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Needing DAC Advice

My main, current system is a Schiit Urd through a Benchmark DAC3 B through a Schiit Freya+ (running in passive mode exclusively - I haven't even tried the tube output), to Pass Labs X150's to Martin Logan SL3's (and a couple of rythmik subs).

When I 'listen' to music, I listen to CD's or vinyl. I don't stream - too many places for signal compromise in the streaming chain for my tastes and, more importantly, I'm vehemently opposed to paying a provider who profits by paying artists virtually nothing for their content. When I can, I buy physical media directly from the artists I want to hear. 

A brief description of my pathway to here: the best-sounding system (for me) I've ever had was a modded Wadia 831 direct to a Pass Lab amp to ML's. (I'm a less is more adherent). I replaced the Wadia, as it was getting long in the tooth and I was worried about service, with an Oppo BDP105, then a modded 105D, again, directly driving the amps. Decent, but not the magic of the Wadia.

Which brings me to today - a transport and DAC. After much research, I went with the URD (because of the transport) through the Benchmark .I added the Freya+ in case I want to add vinyl to this system and the fact that the Freya is a 3-in-1 preamp. (I've got another, tube-based system for vinyl).

And here's the issue. The system is not a terribly musical-sounding set up. It 'sounds' very good: great detail, fast, big soundstage, blah, blah, blah...All those adjectives we regularly throw around. It's very 'there'! Sounds better than with the Oppo. But it is not...engaging? No soul?

I'm thinking it's the DAC. Maybe I'm just might not be a fan of Sabre or DS in general. Maybe I need try an R2R DAC. So, I started looking: Border Patrol, Denefripes, Mojo Audio, MHDT Orchid, HoloAudio, Lab 12, or even the Schiit Yggy.. Some of these add tubes which I'm not sure I want to do unless they can be bypassed (much as I love tubes, I'm not sure a DAC is the right place to use them.) Finally, before I go down the DAC rabbit hole, I will give the Freya tube output some serious listening, just in case tubes are the missing link. Otherwise, my questions are do you think that R2R is directionally correct and, if so, what suggestions/recommendations might you have? Thanks and I apologize for the length but I'm well aware that more detail I can provide upfront, the more useful your responses are likely to be.

128x128trn
rmdvp
2 posts
 

Hard to know what you mean by 'no soul' I suspect that is different for many individuals, by no soul, does that suggest a since of 2 dimensions, or lack of med-range impact, or less encompassing mid to lower base?

Best to start with your weak points in the system, I found in my system, the weak points were initially in my cables, power, interconnects and speakers cables, over time I replaced all of them.

As you mentioned, its a rabbit hole for sure, once I found that solved one problem, I went to better speakers, then a better pre-amp,  and finally a better dac (only due to my theta dac had failed) 

One of the biggest differences, and most expensive equipment changes were the cables, at least they dont really wear out, once you make the investment, unlike other electronic equipment

I went to NBS black label from transparent cables, ultimately that gave me the start to holography and separation I was looking for, after witch I added a better speaker, German Physiks system from Thiel CS5's, followed by better preamp and amp, from krell integrated to Einstein tube pre-amp and Halcro mono amps

Every step made a difference, because I was replacing a weak point with something better, in other words, the rabbit hole

Finally replaced my burned out theta dac with a Weiss 501 DAC, the Weiss may be a bit better that the theta, newer tech, I have a soft spot for theta, it ultimately about synergy, however it all started with the cable system, once that was set I could hear the differences in further additions, good or not so good, and make a informed decision on upgrading older equipment

 

 

 

classicrockfan
173 posts
 

1. SMSL SU-X  2. Gustard A26 made in China you don't want to spend more than 1k for a Chinese DAC. These Chinese DACs outperform most US/European made units that cost 10x more. 

iseland's avatar
iseland
150 posts
 

Feels like I need to repeat my self,  but the output stage is way more important than the converting bit in a dac .

I also would recommend you to try a really good preamp .

Something like EAR 912 , Audio Research ref 6 or alike .

jk_richards's avatar
jk_richards
144 posts
 

I pair my modified Directstream DAC with an Audio Research Ref 6SE pre. 

The quality of the SDM and a very low jitter clock is just as important as the output stage. I use a Denafrips Hermes DDC to connect the DAC to our streamer.  Best I have ever heard from all DAC's we compared it to.  Very realistic and dynamic.

torontodt
7 posts
 

I think I'm alergic to ESS Sabre dacs.

Tried reviewed and recommended ESS dacs like Yulong, Nuprime, SimAudio, Auralic Vega and others and while I tried to like them, none sounded very musical to me.

My Hegel HD30 Dac on the other hand had an AKM "Velvet Sound" DS chip and it sounded very good.

Had PS Direcstream Mk I and Mk II Dacs and they sounded ok but their FPGA designs seemed to leave detail on the table when I compared it to the Vega G2 which was highly detailed.

Finally found the Holo May (R2R) dac and it seems to have great detail while preserving musicality across the board. Just seems effortless and stays out of the way. I'll note that this dac has a very good class A output stage.

So, some dac architectures/implementations simply may not work for your ears. Luckily, the used market is quite good right now - have fun!

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