Building high-end 'tables cheap at Home Despot II


“For those who want the moon but can't afford it or those who can afford it but like to have fun and work with their hands, I'm willing to give out a recipe for a true high-end 'table which is easy to do, and fun to make as sky's the limit on design/creativity! The cost of materials, including 'table, is roughly $200 (depending, more or less), and add to that a Rega tonearm. The results are astonishing. I'll even tell/show you how to make chipboard look like marble and fool and impress all your friends. If there's interest I'll get on with this project, if not, I'll just continue making them in my basement. The next one I make will have a Corian top and have a zebra stripe pattern! Fun! Any takers?”

The Lead in “Da Thread” as posted by Johnnantais - 2-01-04

Let the saga continue. Sail on, oh ships of Lenco!
mario_b
Hi Lew, no, the issue as far as I understand it and understood back in the day was that servo-control is reactive, meaning that it reacts to deviation from absolute speed stability (whatever tolerance) and corrects, thus bringing with it an endless hunk-and-seek as it never achieves perfect speed stability (this was the argument anyway, as experience shows the system had its advantages ;-)). The advantage of quartz-locking was that it was not reactive, the quartz "signal" being the independent Reference, and so divorced from the antics caused by stylus force drag, and not reactive. I notice that in this respect, the Technics SP-10 MKII has lots of torque, so stylus force drag or not an issue (but, the quartz-locking reference is itself a problem, as it is audible), and the quartz-locking itself thus more effective (i.e. a true reference signal).
10-4 Jean - got it! Cut once and if it is too short cut it again :0)

About the Decca metal tonearm - can you post a pic or a link to this model. I have seen many Decca arms for sale since you talked about it but I dont recognize the difference plastic one and the metal one.

I agree about the VPI arms - every one says they are a great bargain but no one ever mentions them as a contender for being one of the best in any specific circumstance. I liked my 12" enough that I never upgraded it. I am even a little skeptical about the newest undamped version.

Regarding the Decca carts, until a few weeks ago, I was unaware that Ikeda makes a similar line of cantilever-less cartridges for what seems like slightly less money. I lost an auction for one in Australia last week.

Mike
Lew, I was notified that you had asked about a DP80 in this thread. As you may know, I fully restored a DP80 awhile back. From a purely listener's standpoint, the DP80 "sounds" every bit as good as any of the Lencos I've built - and better than some. In fact, it with a Kuzma Stogi Reference and Sumiko Celebration is one of five tables I own and one that I turn to as often than not (Not Mentor, 2 Lencos, and a Garrard 301 being the other three). Of course, this could owe to plinth materiasl, arm/cart combos, etc., etc., etc. I cannot tell you the technical reasons for speed adjustment of the DP80 like I could the Lenco, but I do know what I hear. For what it's worth, and all that. :)

If you'd like more detail than this forum will allow, please e-mail me. I post here such that others having your same general question may have intertest salved or, better yet, piqued!
Hi Mike, sorry, my digital camera was destroyed by a grain of sand (while my '70s Nikon FM falls off of speeding motorcycles with nary an effect) during my travels. The Heavy Metal Decca can be recognized by its "futuristic-looking" headshell, sloped with holes drilled out of it to minimize mass, somewhat like the Hadcock headshells. The pillar also sports a cylindrical bubble-level as opposed to the circular one of the more common plastic one. The main pillar is much longer and made of steel, and the cable is detachable 5-pin DIN with a heavy-duty spring-collet. Finally, the counterweight is also drilled out with two holes through is and is assymmetrical so it can be used to correct/balance azimuth.

I had always thought the Ikedas were more expensive, but with the new expensive models and the rise in prices, the Ikedas may be becoming a bargain. It would be great to hear one on a Lenco/JMW combo!!

I'm about to test out a new Garrard 401/SME V combo to see how it fares against a Lenco/Dynavector 507 MKII/Dyna 17D MKIII. In my experience so far, it seems the 401 is actually superior to the far more expensive Garrard 301 grease-bearing (we're not talking a Crushing, but instead a matter of slightly more Lenco-like fluidity) we'll see what happens in further testing.

On the subject of the Technics SP-10 MKII and quartz-locking, Technics' SP-10 MKI was servo-controlled, and I would LOVE to get my hands on one of these! Nevertheless, the main bearing of the Sony 2250/2251 is about the best I've ever come across (about as good as the superb Roksan main bearings), far better than that on other DDs or indeed anything else at all I've tested, which might give it some important advantage, not to mention OF COURSE its Direct Coupling-friendliness. We'll see how it fares in testing against other DDs with time. As always, careful application of Direct Coupling and high mass, and reliance on one's ears and against prejudice in all its forms (i.e. the penchant to automatically assume that expensive exotic materials sound better than the tried-and-true utterly tonally neutral and dynamically monstrous Russian birch-ply/MDF recipe; the penchant to again equate price-tag with final results - i/e/ EMT better than anything, Garrard better than Lenco, Unobtainium better than Obtainium etc. - in fact all forms of Audio-as-Status; and various forms of axe-grinding which do nothing but continue to muddy the waters and slow down actual progress and honest discoveries, and so on and so forth Ad Infitinitum and especially Ad Nauseum) will lead to true progress in design and results, both for the DIYer and in the industry.

As George on Cyprus was always fond of saying, engineering is about engineering TO A PRICE, which is to say, that if it takes $100K to match via, say, Oh, it's on the tip of my tongue...yes!, a Belt-Drive!, a MUCH cheaper idler-wheel drive (and even DD, which at $20K or perhaps much less - given the riddance of expensive circuitry/bandaid - should be able to outperform, correctly designed, a $100K Belt-Drive), then the Belt-Drive design is ultimately an engineering FAILURE. Similarly, as I've often written, if a steam-driven automobile can be made to match the top speed of a combustion engine, but it will weigh 100 tons (several obscenely-priced high-mass belt-drives come to mind) and cost $100,000,000, then it is, quite simply, the inferior system. Until the DD is done correctly, the jury's out on whether or not it can be made to match the superb results of a Giant Direct Coupled and carefully-restored/rebuilt/tuned idler-wheel drive, which relies on pure analogue speed stability rather than tricksy electronic bandaids to achieve speed stability which does not offend the human ear/brain. Of course, as opportunities arise (any of these DD legends materialize in my greedy hands), you can rely on me to faithfully and honestly report on actual results. The Lenco and the Sony are both a HUGE wake-up call on what's important in vinyl playback, the Lenco because it slays pretty well anything on the planet, the Sony because it demonstrates the audibility of quartz-locking/sampling frequencies to maintain speed stability (ditto the analogue Lenco).

Finally, don't forget the Uber Directive all, have fun!! So, a 'table with superior PRaT and liveliness is ALWAYS better than a 'table which majors on analysis at the expoense of the MUSIC (which should, it goes without saying, be musical, anything less being a severe colouration/flaw), and so kills the music. Not that State of the Art results in terms of detail and so forth cannot be achieved with a trusty old idler-wheel drive ;-). Have fun all, and have a good weekend! Now, to mount that Black Widow and see how the AKG P8ES fares....:-).
Thanks - Jean. I think I'll sand on my GIANT #2 tomorrow. You know what I mean :)

MIke