I’ve been listening to the Rowland set up and after adding the esoteric k1 dac, the Rowland improved far more than the constellation preamp did. Yes, both did improve but I feel as if the Rowland preamp went a step further. There’s an incredible about of air between instruments, lots of clarity and dynamics.
If I had to make a choice right now, I’d sell my constellation set up and keep the Rowland. That said, that is a bit premature since I still need to unleash the centaur 2s and let them do what they do best PLUS I need to get my nordost Odin 1 speaker cables next week and begin to see how things change. Still lots to do before I make my decision.
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Agreed. Right now, as I listen to the constellation, I feel as if I’m seated a few rows back and with the Rowland I’m a few rows closer. The catch here is that with the constellation I might be able to listen to music for longer periods of time than with the Rowland. Of course, this depends on the volume levels as well. I also want to share one interesting thing with some of you: I feel, based on my own experience, that power hungry speakers such as mine really seem to open up more when using a preamp than using a dac as a preamp. I feel that the demands this type of speaker puts on the amps really transfer all the way to the preamp. Lost of the dacs out there are amazing of course and will do the job just fine but with insane loads like mine, a preamp is almost a must have. A preamp simply has more juice, more “push” than most dacs out there. If you all have hard to drive speakers, remember what I just said. |
There’s nothing Inflated about constellation. It has tremendous soundstage, depth and height. It has perhaps the fullest sound to come out of my neoltihs while still retaining holographic imaging. I can say it’s the best imaging I’ve ever heard here. I’ve said it many times here, at this level it’s all about the flavor you like and the music you listen to. To say one is artificial or bloated, etc isn’t really an accurate statement.
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Ok guys,
both amps and preamps were left on overnight. Everything is ready to go and I just drank a Red Bull so I can be focused.
First up, the full constellation set up for 30 min straight. |
Constellation Virgo 3 with centaur 2 Monos and esoteric grandioso k1 Dac:
PROS
- imaging is out of this planet. I haven’t owned anything that images the way this combo does
- the biggest soundstage I’ve ever heard
- amazing mids
- can be blasted LOUD and you won’t want to turn down the volume. It doesn’t ever get in your face.
- incredible bass control.
- sounds good even with “ok” recordings
- Luxman on steroids in terms of sound quality.
- puts you in the middle row in terms of presentation. This allows for long listening sessions.
CONS
- amps are rather large
- some may not like the look
- although there’s detail and insane resolution, i can see how there might be an ounce or two of resolution that is not as readily Apparent.
- you will need to get a loan or sell your car to buy the centaur 2 Monos unfortunately.
Overall, this combo is incredible. No real weakness in my opinion other than the heavy price tag. If you value spooky imaging, 3D sound, and muscularity,musicality and no fatigue, this will do all of the above in spades. I don’t care what I’ve owned before; Bryston, pass labs, Krell, simaudio, luxman, Musical Fidelity, Plinius, classe, ati, rotel, Cary audio, bat, audio research, McIntosh, etc. This centaur 2 would stump on all of those amps I’ve owned. It would not even be a fair contest but rather a laughing matter. This is in a class by itself and everything else I’ve owned is way behind with the exception of the block audios. STRONGLY RECOMMENDED if you are looking to get some of the best amplification in existence today. You can just bypass all the 300 PLUS amplifiers I’ve owned because they will take a back seat to this one. |
I’ll give my input later tonight on the dcs Vivaldi Versus the esoteric grandioso k1. |
Speakers have a lot to do with the need for a preamp... most dacs are amazing but when you have wicked loads of .5 ohms and efficiency of less than 85db, a dac won’t open up the sound wall to wall. The amps need a preamp to force them to push and most dacs simply don’t have it. Even with all the dacs I’ve owned, I still haven’t heard the huge wide sound that some preamps provide.
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Alright guys,
Decisions, decisions. Today is somewhat difficult for me because I had to make a decision which was to sell either my Rowland or constellation set up. After doing a lot of thinking, analyzing the incurred costs of my dedicated room which simply keep rising as well as looking at the used market, I’ve decided to part ways with the best system i have owned:
the constellation centaur 2 Monos and Virgo 3 preamp. It was hard to decide to do this but I think sometimes it’s all about timing in life and being able to go with the flow. My gut says to keep the constellation gear and my brain says to part ways with it right now and buy it again later down the road. For now, I will continue the journey with my Rowland set up and plan to do my first video with it once the room is ready in about 4 weeks.
RIP constellation— you will be dearly missed. The show must go on !
Coming up: my assessment of the Rowland 925s with Corus preamp, PSU Unit And esoteric k1
i will also give my opinion on the DCS Vivaldi vs esoteric k1.
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Excellent post viber7. It was well documented and loved the way you “crawled” through different gear until you found what you were looking for.
As far as the 15a, they are great speakers and do so much right for the money. Yes I know they lack dynamics and I can see why you said they didn’t image well. You actually found gear that sounded awesome with them and that’s the journey I’ve been through as well with my Neoliths. Remember, the Neolith IS THE SPEAKER that the rest of the Logan models aren’t which is a dynamic panel, huge imagining and tons of air. They capture what the smaller siblings can’t.
I was listening to CH precision last Friday and it didn’t move me for some reason. I felt it sounded sterile, cold, analytical like boulder amplifiers. Maybe it was the weird speakers? As a matter of fact I have a great opportunity to get the C1 ch dac for a good deal but it just didn’t convince me when I heard it. Again, I don’t know what it was.
Luxman has a special place in my world and it will always be my go to brand if I decided to “downsize” at some point. Constellation remains imaging champ in my book. Rowland is awesome as well but it can be somewhat “picky” with the rest of your gear. I will articulate more on this at a later time.
Lastly, yes it’s about the synergy and just because one amp sounds good doesn’t mean it will sound just as good with another speaker. I’ve had the Neoliths for 8 months now and they keep impressing me.
Outside of that, they are one impressive looking speaker that keeps people wondering what they are. Once my room is done, I suspect that each time someone enters the room their eyes will immediately go to the Neolith. It’s just that type of speaker and now that I’ve been dialing things they are far better sounding than when I first got them.
Rowland will continue to be with me and for now I’m not sure what will I try next in the near future. I’d love to try a full gryphon front end but that is a hard acquisition for me. I also want to try soulution or a full agostino front end, but who knows when that will be.
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I can’t buy more speakers... first, I don’t have the space for those big speakers and secondly I can’t buy another speaker while my Neoliths are here. |
The wife won’t be a factor in less than 10 days. I’ll be able to blast things anytime I want and never worry again. Right now it is the space. The Neoliths are huge so I can’t just put them off to the side. They don’t like being tucked away unless your room is the size of a Costco. |
Lol....
Why don't i just steer the conversation away from potential arguments by sharing something with you all...
I wasn't going to share this until a future video but here I go:
Jay is starting a new system from scratch....some components have been sacrificed and are packed and ready to ship out.... I'm doing a big 360... |
Audiolabyrinth,
i recommended and STILL recommend luxman. That said, this doesn’t mean each and everyone of you will also like it.
You seem to prefer Krell over the luxman integrated and that’s cool. That said, there’s nothing “hifi” about the luxman and my recommendation goes based on everything else I’ve owned. It’s awesome gear that gives you a lot for the money but yes it’s not going to be 100% everyone’s cup of tea. There’s no such thing in audio. |
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The room will add freedom, space, privacy, and yes i bought the Sheetrock that is used in studios which is double sided and keeps the noise from exiting the room. The entire room including the ceiling will be using this Sheetrock which is more expensive than standard Sheetrock.
The goal is to get room done first and move the equipment in the room. Eventually I will begin to connect everything thing and take my time decorating it, adding a thing or two etc. The room will go through a transition overtime.
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Viber,
Let’s keep things on target please?
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Throwback Thursday:
The Mark Levinson 533h just entered my room and is going through the motions with the Rowland preamp and K1 dac. It has been a very long time since i had heard this amplifier. i think i owned it at the very beginning of my journey and was very impressed by it. Anyhow, here are my thoughts on the unit from a dead cold start:
1. Clear, clean mids. (Mark levinson is AWESOME AT THIS).
2. Good soundstage width
3. Amazing depth and it seems to be almost creating a "surround sound" effect here. Whoa!
4. Bass is not as deep, but the amp has been playing for only 10 minutes
5. A tad "bright", but again this is a cold amp right now.
I will update my thoughts later on once it has been playing for a few hours. i remember that these amps sounded best after a few days of being plugged in. Without a doubt, the preamp/dac i have has great synergy with this amp. |
Interesting. First time I hear this. |
i think footers and damping chassis on amps, etc really make a difference if you have the equipment to justify it. i dont think a marantz 8077 7 channel amp and the 8805 processor would have a drastic change in sound by doing the above. |
All-
Viber and company,
Please take your ongoing conversation to private messages. Thanks.
Everyone:
I’ve been quite busy with family and the room. Next week I hope to have the air conditioning installed and the room painted which will leave the carpet for last. Once that’s all done, then I’ll have Comcast Come out to wire the room with WiFi and that will be my cue to begin to move my equipment inside.
Unfortunately not much progress has been made this past week because we’ve had tons of rain and the room is as hot as a sauna. I’m not even kidding here. No fan or doors or nothing helps. It’s crazy humid and sticky so it’s almost impossible for workers to spend more than 4-5 hours a day. Once it’s 1pm, no water or fan will help you in the room. You feel like you want to pass out in the room no matter how hydrated you are.
I was going to have the ac installed last week but they had not primed the walls and there was too much dust from the sanding so I was advised against it but I think next week should be ok. I’ll keep you all posted. |
@techno:
Why dont we make that bet happen? one condition though, YOU BUY the Bryston and bring your cheerleaders from Canada (hey, i like Canadian women). I already bought the Mephisto. If that Bryston beats the Mephisto, i'd be the first one to say it. Remember, i am not married to ANY of this... The whole room could be empty tomorrow and i would STILL be alive the next day. It is electronics, toys, nothing to truly fall in love with. i don't think there is one component that i absolutely can not do without simply because i have tried so much that there will always be something else i might want to try...
PS. Video is now uploaded and based on my youtube analytics software, i believe people over at Gryphon in Denmark have subscribed to my channel. Maybe they decide to send me some of the new cables they are about to release for me to try? hmmm.... it is a nice thought.. |
All-
i have noticed a lot of "drama" and lack manners on this thread over the last few months. Some of you (you all know WHO YOU ARE) have messaged me stating that you will no longer post because Viber6 has been too much to deal with and that his LONG AND CONSTANT posts are too much and not allowing for this thread to flow with more content RELEVANT to what this is about. I am guilty of derailing my own thread by reviewing some other things that are not amplifiers such as dacs or preamps, etc. However, please understand that there are 2 groups here fighting to control this thread:
Group 1:
Those of you who choose to sit back and read and not continue to post anymore because Viber6 has been totally annoying (i have been receiving messages about this by many of you ) and because he cant seem to tame his insatiable desire to post every other hour and make his particular posts as long as a chapter from Shakespeare. Also, MANY OF YOU are sick of viber6 recommending components he has ZERO experience with.
i have already privately addressed him to TONE IT DOWN and if he has to keep going back and forth with ONE PERSON, he can take this to private messages. No need to keep going back and forth if the conversation is only happening with him and one other person. I think he is also aware that many of you hate it when he goes on and on recommending equipment he has not even seen in person.
Group 2:
Those of you who side with Viber6 and who feel he contributes to this thread with his posts. i ask for those from Group 1 that if Viber is indeed contributing with something of substance that he has HANDS ON EXPERIENCE WITH to let him state his opinion as long as he is not creating another thread with someone else within my own thread. He has the right to post here as long as he sticks to everything stated above.
i hope this helps everyone here and for some of you (ron17, Paul, red, etc) to come out and begin to contribute here. It is always welcomed. |
No reviews at this time. The whole system is unplugged. I’ll be focusing on the room for the next 10 days. |
I am currently reviewing a USB cable and let me just say that I am incredibly blown away. I can’t put the words together , but just know that this has totally elevated my experience. It feels as if I have a brand new source. More to come. |
Alright guys,
Gryphon Pandora has taken center stage. It is midnight and I'm about to embark on a 2 hour listening session with the Pandora. From the very first 5 seconds i can tell you it's going to be a tough one. The Pandora immediately presented itself with a soundstage the size of a tsunami.
My thoughts will come soon...
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I’d love to have the time but I can’t be looking through all the pages copying everything I’ve said. If someone has the time to do it and send me an email with it all then I’d be glad to paste it. |
Classe is nothing special. They look cool though but besides that, nothing is good about these amps. I actually prefer the old cam400 monos over the 600.
-Update on the room:
the AC is installed
-the walls are painted but need a second pass
- carpet to be installed this Saturday
- room is wired for atmos and surrounds
I should have the room hopefully finished this Saturday (just the room, not the equipment) which also happens to be my birthday. Fingers crossed ! |
All are pretty good guesses. I hope you guys like what i am bringing. I know i can't please everybody but i am trying to put something special in my room. |
This hobby is certainly preferences. I can’t say that everyone would pick what i choose as my top picks. I still stand by what i said: Luxman is incredible for the money AND a few dealers who i am constantly in touch with totally agree with me. Luxman is killer for the money spent and could easily satisfy most people out there. As many of you know, i have owned amps FAR MORE EXPENSIVE than the luxman 900u and I STILL think that luxman is a "poor man’s ultra high end amp".
I was offered a boulder 2060 today and i couldn’t run away fast enough from it. I don’t want cold, sterile amps that leave me bored or not wanting to listen to music for hours. I wouldn’t mind comparing the luxman 900u to the constellation inspiron amp since they are relative close in price and performance. Maybe that will come later down the road.
If i were an amp designer, i think i would create a combination of the luxman/constellation musicality and the gryphon/block audio muscularity. That combo would be lethal for many of us.
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Room update:
atmos, surround back, side surrounds are installed.
Waiting to do the front inwalls, projector, and screen. The carpet is getting installed tomorrow. Still waiting on the solid tech stand I ordered which is coming from Sweden and I’m assuming it’s being delivered by a donkey trying to swim the ocean because it’s taking FOREVER. Until that arrives, I can’t begin to set things up.
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I'm down to spend all the money. Now, who is down to buy all of this stuff when we are done with shootouts? |
Thank you Viber. I'll send you the amp back hopefully by tomorrow or Friday. I'll send you tracking via email .
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People need to understand that class d is getting better and better. The top offerings are not the same as cheap offerings |
I’m not spending 10,000 dollars on a stand.
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I still don’t believe I will ever ever buy a stand that’s 10,000 dollars. Yes I have quite a big investment in my set up but I won’t go into that realm of this hobby. Footers, stillpoints etc, sure I’ll venture into that but I still believe one must first find the components that check all your boxes (or most of them anyway) and then you can begin to play with footers. However, cables need to be addressed first in my opinion. I feel like footers are the final touches after you’re done with cabling, power conditioning, room treatment, and possibly even outlets. |
Awesome gtaphile. That amp WILL be here at some point. I need to see what simaudio has done with it.
Also, I should have the element 116 Monos by the end of the month. I’m really looking forward to it ! |
Tektons could happen some day. I've had a few emails with people wanting to hear the following speakers with my mephisto:
Legacy audio
Sonus Faber tradition
Martin logan clx
Tektons
Goldenear reference
Rockport avior
Focal sopra |
Ladies and gentlemen,
i’ve just posted one teaser picture of the room with a speaker I bought a week ago :)
This will give you a hint of things to come :)
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Thanks Mr Bill. I’m using a cheap $150 dollar Sony receiver from Best Buy. I just wanted to test all the inwalls and this was easily done with this Bluetooth enabled receiver.
I concur that the c4 confidence platinum look great. |
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As far as the simaudio 860a v2, I’ve not heard it yet. That amp is too new and I suspect it will take some time for me to get my hands on it. As far as it beating the 900u, I’d be shocked if it does. I’ve yet to meet an amp that outperforms the luxman 900u for the money. Think of the luxman 900u as the new mid engine c8 vette. It will give those exotic cars a run for the money. A poor man’s Ferrari as they say. |
Welcome c_morris.
@ riaa: thanks for coming back from the dead :)
room update:
all inwalls speakers are installed, carpet is installed and the only thing I am hoping to receive next week is the audio stands and the screen. Right now I have 2 projectors that I am playing with by reflecting images on the wall in order to determine how large I want the screen to be. Surprisingly, a $500 Epson 1080p projector is kicking the hell out of the 7,000 jvc x770r. The jvc looks washed out in comparison and this is in my pitch black room. Granted, I am projecting 4K images on a dark wall so maybe things might be different once I buy an acoustically transparent screen.
It is getting annoying at this point because the screen and stands are taking so damn long to arrive. I don’t want to unpack any equipment at all until the projector and the screen are installed.
So on my end, I’m done. I’m pretty much waiting on the last few items so I can finish the room.
I am also going to be doing room treatment after the entire room is set up. |
Neoliths are still plan of the room. The c4s will be my back up pair. For now, the Neoliths are in my living room because as I stated above, I still have a few things left to do and their large size would be a pain in the butt to deal with as I still have to drill holes in the ceiling to mount the projector etc. If I do end up changing speakers, you guys will know about this. As of right now, the Neoliths are still part of my plan.
That said, I’m a little pissed off that I went with the Martin Logan axis in walls for the front wall. These speakers don’t have any back box so my wife claims that she can hear them inside the house but when I play the c4s, she can barely hear them. I wish I had bought in walls with back boxes.
Lesson learned guys.... don’t buy speakers that don’t have a back box because if you have adjacent rooms, they might be able to hear them and if that’s a bedroom, they won’t be able to sleep. I’ve tried researching a simple solution for this but everything I find is quite complicated for me to do. I wish there was something I can use inside the holes in order to encapsulate the speaker but everything I find seems like a project requiring for me to cut wood and create a wooden box etc and I’m not sure I want to do all that. |
Amazing ! Thanks for this tip. I will go ahead and check it out.
Ok so tomorrow the Epson 6050 projector arrives and on Monday the 138 inch , 235:1 ratio acoustically transparent screen arrives as well. The last thing will be the audio rack which I hope to have next week.
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Nothing "extra" is needed other than just saying what you think the speaker is... |
Update:
Projector is mounted and ready. The screen arrives today and should be mounted this week.
Remaining items that have not been delivered:
Solid Tech Stands
Once the stands arrive, the madness of connecting everything begins, but luckily the in-wall speakers are already wired so it is just a matter of connecting my front end. Once the whole room is up and running, i will begin to look into room treatments. I am hoping to have everything good to go by 17th of this month so essentially about 10 more days or maybe less.
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$40 large is a boat load of money for many people so i suspect that those that want to eat caviar at beef jerky prices are probably on their way to low ball. |
The dealer is closing doors...I know the entire story on those speakers and this is why he is losing money on them. He’s being forced out of his location and needs to make a move with all that gear.
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