Hey vitop,
I have heard the DI's with Pass Labs XA-60.8's and an Accuphase P-450 with great results. I'm more of a tube fan and I still have not heard, and I have listened to supposedly some of the best, D amps, any that I would want to own. |
Hello gentlemen,
Have a field report on my experiences with two great SET amplifiers driving the DI's. However, I would want to comment on driving the Ulfbertht speaker with either the BK or Carver amplifiers. I preface this with that in our hobby there is no right or wrong, it's personal taste and how we experience the illusion of how a total system produces music. Because the DI's are true conduits, and I'm sure the Ulifbertht's are too, I can't imagine that I would enjoy either of Eric's speakers being driven by the above mentioned amplifiers. I try never to speak in disrespect or ignorance about any product or someone's opinion. I have reviewed the Carver amplifier and found it at best to be just average in its performance, another OK sounding tube based amp. I have spent hours listening to the BK amplifier and again thought it was OK, but nothing special at all. Yes, it has received rave professional reviews, but compared to other SS amplifiers such as Accuphase or Pass Labs, which I have used to drive the DI's, it sounded to me like scores of "HIFI" sounding SS amps meaning relatively grainless, but somewhat sterile in tonality and color.
On to my field report.
I now have spent hours with both the Triode Lab SET 2A3s-EVO single chassis amplifier and the Canary Audio M-80 SET 300B mono-block amplifiers. Each was driven by the Micro-ZOTL and each amplifier was totally tubed with the finest NOS tubes that based on experience give me the musical flavor I'm seeking in my system. The only tube I had no prior experience with was the 2A3, so after some experimentation with new stock and NOS tubes my favorite turned out to be RCA 40's black plate tubes in the Triode Lab amplifier.
Well, guys which do you like better a Ferrari or a Lamborghini? Both these amplifiers are reference level performers and if I had very deep pockets I would by both of them for my stable of amplifiers. The Canary Audio 300B amps are highly detailed, silky smooth, throw a palatial soundstage, and rock on overall dynamics with the best bottom extension/power, more then the SS amps I mentioned above, that I have heard on the DI's so far. If you love rock and big orchestral types of music, with the finesse of a SET, these mono-blocks would be a dream for you on the DI's. My hunch is that because these amps have very big power supplies and the quality of their in-house designed and hand built transformers is excellent they sound much more powerful then you would expect for a 8 watt amplifier.
The Triode Lab SET 2A3s-EVO, like the Canary Audio is beautifully built with the finest of transformers and internal parts, takes the resolution, speed/dynamics, and 3D imaging of the Micro-ZOTL and adds on amazing "meat on the bones" image density, the most beautiful color/tonality/timbres to all instruments and presents the music in an effortless way that just floats out of the DI's. This amplifier is not dark or overly "romantic", but has a relaxing overall presentation that draws you into the music in an emotional way. It will do "big" music, however it really shines on vocals and acoustic instruments. 95% of my listening is Jazz recorded on analog tape, therefore this amp tickles my musical heart.
Both of these SET amplifiers are truly beautiful music makers. Paired with the Micro-ZOTL each drives the DI's, I should be getting shortly the Ulfbertht's for review/my hunch is that each will drive this speaker with abomb, to a level that any music lover would find enchanting indeed. Which do you like better silk or velvet? They are both wonderful materials, however which you find more pleasing to touch? Well, these amplifiers offer different textures/flavors, easily drive the DI's, so it comes down to personal taste and matching the synergy with your preamplifier and source.
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Hi Jeffrey,
The Carver amps were driven by the Concert Fidelity tube based reference, a great sounding piece, and the BHK's were driven by two excellent SS preamps and a very high level Purity tube based preamp. I don't know what you mean by "alive". If you mean overall macro-dynamics, both amps are OK in that area. They both fall short in color/tonality and in image palpability. When I reviewed the Carver amps the SS Pass Labs had more liquidity and better air around individual players then the tube based Carvers. I really found nothing special about the BHK amplifier, it was quite run of the mill sounding compared to most SS amps on todays market. Neither was my cup of sonic tea. I could also speculate that some of the "the image was right on top of me" is not the room or the speakers, but the nature of the amplifier. Because you can use very low powered SET amps because of the nature of Eric's speakers have you ever tried any of these types of amplifiers? The most unpleasant I have heard the DI's sound as been when they are driven by high power SS amps, some what in your face PA system type of presentation. So easy to drive, but total conduits which expose any short coming in the upstream gear. They sounded great with excellent SS amps like Accuphase and Pass Labs XA-60.8 which sound much different then your BHK's.
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Hi vitop,
I wish I could be helpful, however I have never had a multi-channel amplifier in any of my systems which are two channel based not HT. Hopefully, someone else with that knowledge/experience on this thread could answer your question. |
Hi Charlies,
The 300B tubes I used in the Canary amps were Sophia Electric Mesh Plates which I like very much. When I was rolling 300B's at one time this tube and the even more expensive Royal Princess tube were my favorite. |
Hey Guys,
I'm still waiting for my review pair of ULF's. Hope I'll get them in the next couple of weeks.
I have a question for Jeffrey, unless he posted this before and I missed it, what amplifiers and source gear are you using to power your ULF's? I'm quite curious because how he describes the performance of his new speakers, I'm assuming that the ULF's are at least as much as a conduit as the DI's, if not more transparent, sound more the shortcomings of the upstream gear. |
Hi David Ten,
It's been my experience that a great sound-staging speaker, if driven by the right electronics and it has enough acoustic space to breath, gives the listener different spatial dimensions accurately based on how and where the recording was made. I have auditioned speakers that on any recording present in a "forward sound-stage way" that I do believe is a shortcoming/flaw in its design. The DI's sound-staging changes when the recording presents a studio/hall/out door venue perspective, if driven by the right gear. |
The best SS amps I have heard on the DI's have been Pass Labs XA-60.8 mono-blocks, Accuphase P-450 (this was my favorite driven by the Micro-ZOTL), First Watt SIT-2, and Perla Audio's Sig-50. All of these are wonderful SS amps which present somewhat tube like in their color/tone and are slightly warm with great liquidity. If still say I would not like to hear the DI's with less worthy SS gear because you would hear the "rough edges" very easily through these speakers.
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Hi everybody,
I have now rolled three SET 300B amplifiers with some of the best NOS tubes available, along with the Triode Lab 2A3s-MK2, and have come to the conclusion, based of course on my personal preferences, that I have heard nothing better on the DI's then the 2A3 amplifier being driven by the Micro-ZOTL. If you other guys that love the LTA Micro-ZOTL driving the DI's directly heard this combo I have a hunch you would be totally enchanted, indeed! You get all of what the Micro-ZOTL has to offer with more beautiful tonality/timbres and the best 3D meat on the bone imaging but it never sounds like great HiFi, it sounds like real music. It draws you into the emotion of the music and lets you more often suspend the experience that you are listening to a stereo system. I made one change upstream with putting a pair of NOS Brimar (6060) yellow T decal 12AT7 in the Micro-ZOTL, and the change was a shift to a higher level across the total spectrum. The SET 300B amplifiers were all great sounding too, however, they just did not sound as natural to me as the 2A3 amp.
I wish the individuals who are experienced with high power SS amplifiers on the DI's could spend some time with a SET amplifier, they might find it very hard to go back to their SS gear.
Instead of writing individual reviews on these different amps for hometheaterreview, I'm going to write a feature piece detailing the history of SET amps/tubes (and how each amp sounded on the DI's) and why historically they could only be used with horn or single driver speakers (which I never liked with a very few exceptions), until Eric's break through allowed these "Flea amps" to create magic with a full range multi-driver box speaker.
I have one more experiment to run and that is to get a 45 SET in-house to finish out this fun ride with the DI's.
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Hi Charlies,
Yes, you are correct that the way my reference system is now setup, either a CEC or MBL transport, Concert Fidelity hybrid tube DAC, Micro-ZOTL used as a line stage, and the Triode Labs SET 2A3s-MK2 amp driving the DI's is the most enjoyable rig I have ever had since I started in the hobby. What's ironic overall is that this is not an inexpensive system by any means, however, when you think what I have replaced regarding price- going from a 23K preamp to a Micro-ZOTL $1,700.00, a pair of speakers that were 19K to the basic DI's for $3,000.00, and a pair of amps that retail for $5,700.00/12K to the Triode Lab amp for $3,900.00 because the performance was increased qualitatively by spending way less money.
It really proves that you do not have to spend mega-bucks to get a reference level system if the goal is music not "eye-candy" or bragging rights about who owns the latest/greatest most expensive rig. Eric's ability to create and sell such a high preforming speaker for peanuts compared to other hideously over priced speakers (I have heard them all and many I would not want to own, not because of price but because I find them lousy in their performance) has opened the flood gates for us music lovers who still work for a living.
I'm expecting the DI's big brother for review in the next two to three weeks, it will be very interesting for me to compare/contrast these two speakers for my review. Eric believes that his new speaker performs on a much higher level then the DI's, will shall see! I'll have them side by side with the same gear/same acoustic space so it really will be an apple to apple comparison. This should be a very special experience, indeed! |
Hi mac48025,
A good guess would be around 60% to 70% of the Triode Labs amplifier. The Triode Labs takes the music to a higher level of finesse and does everything better across the board. However, the Cyber-30 ain't bad at all, actually it's quite good for the money.
If you would want to borrow mind, you are more then welcome. Just Email at terryjaylondon@gmail.com |
Hey bullitt5094,
First, I would highly recommend that you contact Mark or Will at Linear Tube Audio and ask how much the upgrade is to modify a Micro-ZOTL to have a HT-bypass installed. The cost of this piece is around $1,700.00. Nothing and I mean nothing can touch this in its performance as a preamplifier for thousands of dollars more.
Next, call Steve at Quest For Sound and ask if they still have any Consonance Cyber-30 SET 2A3 amplifiers in stock that retail for $1,150.00. I mentioned this earlier on this thread that for the $ this well built little amplifier sounds great being driven by the Micro-ZOTL on the DI's. I do believe that each of these companies have a return policy if you are not pleased with the piece. I had the volume control taken out of the circuit, which is very easy to do by removing one set of wires, which increased the performance of Cyber-30 greatly, but you could still get your take on it to see if it's what you want, knowing it gets better by the easy modification and be able to return it if you are not satisfied.
If you really play your system at 110dB peaks, hope not very often-even on movie sound tracks for the sake of your hearing, I can't guarantee you will hit this sound pressure range, however you might be shocked how close you would be able to come to it. I have a very large acoustic space and have no problems filling it at very high volume levels with no attenuation/distortion at all. If you are that concerned about this you could try the Cyber-10 ( KT66 or 6550 tubes) that puts out around 12 watts, compared to the Cyber-30 2A3 5 watts, but different tubes have different sonics, so I can't predict what this amp sounds like. I do like KT66 and 6550 power tubes, however, they don't sound like 2A3's.
The total retail price for both pieces is $2,850.00 way under your budget of 4K which leaves enough money to do some serious tube rolling! If you contact either of these vendors tell them that I say hi. |
Hi Kenny,
Thanks for the compliment regarding my posts. I owned a First Watt SIT-2 and think it's a very special amp in its own right. It really needs to be driven by a great preamp because it is completely transparent/neutral/grainless and is totally influenced by the upstream line-stage. Great, but different then a SET tube amp in the way it presents the music. |
Hi bullitt5094,
I believe that anywhere from 5 to 10 watts driving the DI's would be fine in a HT LR Mains setup. My room has 30 foot ceilings, is 28 feet wide, and 40 feet in depth and I have no problem with volume levels or dynamics on all types of music with 5 watts. I have always used a pair of sub-woofers in my room crossed over at 30 at very low volume levels not for bass extension or reinforcement, but for ambient cues that fill out the depth/width of the sound-stage created in my room. Since I drive this pair directly from the Micro-ZOTL I'll often shut off the amp to show what the subs are really adding to my listeners and they often laugh at how little they really are adding, yet if I turn them off the sound-stage flattens out and loses its 3D perspective. This also means that the DI's being driven with 5 watts is producing the low end grunt on its own when the music contains this type of bass frequencies. |
Hi bullitt5094,
This is my final attempt to try to explain to you why you owe to your self to at least hear a SET amp on the DI's.
Klaus' amps are quite good, and great bargains for the money, however they do not compete sonicly, in my opinion, with the latest generation Pass Labs XA.8 series, Perla Audio, and even with many of the First Watt amplifiers. I have owned all of these great amps, yet they still can't do certain things like a SET amplifier.
No SS amplifier presents the music like a SET amplifier. I could get into the liquidity, color ,tonality, flow of the music that is quite magical with these simple circuit designs, but you really have to hear it for yourself, no words can replace actual experience. Your DI's give you the opportunity to try one out, if its not your cup of sonic tea, so be it. Historically, I loved the sound of SET's, but hated almost all the speakers that you had to use with them ( Horns and single driver designs) that had flaws and shortcomings for my taste.
Now, with the DI's which are reference level transducers with virtually no flaws you can use SET amplifiers with a full range highly dynamic box enclosure speaker which did not exist at this level in the past. I'm sure there is a way, hell you can borrow my Cyber-30, so at least you would really know how different the experience is between SS amps and SET amps.
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Gentlemen,
There's a new review on the website DAGOGO by Richard Austen regarding a new company's (KingKo Audio) KA-101 integrated amplifier that right now sells for whopping $830.00! It's a P/P 12 watt El-84 based design. It also has a built in PREAMP IN feature so you can run it directly with your preamplifier. Austen's review is very informative regarding SET designs comparing them to P/P and different kinds of power tubes. He raves that this little inexpensive amp is extremely well built, very easy to roll the tubes to get a higher performance, is cool looking (twin meters) and competes with much more expensive amps. He believes that it comes somewhat close to some of the special qualities of an SET. I know nothing about this author, but he writes well and has some very good gear in his system and has tried amps from Audio Space/Line Magnetic, so he seems legit. Hell, I have wasted more money on a few bad meals then this amp costs, so this might be worth checking out if you want to play with tubes driving the DI's. |
To all that own the LTA Micro-ZOTL
Mike Kay (Audio Archon) who is a dealer for both LTA and Tekton has just added to his stable of wonderful lines the gear the preamp of David Berning. Mr. Berning shared with Mike that you can safely replace the pair of 12AT7's in the Micro-ZOTL with 12AU7's, which have less gain, but can offer wonderful sound changes with different brands of NOS tubes. Mike is finding that if you want to add both color and image density, without losing any dynamics/speed/transparency the change to the 12AU7's just might be what you might be after in your system. I have not had a chance to experiment yet, but I trust Mike's ears and am looking forward to try out my numerous NOS tubes to see what I can get in my system this weekend. |
Hey Bill,
Please do post your initial impressions to night, I'm quite curious to see if its as good as the reviewer claimed it to be. |
Hi Everybody,
This morning my article entitled, WHAT'S SO IRRESISTIBLE ABOUT A SINGLE-ENDED TRIODE (SET) AMP, went up on the hometheaterreview.com website. This all came about because of being able to drive the DI's easily with this type of amplifier. Hope you guys enjoy the piece, and it's being great fun "Amp Rolling" to do the research/auditioning for this article. |
Hey evolvist,
Yes, Dave and his wife are wonderful people, indeed. Say hello to Dave for me.
I have Dave's spectacular 300B integrated amplifier in-house for review and am enjoying the beauty its creating with the DI's. If one is looking for a 300B integrated amplifier, this Raven piece should be on their audition list for sure. |
After a long night listening session another sonic virtue was very apparent as the Ulf's burn-in. The DI's in my experience are one of the best speakers at reproducing with uncanny accuracy the venue of were the music was recorded. The Ulf's take this factor to even a higher level. My hunch is that the Ulf's have an even lower noise floor then the DI's, so spacial cues are more easily heard, hence more accurate space reproduction and micro-details are clearer.
Yes, Charlies I will try at least three other amps, including the Pass Labs, in my reviewing process. |
Hey evolvist,
The Role speakers are great small floor-stander at producing low bass and sound-staging, however the DI's are in a different league overall. |
Hello Gentlemen,
Eric will be shipping out tomorrow to me a pair of Ulfs for reviewing purposes. I will have the great luxury of still having the review pair of DI's to compare the Ulfs to, and numerous (seven amplifiers) to get a very comprehensive take on them. I'll post here as soon as I get a cursory take on them and look forward to writing the formal review in the next six to eight weeks for hometheatereview.com. |
Hey everybody,
I just spent the last six hours listening to a pair of Ulfberhts that are in for review. Setting them up on Sistrum speaker platforms is a two man job and I want to thank Allan for all his help ( Allan was an early supporter of the DI's and hosted the Chicago Audiophile Society meeting at his house a few months ago to have the members hear the DI's).
First impressions:
1) These are BIG speakers that need a lot of acoustic space to breath and be able to preform to their maximum potential. Fortunately, I have a 30 foot ceiling, the speaker is 7 feet off the front wall, 6 feet off the side walls and the back wall behind my listening position is another 15 feet.
2) I'm driving them with the Micro-ZOTL preamp and the Triode Lab SET 2A3 amplifier and get to higher sound levels with ease with less gain on the volume control.
3) Eric has taken the basic magic of the DI's to a higher level of refinement/finesse in this speaker. It gives you even more transparency, more effortless overall dynamics, more liquidity, more precise layering and placement in the soundstage, and the bottom end is much more extended and powerful.
4) Remember, these babies are not close to be being burnt-in, I'm assuming everything will get better in the next 50 to 70 hours!
5) Since I believe that these are even a more pure conduit then the DI's you better be very careful with what you drive them with. My pair have an extra set of terminals on the back that you can insert different resisters to slope off the high end if the amp you are using is to "hot" sounding. My own personal taste/bias is to use tubes and the combination of low power SET amps with the Micro-Zotl is an absolute killer on this speaker, just like the DI's. The top end is beautiful with this gear, so no resisters are necessary.
6) Do the Ulf's make the DI's irrelevant, not at all, the DI's are still great. If you have the right acoustic LARGE space to house the Ulf's and have deeper pockets then indulge yourself with this great speaker, indeed! Remember, our great mad scientist Eric is coming out with DI's SE, baby Ulf's , so what will these creations sound like in comparison to these will be a treat to find out in the coming months!
All of the above is my cursory first take on this speaker. I again feel honored that Eric picked me and hometheatereview.com to receive/review the first pair of Ulfberhts for professional evaluation.
Maybe, Allan will post his impressions of these speakers when he has the time to. |
Hey David,
Thank you for your kind words. The rest of this system is a Krolo Tomo rack, either a reference MBL transport or CEC TL-3N transport, Concert Fidelity hybrid-040 DAC, MG ribbon speaker wire and IC's, Harmonix studio master power cords, and a Running Springs Dimitri power conditioner. |
Hey bullitt5094,
I'm very lucky to live in a post and beam open design house. Besides the amount of wood running through the whole house the totally open space is Height 30 feet / Width 30 / Length 50 where the system is located.
I would think you would want at least 5 feet off the front wall, 3 to 4 feet off the side walls. I do not have to use room treatments, however if someone knows what there doing I'm sure you could get the speaker to work well in a somewhat smaller environment. |
Hello Mr_m,
Its interesting that you should suggest that Eric seek a review from either Stereophile or the Absolute Sound.
Just today I received a phone call from a highly respected reviewer and owner of a popular audio website. He wanted to share his respect for the owner of hometheaterreview.com, Jerry Del Colliano for having the "balls" to publish my review and my honesty at stating in the review that the 3K DI's easily out performed my 19K reference speakers of over five years.
He went on to state that the print publications would be sacred out you know what to print an honest review on the DI's when their very financial security is based on getting advertisement $ from the fat cat speaker companies that might frown on a review that states that a 3K is as good or better then their 30K, 60K, 100K over priced speaker. |
Hello Rockytophigh,
The Sistrum stands are the standard Apprentice with three spikes per stand.
Hope this helps. |
Hey wschee,
I do. The DI's just scale up regarding macro-dynamics and to the size of the acoustic space where the music was recorded. |
For Mac48025,
After I reviewed the ZOTL-40 amplifier I bought it and it became my reference amp being driven by the Micro-ZOTL. It's a wonderful piece, like Eric, David Berning is a true genius. I found out recently I like the 40 even more with EL-34's instead of the stock KT-77's. The DI's allowed me to go back to one of my first loves, SET amps, along with experimenting with the 2A3 tube. As you know I'm quite enamored with the Micro-ZOTL preamp with the Triode Lab 2A3 amp driving the DI's and now the Ulf's. This is just based on my personal taste, however, I'm still keeping the ZOTL-40 for my stable of amps because it's great and provides higher power for my reviewing assignments.
For Vitop,
I'm very spoiled in that I have heard just about all the most highly rated speakers either in people's home systems, my house, high-end store settings, or audio shows and to be quite honest I'm starting to come to the conclusion that Ulf's might be the all time best I have ever heard regardless of price! Let me fully burn them in to get all their possible maximum performance. Right now the theme that keeps coming up in my mind is you get all the "pop" of the DI's (with a much more room pressuring foundation to the music) along with a much higher level of "polish" of more pure tonality, soundstage layering with precise location of the players on that stage, and this buttery/liquidity ease of music just felling your room effortlessly. |
Hey Guys,
Got about 15 hours on the Ulf's and the level of low end dynamics is blossoming and the level of liquidity is spreading like melting butter in a slightly warmed cast iron pan!
I was playing an album by the great jazz pianist, Cyrus Chestnut, and I can honestly say that the Ulf's created the most life-like illusion of an actual piano being played in real space that I have ever heard created by a stereo system. Just beautiful! |
Hey David-ten,
I agree with what Kenny said about more drivers lowering the noise floor. I would add by using much higher parts in the crossover, higher grade drivers, and an the heavier/thicker construction of the overall cabinet are contributing to the total transparency/clarity in the Ulf's performance.
Just wanted to share about a great new find in power cords that I clearly hear out performing my reference Harmonix Studio Master cords in my system. In my professional work the website I write for does not do reviews on IC's, speaker wire, or power cords. However, since I have had the DI's and the Ulf's in for review I have started to experiment with different power cords on my gear because I easily hear the differences positive or negative through either speaker. My reference cords have been the Harmonix Studio Master's which are great sounding and cost around $1,500.00 for a six footer. Well, Mike from Audio Archon, who is a Tekton dealer, wanted me to audition a power cord which he hand builds with some of the finest materials and sales for whopping $250.00! I have tried at least three other power cords from very well known and regarded companies that cost anywhere from $2,500.00 up to $4,200.00 for a six foot cord. None of them were any better in my system then the Studio Master cords. The Audio Archon cord was the first that out performed the Harmonix cord across the total (dynamics, purity of tone, more overall dynamics) spectrum regardless of what piece of gear I put it on. Remember, this freaking cord only costs $250.00!
Just like the MicroZotl preamp and the DI's are disruptive products because of how they "snap" the cost vs performance ratio to bits, I now would add this power cord to the list.
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Hi Charlies,
Yes, I'm positive that they are more sensitive/efficient then the DI's. The Ulf's are even better then the DI's at playing at very low volumes without losing any dynamics. I also get to higher volume levels at lower positions on my volume control. |
Please note this is not a personal attack on Jeffery just a strong comment on his setup of his Ulf's:
Are you freaking serious! I would not setup an inexpensive pair of speakers the way this 12K world class speaker is placed in this room. Any rear ported speaker should at least be, if possible around two feet off the front wall, otherwise you muddy up the bass big time. By having the inner front edge of the Ulf's parallel to the cabinet would totally negate the speakers ability to develop center fill and a deep soundstaging. They also are quite close to the side walls/corners that would create early disruptive reflections and again interfere with overall clarity, imaging and lead to a booming/muddy bass response.
Certainly, there are speaker designs that are designed to be placed right on the front wall to develop their soundstages, but the Ulf's is not one of them. I have heard the DI's setup in a very similar fashion and found that their performance was tremendously effected negatively in that system.
Without using room treatments the closest I would place the DI's or Ulf's to the front wall would be, if possible, at least two and a half feet, and from the side walls at least the same distance. I'm very lucky in that I have a special acoustic space both in size and how much wood is used throughout the room which leads to a very natural acoustic environment for any speaker I review. It saddens me that this proud owner of these very special speakers will not really hear the magic of what the Ulf's can do if placed in the correct position in the right sized room.
It's like putting a world class racing horse in a kiddy corral dooming him never to run free at his total potential /speed. |
Hey evolvist,
Yup, you should be good to go! I would suggest a slight toe-in so the speakers are on the outside of your head. Both the DI's and the Ulf's gave me the best center fill and image precision with this small adjustment vs straight ahead firing. |
Hey everybody,
Just had over for a listening session, Mike Kay of Audio Archon who's a Tekton Design Retailer (now becoming famous for his killer power cords), "audio" Ezra who has on order a pair of DI SE's, and Micheal Wright the excellent staff reviewer for Stereo Times website to experience the ULF's.
They all agree that the ULF's are superlative music makers. I now have around 30 hours on them and they continue to blossom and open up more. I'll still stick to my statement that the ULF's have all the power, pop , aliveness of the DI's with a lot more polish when it comes to an overall silkyness/liquidity, tonality, and precision in soundstaging and placement of individual instruments on that stage. They are magnificent!
Micheal took home the demo pair of the DI's to get his take on them in his review system and compare them to his Wilson speakers as was talked about a few months ago on this thread.
Finally, Mike and I are in agreement that we both like, for our personal taste, the 2A3 tube more then a 300B, at least when driven by the Micro-ZOTL preamp. I never thought I would ever say a 300B would sound anything less then "natural" if it driven correctly, however the 2A3 just sounds more like "real" music and is magical in my system driving either the DI's and now the ULF's. The 2A3 amplifier is from Triode Lab from Canada. |
Hi Charles,
Micheal's preamp and amplifier are VAC tube gear. Yes, it will be interesting what his experience will be. |
Forgot to share the following:
1) Ran the experiment of using the Micro-ZOTL as an integrated amplifier driving the Ulf's. It was great, just like on the DI's with the added benefit of more headroom/volume when needed! Again , this shows that the Ulf's are more efficient then the DI's.
2) Took the Micro-ZOTL out of the reference system and replaced it with a very good tube based preamp that I use in my second system to drive the 2A3 amp. This validated my assumption that the synergy between the Micro-ZOTL ( the powerful macro-dynamics-see through transparency-3D imaging-overall speed) and the Triode Lab 2A3 amplifier(gorgeous color/timbres-"meat on the bones" imaging) is what leads to the best combination for my ear's driving either the DI's or Ulf's. The system minus the Micro-ZOTL lacked the dynamics/life and sounded soft and took the aliveness out of the listening experience.
I wish all you DI's proud owners could hear this combination in your system, it will play at very high volume levels, is totally grain-less, accentuates the aliveness of the DI's/Ulf's, vivid 3D imaging and produces the most beautiful tonality/colors I have ever experienced. |
Hey Charles,
I do not use a DB meter to see how loud the loudest passages are when playing music. However, even massive pipe organ played at volume levels that pressurize my very large space are easily achieved with this combo. I get that owners that use the DI's in home theater systems are not going to use either piece in their systems. However, if you are driving a two channel music system there would be no rational reason not to least audition this combo. On at least three occasions, two with the DI's and one with the Ulf's, my guest listener swore they were listening to at least a 100 watt amp because of the control of the bottom end and the volume levels achieved on big band and rock music like Radio Head with no compression/attenuation at all.
So, if there is a psychological barrier I hope individuals would get past this power rating nonsense which Eric's speakers really bypass because you can drive them so easily, unlike many other full range box enclosure designs that do need watts/current to perform. |
Hey Everybody,
I want to share my respect for the honesty/integrity of Micheal's "field report" of what happened in his system between the DI's and his Wilson Sasha speakers. He is my favorite staff reviewer on the Stereo Times website and always gives insightful and helpful information in his reviews.
His experience again validates how disruptive the cost to performance ratio is for the DI's, remember this demo pair is the basic model with no upgrades at all, and "snaps" any rational reason to spend mega bucks on speakers from companies, in my opinion, that grossly over charge for their product. I had a pair of speakers as my reference that retailed for 19K and Micheal's speakers retailed for 28K and each model was left in the dust sonicly compared to the DI's!
I believe if I was one of these major speaker manufacturers it might be harder to sleep peacefully at night as word spreads from professional reviews and even more importantly "word of month" in the audiophile world's awareness from sites like this one. There is an overall relationship between the cost of a piece of gear and its performance. However, many individuals who buy high-end products often believe that hideously expensive gear "MUST" out preform far less costly pieces.
Eric has snapped this equation to a point of no return with his paradigm breaking new designs. Eric's passion has nothing to do with profit, yes he needs to make a living, it totally revolves around the excitement of discovery/creativity when he designs/builds his creations and bringing great joy to people who love music! |
Hey Evolvist,
If you can evaluate the overall sound quality of Jeffery's system based on what you hear on that video you have some extraordinary auditory abilities, indeed!
I'll call later this morning my editor at hometheatereview.com and highly recommend you for the new staff writing position that's open.
Just having fun, hope you take it that way, at you comments on your last post. |
Hey grannyring,
Of course it always boils down to personal taste, like all artistic pursuits there is no right or wrong, it's what the individual finds pleasing to his sense of taste. So you are stating the obvious in most of your post.
However, even in the very beginning of my life long pursuit at putting together my systems that would sound like the illusion of real music two constants have always been in effect:
1) If timbres/tonality were not correct to my ear's the rest did not matter to me.
2) I always knew that if some new piece of gear sounded that much better then my reference, watch out, new is not always better, maybe different, and you better live with it for awhile to see if it's as charming as you thought it might be.
As I stated earlier in this thread I have never liked horn and single driver designs. Therefore, before Eric's breakthrough you could not really use SET amps on full range multi-driver box speakers. Now you can! So, for my personal taste I can have the colors/tonality of a SET design with no apparent drawbacks as far as I can tell.
By the way: Spent another six hours in front of the Ulf's today. If they are not totally broken-in yet it got to be close now. They are magnificent music makers. They have the overall house sound of the DI's taken to even a higher level across the sonic board. When I write my review for hometheaterreview.com, hopefully in the next 4 to 6 weeks, I'll get into all the little details of Ulf's musical magic. |
Hi Charlies,
Please remember that I just ran the experiment of driving the Triode Lab SET 2A3 amplifier with a very good tube based preamplifier through the Ulf's and this combo was very good, but did not have the ultimate magic of the combo of the Micro-ZOTL/2A3. Yes, for me the 2A3 tube is even more natural/musical then my old favorite 300B. However, the Micro-ZOTL adds the overall kick/dynamics, pure tonality and 3D imaging and the 2A3 adds the colors and even more air and space between players. One more time, on either the DI's or Ulf's, regardless of the type of music, I can shake the walls and pressurize my very large acoustic with ease. |
Hello porscheracer,
Regardless of were you scored this legendary amp, sleep well, you will no worries driving your DI's as far a volume and control over the bottom-end of the speaker. |
Hey grannyring,
For years when I would read the professional reviews I centered on two aspects over time. First, what gear was in this reviewer's system, they might think a new piece of gear they were reviewing was great compared to their equipment, but that did not prove it was competitive to other gear that they never had experienced directly. Secondly, I quickly could figure out their "personal taste" if it jived with mine then I could get a rough gage that I would like it vs the reviewers who had a very different auditory set of desires which meant not for me.
I believe the major problem with many high-end customers is that they buy the flavor of the month because of EGO and to have the latest/greatest/most expensive gear, therefore if such and such esteemed reviewer raved about it they got to have it. The purchase has nothing to do about improving the sound of their system or having more enjoyment of the music, but having the biggest "sonic cock on the block" mentality. These individuals are really struggling with Eric's speakers because "blue collar" audiophiles can now get a pair of speakers that out performs their hideously over priced/hyped speakers. Their "audio jewelry" has been tarnished before their eyes. |
Now on to a more fun topic:
I spent most of last night listening to a variety of different types of music (blues, rock, jazz, soul, classical) that were either recorded in the studio or live in different venues to further evaluate the Ulf's for my up coming review. It became very difficult to keep my "reviewers hat" on because this speaker allows you to relax and connect to the emotions that the musicians are conveying in their performance. Yes, all the parameters of world reference level standards (effortless dynamics, total transparency allowing all the micro-details to be easily heard, accurate sound-staging with air and space between the players, beautiful timbres/colors, and a bottom end that totally pressurizes the room) are done by this magnificent speaker, without it sounding analytical or losing the feeling in the music.
Another amazing aspect is how, just like the DI's, this VERY big speaker just disappears like the best of the breed of world class two way monitors do if set-up the right way. Can a 12K speaker be considered a bargain? If it out performs virtually anything on the current market, which I believe the Ulf's do, the answer is yes! Two more listeners that I know personally have sold off their speakers that retail for around 30K and replaced them with the DI's, so the owners of even more expensive speakers might really trip out when they hear is offered by the Ulf's compared to their 100K transducers. |
Hey mac48025,
I have tried different combos, the Micro-ZOTL with different ampilifers, and the 2A3 no doubt is my favorite, both on the DI's and now the Ulf's. I had no problems in any way with the 2A3 driving the DI's and since the Ulf's are even easier to drive its a match made in heaven. It's hard for me to believe that when I go back to a great 300B SET amplifier it kinda sounds more like reproduced music then when through the Triode Lab 2A3 amplifier. |
Hey Mac48025,
I strongly advise you to hear a SET 2A3 based amplifier in your system before you purchase a pair of SET 300b's. I have in-house two pairs of wonderful SET 300B mono-blocks and still found the SET 2A3 amplifier much more musical and natural sounding then the 300b amps. If you want you can borrow the Opera 2A3 amp from me to run the experiment in your system. Just let me know. |
Hey Everybody,
Last night I wrote my review on the Ulf's for hometheatereview.com and now my proof reader will clean it up before its submitted to my editor. It was a pleasure to write it and its a joy to have Eric's brilliant creation producing music in my home.
I still firmly stuck to my position that you need the right acoustic space (large with enough space from the front and side walls with a very high ceiling) for these magnificent music makers to breathe and live up to their ultimate level of performance.
No doubt, my favorite combo on the DI's and now the Ulf's is the Micro-ZOTL and the Triode Lab 2A3 by far and I got in-house superlative gear to compare this pairing to which is mentioned in my review.
Hope, this review will go up on the website in the next 4 to 6 weeks. |
Hey Bill,
You will just have to wait for my review to find out if I purchased the demo pair! |
