortion product in a magnetic circuit) which leads some audiophiles to prefer it, however for me, the Strain Gauge is the more faithful and compelling component.

Finally, I would say that the Strain Gauge is not for everyone. I have a friend who listens mostly to 70s/80s rock music - he brought along a Yes LP, and that sort of compressed, distorted music doesn't really utilze the strengths of the Strain Gauge.

I would recommend anyone interested to listen and make their mind up for themselves. I had the advantage of hearing and deciding I wanted one before there were reams of audiophile drivel posted online about the product.

I will be glad to respond; please forgive the slowness of it, or if I do not respond further as I am only now back from the hospital yesterday, after 5 weeks of serious pneumonia, and am very weak and shaky. I simply do not have the strength or time to read/respond blogs, but so many have called me to bring my attention to this one. I have healing, and some reading work to do and to get back to real work hopefully soon.

Firstly let me say that I am in full agreement with the comments in this blog of not identifying yourself as a manufacturer. That should calibrate anything you have to say, period. Most manufacturers who have been in this industry for any length of time, as I have for 38 years, know the rules: never say anything publicly, or privately, about anyone else’s product. It is called etiquette, and not shooting yourself in the foot, or a bit higher. One must realize how small this industry is. Attacking products is not only counter-productive as it causes of loss of credibility, but it can misinform those who are trying to learn as well as damage what is left of a tiny industry. You may want to check this with some notables in the industry and not just take my word for it.

To your question. Is the Strain Gauge designed to conform with RIAA – of course it is. Please review my credentials in the industry as engineer at RAM audio, Director of Engineering at Bozak, Senior research engineer at the IBM T.J. Watson research labs, and owners/design of Soundsmith for over 38 years where I have taught and produced many speaker, amplifier, preamplifier, and cartridge products, including now over 40 magnetic cartridge designs.

I am aware that I have “stupid” tattooed on my forehead, an event that happened many years ago in a Galaxy far, far away that I do not care to be reminded about. But why would I go to all the trouble to produce a cartridge and preamp system that doesn’t conform to RIAA? Suicidal maybe???

RIAA conformation. I own and use two Neumann Lathes for a charity project called DirectGrace records. It is intended to rescue children from forms of slavery, including child prostitution, something that occurs as I sure you are aware in large numbers in Mexico City. The Neumann lathes have “adjustments” for RIAA to keep the system tweaked to “conform” as it can and does drift. So do the lacquer masters on which we cut, which change the response. So does the plating and stepped processes to make a stamper, as do the vinyl and pressing parameters used make a record. You may want to speak to real folks like my friend Lincoln Mayorga, who well understands how this arduous process can lead far off RIAA. But I deviate more than .1 dB –

Tone arm interactions can vary RIAA performance quite a bit. So what do you have when you are done?? If you are tweaking for RIAA for .1dB, try tightening the headshell screws and re-measuring. Or maybe mass load the headshell and try again. Or adjust the azimuth, VTF or SRA. You are aiming at a moving target. Are you moving your preamp gun constantly??? It seems it is aimed at me right now.

I have measured the SG in many arms, and recently in my Schroder Reference SG, the new SG design (which you did not hear) it was +/- 1dB from 50 Hz to 12K in conformation with RIAA. And you know what?? I cried when the record was over.

The rest is magic.

Peter Ledermann./President/Soundsmith

Dear Slowlearner: +++++ " Attacking products is not only counter-productive.... " +++++

first than all I'm not attaking the SG, what I'm saying and confirm here is that IMHO it does not conform according the RIAA eq standard: I respect your opinion that it do it but everything you have in your web site and what you posted here tell nothing precise about.

All the " history/facts " that you posted on the RIAA response deviations with changes in VTF or VTA or with a different tonearm is our " bread of everyday " and this is not the subject because what you are saying is that why take care on the RIAA eq. deviation when there are so many deviations all over the audio chain, well that is a point of view that I respect but certainly I don't agree because I think that we must care the audio signal at any single link in the audio chain trying to loose the less and adding the less too.

I know that your trade-offs and music sound reproduction priorities are unique and different from the ones I support but things are that I heard the SG in a very good audio system ( with low system distorions ) and I heard there against a MC cartridge with the same LPs and from that very first moment, and way before I knew that the SG does not conforms with the RIAA standard eq ( I know/understand this in the last 48 hours ), I don't like the overall SG performance against other MC/MM cartridges that I heard and I told this to the SG owner inclusive I remember that we play with a LP that are one of my reference LPs ( Janis Ian/P. Barber ) trying to hear something that the SG was loosing in the HF, even Steve modified a little the VTA and things improve a little but never with the definition that I'm accustom on it but this is not the whole history about, only an example. Today I undertand why the SG has not that HF definiton I'm talking about and why its performance is so un-natural.

I don't take care why its sound is so different till two days ago when I made some research about.

+++++ " it was +/- 1dB from 50 Hz to 12K in conformation with RIAA " +++++

Peter, you made an " assault " to my intelligence, common sense and knowledge with that statement.

first the RIAA eq standard frequency range figure is : 20hz to 20khz not the range you measure.

second are you saying that a very high ( IMHO always ) 2 ( two ) db deviation goes in conformation with RIAA when almost all the phono stages out there that conforms according to the RIAAA standard are in no more than 0.5 db?,
from your point of view I have to assume that if in the future any other different " cartridge " device with say: 5-10 db on RIAA deviation can/could conforms with it?, my God!

Peter IMHO if exist an audio link where every tyni frequency deviation is showing it is on the phono stage through its curve RIAA eq. deviation where any single frequency deviation affects almost three octaves!!!!!, you can hear deviation on the 0.1db range ( at least ) and you are telling me that 2db is the way to go but more important that this is that you say that comforms with the RIAA eq. standard !! ??????????????

Here it is a link where another person that I respect ( like you ) and that I think is very " responsible " and with a high knowledege about and he was asking ( in different words ) and questioning almost the same I'm and from my point of view it does not matters to ask because if we don't ask how we can learn or be sure on anything?:
http://forum.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/fr.pl?aamps&1201835625&openflup&13&4#13

Peter I don't have any single/simple/minute attitude to attack you in anyway so don't put on " defense ", I'm only trying to have things in the right perpective ( Dan: believe it or not ) because at this moment my " common sense " still tell me that the SG is an additional source device but not an alternative to other MC/MM cartridges, I will consider it an alternative to MC/MM cartridges when your design conforms correctly in a precise way with the RIAA eq. standard.. Peter why don't try it, seems to me that that could be great and a very good alternative.

Peter, one way or the other almost all of us are in the same " boat/ship " and we are looking for almost the same main quality audio music sound reproduction performance targets.

Regards and enjoy the music.
Raul.