Zilla ... thanks for posting your results. It's gratifying that so many people are obtaining such good results. Dopogue ... I hope to have a classified ad up within a couple days. The Formulas will be sold under the Audio Intelligent brand. I need to rig up the 4-stage water purifier I bought so I can make some of the Cleaner Formula with Ultra-Pure Water. Thanks to everyone for their testing and feedback. Best regards, Paul |
I'm late to the party here--I've been traveling, and haven't had as much time as I'd like to test. But I've also been quite impressed with the fluids. I've been using Disc Doctor fluids and brushes on my VPI 16.5, and getting excellent results. But I noticed that the DD stuff was unable to lift all the appearance of fingerprint residue off thrift store records. Paul's stuff, on the other hand, wipes these discs clean. I have the sense that background noise is correspondingly reduced, maybe not by huge amount, but enough to be noticeable. So far, I recommend Paul's stuff highly. |
Hi All, First of all, I would like to thank Paul for sending me samples and including me in the test group. Secondly, I have to apologize for taking so long to post my results. I received the samples some time ago, but I was out of town for a while and never really had the spare time to perform thorough testing as planned. I have used his formulas over the past couple days and the immediate impression that I have gotten is that extensive testing is not as necesary as expected. The results are far from subtle. For reference, I am currently using a homebrew solution of about 12% isopropyl w/ a couple drops of soap. I have used a few of the commercial cleaners in the past, and I came to the conclusion that the results of my mixture was "close enough" to the commercial stuff to not justfy the prices charged (Yes, Im a cheapskate) I wasnt expecting much out of Paul's cleaner, and likely would not have tried it if it was not free. I am not going to go into to much detail about my trial and the results, because I can see from the above posts that others who are undoubtedy more qualified than myself and have higher resolving equipment have done much more thorough testing. I can say, however, that my experience is similar. Noise floor and clicks & pops are dramatically reduced, while dynamics have increased. Those microscopic Audio Ninjas kick some serious tail!! I look forward to this formula being available for purchase. Thanks Paul, and I hope my little review is helpful to any lurkers out there who may read it. Regards, Andrew |
Hi everyone, I'm pleased to announce that I've posted a commercial ad for AUDIO INTELLIGENT VINYL SOLUTIONS. Here's the URL: http://cgi.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cl.pl?anlgtabl&1101803723 A big "THANK YOU" to all the beta testers, who so carefully tested the products and posted their feedback. Truly, this was an Audiogon collective group project. The beta testers literally held the power to approve or disapprove of any marketing of these products. Prior to their testing, I did not know any of the beta testers. Their uniformly very postive reviews were gratifying. In addition, the offering of a ready-to-use product made with ultra-pure water was the result of an Audiogon member's (Psychicanimal) input. Again ... thank you for taking the time to test and post your objective results. AUDIOGON: hosting some of the most knowledgeable and nicest people in the world! A great place to hang out. Warmest regards, Paul Frumkin (302) 836-0453 |
The information that Mr Kidknow posted is consistent with the information that a NASA employed chemist once told me. That is, i was told that every increase in temperature by 20* effectively doubled the cleaning power of a solution. Given the variables involved in each solution, i would call that "close enough" to the 18* mentioned above. Given my past experience with active enzyme formulations, they typically work best if left on for a longer period of time, they are agitated during that time and airflow is kept to a minimum. Not only does reduced airflow lower evaporation of the liquid agents suspending the enzyme allowing it to travel more freely and cover more area, it also helps to retain the original operating temperature of the solution, which increases efficiency as mentioned above. In extreme situations, a thorough enzymatic cleaning and rinsing along with a repeat enzymatic treatment and rinsing at a later date may provide the best results possible. The more thorough that one can maintain a higher operating temperature of the enzyme once applied ( by covering the LP with a large pan or bowl that was possibly even pre-heated, etc.. ) and agitate the enzyme on the first application, the less effective the secondary treatment will be though. This would be a good trick though as you have to have LP exposed to ambient air temperatures in order to get at the surface to agitate the grooves. Given the information presented within this thread and the "cleaning power" of Paul's solution, it's quite possible that one could devise a somewhat complex cleaning ritual for specific discs that they value. It's possible that one could restore heavily soiled / barely playable LP's to easily played / highly enjoyable records. While i have not tried Paul's solution as of yet, i don't doubt the results that others have had using it. I think that it would be of great value to those "record hunters" that frequent used record stores and / or garage sales & flea markets. With all of that in mind, i guess Paul has now officially made the transition from a "civilian" to an "industry professional". Congratulations to him and i hope that his time & effort that he's put into this product will reward him handsomely : ) Sean > PS... While i'm all for ethical participation of manufacturers / distributors / dealers within these and other forums, they need to disclose their business affiliations. Having said that, I think that Paul has been up-front about the whole situation, so he deserves a little help marketing his product since he's new at being an "industry professional". As such, here's his one time "get out of jail free" card and a more convenient link to the Audio Intelligent Vinyl Solutions products : ) |
Just supporting what Sean contributed. Enzymes are used during the digestiion process. And, there are many types of enzymes from protease to lactase (one which I lack). One major factor that leads to greater effectiveness of enzymes, as Sean has already described, is temperature. One of the main reasons mammals are warm blooded is because we can supply our own "furnace" when digesting; a distinct advantage over cold blooded organisms. The other two factor would be how concentrated the enzyme is and how much velocity/viscosity, agitation, is involved between the enzyme and what is being digested. So, warming up the enzyme a bit might prove to increase its effectiveness on your records. Dunno if that will harm your records though but doubt it as the type of enzyme being used here seems to be protease which doesn't have chemical reaction with anything other than protien. dislaimer: i am not a biologist just a charlatan as i am with audio. |
Well i finished using the sample bottles. I recieved them about a month ago and cleaned about 15 albums. I did some side a/b comparisons and some a/b tests with doubles of a couple of albums. I feel that the two step process left my albums clean and clear. I cleaned a copy of chet baker sings that i bought used, covered in dust and gunk and crud, filthy, and after it was very close to silent. I would say the two step is a little better at fishing out the deeper junk. So I guess I'm saying i like it and would use it again, so Paul, How much? |
Thanks, Sean and Lugnut! Viggen, regarding heating the Enzymatic Formula .... First, I think only the amount that will be used immediately should be warmed, because repeated heatings will degrade the Formula. Therefore, a good approach might be to put the amount you plan to use in a small container for warming. Second, warm the small container with warm/hot water until the Formula is warm to the touch -- about 100 degrees. This will double the rate of chemical activity (over an 80 degree base), yet will be safe for the vinyl. Mc5baby, glad you also obtained good results with the Formulas. Sean's post, above, contains a link to the classified ad here on Audiogon -- it's currently posted in the Turntables section. Perhaps next time it will be under tweaks or accessories. (Maybe 'Gon needs a new category? Cleaning equipment & supplies?) I had previously said I wanted to make the Formulas affordable. The concentrates work out to a price which is about half the cost of other products. Best regards, Paul Frumkin |
Enzymes (biological catalysts) usually have very narrow temperature operating ranges. If the temperature goes up beyond a certain point the enzymes break down. That's one of the main reasons fevers are so dangerous for the human body. The tap water in Florida is horrible! Smells like swamp water (it *is* processed swamp water). There's a lot of sulfur and other organics in the water--nasty. At my parent's house they get the water from a mountain rain forest--it's a big difference... Well Paul, you're on your way. I'm happy for you. *** |
Thanks, Psychicanimal ... and welcome back! Hope your move went smoothly. Must have been difficult getting into Florida, with all those other folks trying to get out! The 4-stage water purifier is now plumbed and installed. So the CLEANER FORMULA with ULTRA-PURE WATER is now available! Thanks to Psychic for suggesting that I make the CLEANER FORMULA available in a ready-to-use solution made with ULTRA-PURE WATER. Best regards to everyone, Paul Frumkin p.s. Ads now posted under Turntables and Tweaks. |
I've been reading this thread with more than just a passing intrest. After twenty-five years I'm delving back into vinyl. New TT, phono stage and only a fleeting memory of my pre-play routine. I've only about twenty albums left (the rest were stolen many moons ago) and they've NEVER been cleaned. The last component (new needle) will be in this week and the vinyl system will be ready for play. Abeit on dirty albums. Everyone seems to be pleased with the results of this two step process and to my way of thinking the basic concept makes sense. I'd like to get some, I'll pay for it. How? Also, should new (as in just out of the wrapper) albums be washed prior to use? |
Paul, First of all thank you for the samples. I regret that I am dead last in responding to this thread as I have been covering audio shows in Europe for Audiogon for almost a month. I will do testing this next week after I purchase suitable water and will post results. I have no doubt my findings will mirror others here, so my posts will likely be redundant. It appears Paul has hit a home run in record cleaning formulas. Thanks for allowing Audiogon members to play a role in this important new product. |
You're very welcome, Dopogue! Glad you're consistently obtaining such good results. Hbarrel ... absolutely. New LPs often have residual silicone compounds on them left from the stampers. We think new LPs look clean because they have shine ... but that's exactly what a thin coating of silicone does: it makes things look shiny. And that silicone holds dust and dirt like glue (besides being a microbe's idea of fine souffle). Albert, not to worry: I doubt you'll be "dead last." A number of people haven't reported back yet. Actually, my thanks go to the Audiogon members who gave the formulas a fair and thorough trial, and whose positive results were literally the deciding factor in whether I would offer the formulas for sale or not. Many thanks, guys! Best regards, Paul Frumkin |
Thanks Paul, I appreciate the opportunity. Psychic, here they are and two more to come. http://forum.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/events.pl |
Where are the mamis, Albert? The concierge looks kind of worn out--I had a prettier Norwegian in entomology class!!! Nordic women have their own particular type of *curvaceous* body (I call it the Nordic body). Ah, wish I had an 'ethnically diverse' harem... Paul, did you get my e-mail? You need to get your ultrapure water system baseline data ASAP. I'll walk you through the motions, it's simple and the service life ( and consistent quality ) of the system will be greatly enhanced. I am at an extended stay place and have DSL--also got a Verizon walkie-talkie. As I figured, there's plenty of work in my field but the four hurricanes have messed things up. |
