Evolvist,
Sounds like you fellas had a lot of fun and I enjoy reading a true evaluation of gear and not just speculation that some folks write.
Did you guys play Little Wing by chance,that's one of my favorites.
I've been wanting to hear the Ahb2 amp and may have the opportunity to borrow one locally in the near future.
Kenny.
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Evolvist,
I emailed Eric 2 days ago because I'm curious about the Mini Ulf's myself,I haven't received a reply yet.
I'm not sure he has the design that far along.
I will be looking for replacement speakers for my 2nd system in the future no great hurry.
Kenny.
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evolvist,
Nice info on the electrons,do you know when that review maybe printed or posted.
My opinion about speaker breakin is the passive parts in the crossovers need more time to settle and form and most drivers breakin quite quickly.Anytime that I have changed parts in a speakers crossover It's like starting over again in sound till they get some time on them.
Kenny. |
teajay,
Very nice article that was well written,
Gets me motivated to sale off some extra gear in my collection,I can't keep everything,and get a pair of the Eml 300b Xls tubes for my Yamamoto A09s.
Kenny.
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Lance,
Very nice to read of the great sound you are hearing from your system,I would like to know how the sound your getting would differ if you put your MZ2S back in with the AHB2.
Kenny.
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muzikmann,
Lance uses adapters for this pairing,
This has been mentioned before.
I've used my MZ2S with all kinds of SS amps and I have used adapters as well when necessary.
Kenny. |
Here is the main reasons to use the Benchmark brand Xlr to Rca adapters,
SPECIAL WIRING TO REDUCE HUM AND INTERFERENCE:
Back-referenced audio ground - for common-mode rejection
Star-quad conductors - for magnetic immunity
Dedicated shield connection - for immunity to ground loop problems
RCA center pin to star-quad + to XLR pin 2
RCA ring to star-quad - to XLR pin 3
RCA ring to shield braid to XLR pin 1
These are also the most cost effective product on the market that I have seen and used.
Kenny. |
porscheracer,
Looking good and sounding good You said.
I would say in another 150hrs everything should be at It's best for you and maybe you could give us a update.
Enjoy the music,
Kenny.
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twoch,
"Corelli,
Everything i said was true
So the little Nazi monitor
Removed my post. Because he wants to control free true speech"
What was your all important post that got removed?
Kenny.
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james_w514
"The DI's are so fast I don't see the sense in having panels"
Me either,Offcourse I don't have the correct sized room since moving to a smaller house 3yrs ago.
The DI's are perfect in image size,not larger than life but also not to small,just right.
Kenny.
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Lance,
"I'm pretty sure Mark has talked about this one already so I'm not letting the cat out of the bag"
Mark told me about this new 10watt Intergrated about 3 weeks ago when I Inquired about any new gear they are working on.
I have no doubt that it will sound good but 10 watts isn't enough for me overall.
I recently tried my MZ2S with tung sol vt-99 tubes with adapters powering my DI's just by itself,these tubes have slightly more gain than 6sn7's and I do believe slightly more pwr.I have been using the vt-99's for awhile but paired with pwr amps.I may have to retest the output of the MZ2S by itself.
Corelli,
You sure do ride a lot,all my free time is used for music listening.But I do walk quite a bit though so I'm not a total coach potato.
From what you have said before regarding your room size and music preferences I don't think a 10 watt amp would be enough for you either.My suggestion is to look into a first watt F7,might get you closer to some of the Tube amp qualities but with more pwr.
Kenny. |
Mac,
I have been using my Zotl 40 for almost 2 months now with great results,I use Mullard Xf2's and Amperex type 1 bugle boys for the drivers.
Wschee,
I occasionally listen to large scale orchestra music with my DI's and they produce a very believable sound in all aspects.They will need some pwr and most Set tube amps are not enough for me.
Kenny. |
Mac,
Yes the LTA gear showcases different tube combinations more than any other Tubed pre or amp that I have ever owned,borrowed or heard.Quite remarkable in MHO,I did try the gold lions,kt77's,12ax7's and 12au7's that came with my Zotl 40 but that sounded very lean in the mids and like some SS amps to my ears,just not my cup of tea.
I was going to get some bl63 tubes for my MZ2S but they do require a higher current for the heaters and they are very hard to find especially the Marconi's.
I hope your budget allows you to get the triode labs 2a3 amp in the near future,they make some very good gear and I think you will really like it,just wouldn't be enough pwr for me overall.
Kenny.
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I didn't change the tweeters I only modded the crossovers. |
James_w514,
I sold my Modwright kwa100se a couple of months ago but it sounded great with my DI's I just prefer my first watts better for SS.
Do you have the 100 or the 150.
Kenny. |
Evolvist,
My Di's use Sb acoustics SB29RDNC-C000-4. |
teajay,
Very nice that you keep us updated on the sound you are getting with those new big boys.
"My hunch is that the Ulf's have an even lower noise floor then the DI's, so spacial cues are more easily heard, hence more accurate space reproduction and micro-details are clearer"
I don't doubt this one bit,doubling up on the total driver count would most definitely lower distortion and give a lwr noise floor and more music.
I hope that you try your Zotl 40 with the Ulf's,I'm kinda biased towards that amp,I think everyone can tell that I love mine.
Enjoy the Music,
Kenny.
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porscheracer,
Here is repeat of a much earlier post to address your question,
They did sound great right out of the shipping boxes,but I haven't owned a speaker yet that I did'nt mod and get better sound.
Even though I did buy a upgraded pair of Di's from Eric,I have upgraded farther with even better caps,inductors and resistors and some wiring.
I started with the crossover on the woofers,
The heavy duty Jantzen coil is fine I didn't change it but I did change the single cap and got rid off the sand cast resistor,I don't like that type,I think they can be noisy.From day one when I got the speakers I didn't like cosmetically the blue colored woofers with my black metallic paint so I changed to the Eminence beta which gave me black cones the stock ones are the alpha's with blue cones.The physical size including depth are the same but the specs are slightly different.The beta's are 2 Db more efficient in their specs of the driver in free air and they give me better bass and dynamics at very low volume levels and they equal or are slightly better defined bass at higher volumes.I also biwire mine with a single run of western electric 10ga wire that solders directly in the crossover,and I use the same wire to the woofers.The beta woofers cost 60.00 a piece from us speaker.I hear just better defined bass maybe tighter and does measure 2 to 3 db down at 20hz in room.
Now that's the easy stuff,I took a look at the crossover for the tweeters and mids and decided to change all caps,resistors,and coils to better parts IMO but I did'nt change any wiring,It's ok and would be a lot of work.
Even though my speakers sounded very good once broken in I couldn't leave them alone because I knew I could make them sound better,I basically gained overall smoothness and a tiny bit of clarity and coherence without hurting but only improving the magical midrange that these speakers have by design.
I wouldn't honestly recommend that everybody that owns a upgraded pair of Di's would want to incur the expense and time involved for the noticeable but modest gains in sound.
Basically what I'm saying It's a lot of work and it took me 2 whole days to do mine.
Take the time and remove a couple of tweeters and maybe the lwr mid and look at the crossover and you will have to decide if you want to tackle it.
One option might be just to change the little bypass cap on the tweeters input to better quality.
Overall I would say I gained a solid 3% gain in improved sound in every sonic apspect that I can think of.
With these sound improvements It doesn't make me in no hurry to upgrade to any other speakers,but my digital front end has seen some improvements as well in the last couple of weeks and as my budget allows I'm going to purchase a Music Vault M7 music server and I hope to have the best digital that I have ever heard,I was a analog guy for many years but I have'nt spun a LP in 3 weeks and I'm not missing it one bit.
Kenny.
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teajay,
Very nice that you keep us updated on the sound you are getting with those new big boys.
"My hunch is that the Ulf's have an even lower noise floor then the DI's, so spacial cues are more easily heard, hence more accurate space reproduction and micro-details are clearer"
I don't doubt this one bit,doubling up on the total driver count would most definitely lower distortion and give a lwr noise floor and more music.
I hope that you try your Zotl 40 with the Ulf's,I'm kinda biased towards that amp,I think everyone can tell that I love mine.
Enjoy the Music,
Kenny.
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porscheracer,
I had a pioneer m22 in the mid 80's and I remember it being pretty good but once I got my first Threshold amp I sold the m22 like a hot potato.
The M22 was made from 76 to 80,
So they are getting quite old and would need some serious work and expense to make them sound good and be reliable.
Unless you have found one that has been rebuilt or wanted to do the work yourself I personally wouldn't recommend one.
Just my Opinion,
Kenny.
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porscheracer,
I had the Threshold 400a,S200 series 2 and later on the S300 series 2.
But that was in mid 80's to the mid 90's and I moved to pass labs then and now use First watts for SS.
You probably could find a S200 series 2 for under 2k that would be in good shape,All of the Threshold amps are getting pretty old.
The 400a is a pure class a design and runs hot and consumes a fair amount of electricity.
If you could find a First Watt F7 on the used market and if your budget allowed it I think you would love it.
The F7 puts out 30 watts into 4ohms and is plenty of pwr for me.
Kenny.
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teajay,
I totally agree with you that the LTA gear and the DI's are very disruptive products and from what you are telling us about the sound you are getting with the Ulfs with less than 250 hrs on them,
I would be safe to say they are going to be a highly disruptive product to the high end speaker market.
The pwr cords from Mike at Audio Archon are probably a great value also,I'm gonna need a couple here in the next few months.
Kenny.
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porscheracer,
The deal with Mark at Reno hifi would be a good one taking in consideration the trial period and 20% off.It would be a demo unit and probably have some time on it.These amps really need about 500 hrs to show you their true sound.
With this amp I can easily get 100db at my listening position 10ft away and still have plenty of headroom and that is playing full orchestra music.
One thing to take into consideration is the first watt F7 has lwr gain then most SS amps but you would be fine using your Freya that has 14db gain with the active tube stage,the passive probably wouldn't work up to the volume levels you listen at meaning you would simply run out of volume.You also would probably want better sounding tubes in the Freya than stock,I don't know if you use the tube stage of the Freya with your Vidar amp.
I use the LTA MZ2S which is 4db lwr gain then the Freya would provide and I have no issues driving either First watt amps that I have.The volume control of my preamp would be at the 1oclock position for the volume level mentioned "100db"at 10ft to give you an idea what I'm talking about.
I personally think you would like the sound qualities of the F7,but the only way for you to find out would be to try one for yourself.
Kenny. |
Corelli,
That was my guess the Hp but I did'nt post quick enough.
Kenny. |
teajay,
Could you estimate a 3db higher efficiency with the Ulf's vs the DI's or a actual volume knob difference between the 2 at the same perceived listening level with music you know well.
Kenny.
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vitop,
Look into the Spin clean record washer,
Very easy and quite effective but I did like a different cleaning solution and I used the disc doctors miracle record cleaner.
The spin clean comes with drying towels but I wasn't to crazy about using those and I would blow dry mine with filtered compressed air regulated down to 80 psi,I have my compressor in the garage and would have to do 1 record at a time.
For very dirty records I have used the Walker enzyme pre cleaner with good results and about 4yrs ago I bought and modified a ultrasonic cleaning tank and that worked very good too.
I have recently gone all digital after all these years of being mostly analog and I probably in time will digitize some of my Lp's also.
Kenny. |
grey9hound,
Congrats on your new speakers,
I hope your wife is like mine and is very understanding and you both like them.
We don't share any of the same gear at all not even cables,so you need to sale everything you got and buy everything that I use for the best sound ever.
Just Kidding you should be fine and have some outstanding sound.
Kenny. |
david_ten,
"Does Ferrari Red speed up the sound waves?"
I don't know how the red will do but my Ferrari black metallic finish without question forces the sound waves out of the speakers in a way that's much better sounding unlike some speakers do with the sound stuck in the box.
Meaning the DI's are highly resolving and transparent but they also just disappear and just let the music ebb and flow in such a natural way.
But you probably already know this since you have had your pair longer than me.
Kenny.
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sekollera,
I see no issue using either amp you have with the 4ohm taps with a pair of 4ohm Di speakers.
The 8ohm version of DI's may take much longer to get and are harder for Eric to build and they will be about 3db less efficient,
if that matters to you and it would make a difference with a 8watt 300b set amp.
I'm using a LTA Zotl 40 and also a couple different first watt amps with my DI's and I have a Yamamoto A09s amp which is a 300b set amp that has 4 and 8 ohm taps but I haven't tried it yet,waiting on some new tubes to show up.
I tried a consonance pp el34 Intergrated and used the 4 ohm taps with no issue.
One thing to keep in mind about the DI's is they don't dip any lwr than 4ohm Impedance load and they are very easy to drive with about any amp you would want to use.
I'm a long way from Minnesota or you would be welcome to listen to mine.
Kenny.
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vitop,
Goodness,
You have one heck of a Imagination but I love it.
Does anybody know when the Mini's may start shipping.
Kenny. |
Vitop,
I love it but I had the same thought when we all first saw the first picture on Tekton's website.
That would bring the sensitivity up to the Khorn level but would sound much much better.
Kenny. |
They would need 2 18 inch woofers and not 16inch though.
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cal3713,
I know in the past I have used and preferred the 8ohm taps from other amps with other than Tekton speakers with good results.
I have no experience with the franks and I haven't used a tube amp with my 4ohm DI's other than my Zotl40 and that's not a issue.
You may want to call Israel at Coincident and ask his opinion.
Charles may now too.
Kenny.
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Wow Jeffery with a setup like that you can claim the Ulf's are 25 to 30 % better than the DI's. I strongly think not.
Just constructive criticism not meant to be a personal attack.
Kenny. |
stfoth,
You are correct this is a tough crowd but it's all about constructive criticism and helping each other build the best system for each individuals tastes.
And you are correct that many of us are space compromised and do try our best within those limitations.
But jefferey's setup breaks many rules in the "Audiophile setup manual"
in my personal opinion and obviously others as well.
Kenny.
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stfoth,
"Not sure how you could possibly read in anything other than you and I being on the same page there"
If you haven't noticed by now,I will give my opinion on any subject that I desire and you may not like it but plenty of others do.
Kenny.
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grannyring,
You need to put that all in one class d thing you love in a box and get on one of those big airplanes and come to my house where some DI's reside.
LOL
Kenny.
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imswjm,
I know what you mean I've listened to vinyl of this Mahan Esfahani’s
recording for many yrs.I have recently made the change to all digital and you can find this recording on Tidal for those that use it.
Congrats my friend on your purchase of the Ulf's They might be the last speaker you will ever need.Now the wait begins but it sounds like you have a good plan in place and can be patient.
Kenny. |
Hello all,
With all the latest talk of speaker placement and the compromise most of us have I couldn't stand it any longer and I have my DI's 6 inches away from the front wall.
I'm actually quite surprised by the sound I'm getting now it's not as good as I'm used to with the speakers farther from the wall.
1. Bass is still 95% as good a little muddy and or boomy but that could be easily fixed with panels.
2. The all important to me tone and timbre and midrange is just as good.
3. The soundstage isn't as deep front to back but still sounds very good and every individual instrument and voice is precisely were it should be.
So for the folks that may be on the fence contemplating this speaker I agree with what has already been said,Room be darned buy them and enjoy them anyway.
Kenny. |
aniwolfe,
Congrats on the Electrons,
I personally think you will like them and be pleasantly surprised be sure and get at least 100 hrs on them before making your final decision.
Be sure and let us know what you think of them,
Good,bad or ugly.
Enjoy that music,
Kenny.
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Are you referring to the center dust caps?
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grey9hound,
Congrats on getting your DI's,
I think the red looks great in your room.
Once you get some time on them give us your opinion.
Kenny. |
Sometimes a good strong vacuum like a shop vac can help just work carefully.
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treebeard1
They are called dust caps not cones.
The dust cap on the stock Eminence alpha 10a woofer is thinner than the dust cap on the beta 10a woofer.
Kenny.
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"send the dented dust cap woofers to his suppliers for reconing at a really low cost., which I assume he will do. Reconing a woofer is quite inexpensive in the grand scheme of things"
It does kinda stink to buy any brand of new speaker that has any kind of obvious damage unless the damage was disclosed at purchase.
The woofers made by Eminence in the Double impact speaker have a center dust cap which is convex and is lightly glued to the inner portion of the speaker cone.To change a dust cap requires carefully cutting the glue joint between the cap and cone and removing the damaged dust cap and then reglueing a new dust cap to the cone.
What I'm saying is the woofer does not need to be reconed at all,just needs a dust cap replacement and I totally agree with that Eric should take care of this for porscheracer,It's just good business practice IMHO.
Now most folks know I didn't like the stock blue cone woofers with my black metallic painted DI's and I changed mine to the Eminence Beta 10a which have black cones and a thicker and stiffer dust cap.
Welcome back to these threads jetter.
Kenny.
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porscheracer,
That stinks,I'm assuming you don't have grills on your speaker.
Eric should take care of this issue.
Kenny.
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dan in dc,
Congrats on your new speaker selection I hope they work out for you.
Are you getting 2 8 inch woofers instead of 6 inch,I have heard that Eric has changed the Electron model just curious.
Let us know how you like them.
Kenny. |
porscheracer,
Yes each wire is soldered on and silver solder would be the best if you have it.
Be careful removing the old woofers after the screws are all out Offcourse because there is some sticky stuff holding the back side of the magnet to the wooden stiffener plate inside the cabinets.I used a thin piece of plastic to carefully pry the woofer loose.
Not a major job by any means just giving fair warning.
Kenny. |
mac48025,
Al and grannyring are spot one with their advice,
I have measured my DI speakers in room and I got,
95.3 db with a 1 watt input at a distance of 1 meter at the industry standard frequency of 1 K.
Even though both of us have definitely enjoyed the 1 watt of our MZ2S driving our DI's It's just not enough pwr for me overall considering my room size,types of music,and volume levels.
I got some new tubes for my Yamamoto Ao9's which is a 8 watt per channel 300b pwr amp for those who aren't familiar with it.So in the next few days I will be seeing for myself how it does with my DI's in place of my Zotl40.
Speaker and amp pairing is highly subjective as grannyring mentioned and It's up to the individual to find his or hers cup of tea so to speak.
Kenny.
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