My Long List of Amplifiers and My Personal Review of Each!


So I have been in a long journey looking to find the best amplifiers for my martin logan montis. As you know, the match between an amplifier and speakers has to be a good "marriage" and needs to be blend exquisitely. Right now, I think I might have found the best sounding amplifier for martin logan. I have gone through approximately 34-36 amplifiers in the past 12 months. Some of these are:

Bryston ST, SST, SST2 series
NAD M25
PARASOUND HALO
PARASOUND CLASSIC
KRELL TAS
KRELL KAV 500
KRELL CHORUS
ROTEL RMB 1095
CLASSE CT 5300
CLASSE CA 2200
CLASSE CA 5200
MCINTOSH MC 205
CARY AUDIO CINEMA 7
OUTLAW AUDIO 755
LEXICON RX7
PASS LABS XA 30.8
BUTLER AUDIO 5150
ATI SIGNATURE SERIES 6005

With all that said, the amplifiers I mentioned above are the ones that in my opinion are worth mentioning. To make a long story short, there is NO 5 CHANNEL POWER AMP that sounds as good as a 3ch and 2ch amplifier combination. i have done both experiments and the truth is that YOU DO lose details and more channel separation,etc when you select a 5 channel power amplifier of any manufacturer.
My recollection of what each amp sounded like is as follows:

ATI SIGNATURE SERIES 6005 (great power and amazing soundstage. Very low noise floor, BUT this amplifiers NEEDS TO BE cranked up in order to fully enjoy it. If you like listening at low volume levels or somewhat moderate, you are wasting your time here. This amp won’t sound any different than many other brands out there at this volume. The bass is great, good highs although they are a bit bright for my taste)

NAD M25 (very smooth, powerful, but somewhat thin sounding as far as bass goes)
Bryston sst2(detailed, good soundstage, good power, but can be a little forward with certain speakers which could make them ear fatiguing at loud volumes)

Krell (fast sounding, nice bass attack, nice highs, but some detail does get lost with certain speakers)

rotel (good amp for the money, but too bright in my opinion)

cary audio (good sound overall, very musical, but it didn’t have enough oomph)

parasound halo (good detail, great bass, but it still holds back some background detail that i can hear in others)

lexicon (very laid back and smooth. huge power, but if you like more detail or crisper highs, this amp will disappoint you)

McIntosh mc205 (probably the worst multichannel amp given its price point. it was too thin sounding, had detail but lacked bass.

butler audio (good amplifier. very warm and smooth sweet sounding. i think for the money, this is a better amp than the parasound a51)

pass labs (very VERY musical with excellent bass control. You can listen to this for hours and hours without getting ear fatigue. however, it DOES NOT do well in home theater applications if all you have is a 2 channel set up for movies. The midrange gets somewhat "muddy" or very weak sounding that you find yourself trying to turn it up.

classe audio (best amplifier for multi channel applications. i simply COULDNT FIND a better multi channel amplifier PERIOD. IT has amazing smoothness, amazing power and good bass control although i would say krell has much better bass control)

Update: The reviews above were done in January 2015. Below is my newest update as of October 2016:



PS AUDIO BHK 300 MONOBLOCKS: Amazing amps. Tons of detail and really amazing midrange. the bass is amazing too, but the one thing i will say is that those of you with speakers efficiency of 87db and below you will not have all the "loudness" that you may want from time to time. These amps go into protection mode when using a speaker such as the Salon, but only at very loud levels. Maybe 97db and above. If you don’t listen to extreme crazy levels, these amps will please you in every way.

Plinius Odeon 7 channel amp: This is THE BEST multichannel amp i have ever owned. Far , but FAR SUPERIOR to any other multichannel amp i have owned. In my opinion it destroyed all of the multichannel amps i mentioned above and below. The Odeon is an amp that is in a different tier group and it is in a league of its own. Amazing bass, treble and it made my center channel sound more articulate than ever before. The voices where never scrambled with the action scenes. It just separated everything very nicely.

Theta Dreadnaught D: Good detailed amp. Looks very elegant, has a pleasant sound, but i found it a tad too bright for my taste. I thought it was also somewhat "thin" sounding lacking body to the music. could be that it is because it is class d?

Krell Duo 300: Good amp. Nice and detailed with enough power to handle most speakers out there. I found that it does have a very nice "3d" sound through my electrostatics. Nothing to fault here on this amp.
Mark Levinson 532H: Great 2 channel amp. Lots of detail, amazing midrange which is what Mark Levinson is known for. It sounds very holographic and will please those of you looking for more detail and a better midrange. As far as bass, it is there, but it is not going to give you the slam of a pass labs 350.5 or JC1s for example. It is great for those that appreciate classical music, instrumental, etc, but not those of you who love tons of deep bass.

 It is articulate sounding too
Krell 7200: Plenty of detail and enough power for most people. i found that my rear speakers contained more information after installed this amp. One thing that i hated is that you must use xlr cables with this amp or else you lose most of its sound performance when using RCA’s.

Krell 402e: Great amp. Very powerful and will handle any speaker you wish. Power is incredible and with great detail. That said, i didn’t get all the bass that most reviewers mentioned. I thought it was "ok" in regards to bass. It was there, but it didn’t slam me to my listening chair.

Bryston 4B3: Good amp with a complete sound. I think this amp is more laid back than the SST2 version. I think those of you who found the SST2 version of this amp a little too forward with your speakers will definitely benefit from this amp’s warmth. Bryston has gone towards the "warm" side in my opinion with their new SST3 series. As always, they are built like tanks. I wouldn’t call this amp tube-like, but rather closer to what the classe audio delta 2 series sound like which is on the warm side of things.

Parasound JC1s: Good powerful amps. Amazing low end punch (far superior bass than the 402e). This amp is the amp that i consider complete from top to bottom in regards to sound. Nothing is lacking other than perhaps a nicer chassis. Parasound needs to rework their external appearance when they introduce new amps. This amp would sell much more if it had a revised external appearance because the sound is a great bang for the money. It made my 800 Nautilus scream and slam. Again, amazing low end punch.

Simaudio W7: Good detailed amp. This amp reminds me a lot of the Mark Levinson 532h. Great detail and very articulate. I think this amp will go well with bookshelves that are ported in order to compensate for what it lacks when it comes to the bass. That doesn’t mean it has no bass, but when it is no Parasound JC1 either.
Pass labs 350.5: Wow, where do i begin? maybe my first time around with the xa30.8 wasn’t as special as it was with this monster 350.5. It is just SPECTACULAR sounding with my electrostatics. The bass was THE BEST BASS i have ever heard from ANY amp period. The only amp that comes close would be the jC1s. It made me check my settings to make sure the bass was not boosted and kept making my jaw drop each time i heard it. It totally destroyed the krell 402e in every regard. The krell sounded too "flat" when compared to this amp. This amp had amazing mirange with great detail up top. In my opinion, this amp is the best bang for the money. i loved this amp so much that i ended up buying the amp that follows below.

Pass labs 250.8: What can i say here. This is THE BEST STEREO AMP i have ever heard. This amp destroys all the amps i have listed above today to include the pass labs 350.5. It is a refined 350.5 amp. It has more 3d sound which is something the 350.5 lacked. It has a level of detail that i really have never experienced before and the bass was amazing as well. I really thought it was the most complete power amplifier i have ever heard HANDS DOWN. To me, this is a benchmark of an amplifier. This is the amp that others should be judged by. NOTHING is lacking and right now it is the #1 amplifier that i have ever owned.

My current amps are Mcintosh MC601s: i decided to give these 601s a try and they don’t disappoint. They have great detail, HUGE soundstage, MASSIVE power and great midrange/highs. The bass is great, but it is no pass labs 250.8 or 350.5. As far as looks, these are the best looking amps i have ever owned. No contest there. i gotta be honest with you all, i never bought mcintosh monos before because i wasn’t really "wowed" by the mc452, but it could have been also because at that time i was using a processor as a preamp which i no longer do. Today, i own the Mcintosh C1100 2 chassis tube preamp which sounds unbelievable. All the amps i just described above have been amps that i auditioned with the C1100 as a preamp. The MC601s sound great without a doubt, but i will say that if you are looking for THE BEST sound for the money, these would not be it. However, Mcintosh remains UNMATCHED when it comes to looks and also resale value. Every other amp above depreciates much faster than Mcintosh.

That said, my future purchase (when i can find a steal of a deal) will be the Pass labs 350.8. I am tempted to make a preliminary statement which is that i feel this amp could be THE BEST stereo amp under 30k dollars. Again, i will be able to say more and confirm once i own it. I hope this update can help you all in your buying decisions!


jays_audio_lab

Showing 50 responses by techno__dude

I agree that preamps and dacs don’t need to be very expensive anymore to give near or sota results. The Christine pre and Benchmark pre are probably good examples. My own experience showed this in me acquiring a 4.5 k $ CAD demo Mac pre with included dac module that bested a 6 k$ USD dac and separate preamp.

Amps and specially speakers, thats another story.
I still don’t agree that someone needs to pay the big $ to get sota preamp or dac performance. Most of audiophiles preaching that route would fail the blind test and have their jaw dropped.

Sure, WC ´s journey through prestigious preamps is very interesting and I would absolutely not want him to go otherwise. It’s very cool to read about the top stuff outhere.
But a thread is also for discussing options, all options. That is the beauty of this hobby.
Keep dreaming rbach. 

Just filter Viber6 posts and be done with it. But they keep reading and returning, it seems like an addiction... a love hate story... lol
Esoteric is king of digital. All the others with their R2R or Ring dac technology are living in the past...they were ruling 15 years ago , not anymore.
These days, multibit mesures better and performs better. Esoteric has learned how to get the best out of it.
Suddenly, what ?!! So all that preamp is king praise was just bs...

Oh dear.
It seems your friends are more influential....than the soundstage inflation preamp song we normally read. Are you sure you have enough huge bass slam going direct ?...

Maybe your ears and preferences are shifting.....

to......

Viber’s land.... 

Oh dear, this is huge.





Do not change the M-900u. It’s a giant killer amp.

If you still don’t like your system, look elsewhere. Preamplifier first to change the taste of the sound ( PRAT and timing, tube euphonics). A little spice may be all you need to add.


Speakers also are maybe the culprit.
Clocks and upsamplers were not invented by DCS. ( Their custom ring dac is unique I agree) 

So Riaa is right, WC should save himself money.

Or else he is maybe in agreement with the dealer to ’’test and promote’’ a full DCS stack...
Panic mode, let’s change topic. DCS multi box stack is being laughed at.
Sure there must be a Mutec distributor reading this who can send you the dawn clock.

 So that you can once open your mind to the same objectivity your readers have for your thread...
You would not, you do like my posts, in your own way. I have been right many times...

I believe Maple has a valid point. Though I don’t think WC is a dealer, I believe a close friend of him is a dealer and they help each other. Maybe they split profits ? Who knows ? Sure when you move that number of gear, it should only be a matter of time before you make a close friend out there.

WC should not be mad about this. It’s just the life of having a big thread like this one. Chill out, it’ s just audio guys...
zprr,

Very interested to read you about the differences between Moon 740p, 850p and how they compare to the legendary ARC Ref10.
I have a feeling there will be a DCS full stack for sale at Hifi palace soon.

Ok seriously, back to topic.
That kind of up sampling must me doable in a computer software or powerful sota server.
That preamp yt review is a simple mess. After the video, we are left more confused than before watching it...

No doubt you need to bring back all preamps to try with your new  VIP Gryphon cables. It will bring magic kingdom to preamps results.
Many whatsbestforum audiophiles own the Sigma NR after having compared it to the Odin. So my guess is yes it’s up there with the best.
The Shunyata Sigma NR is supposed to compete with it for much less $.

Just saying.
Shunyata has a new one : the Omega QR. To rule over all pcs.

Much less money than Odin 2.

My two cents, Shunyata for powercords, Nordost for speaker cables.
Isn’t it akward that your vast dealer contacts and gear availability never have given you the opportunity to compare the Sigma NR to the Odin PCs.

Only one reason, they don’t want you to. Sigma NR doesnt need to be pushed to sell, as it’s price point is much lower. It ´s not a big buck maker for them.
I would recommend Sasha DAW instead. 
Alexia need the space, need the amps, and  need the extra money. It is a heck of a complicated speaker to implement...
You see. Many prefer the DAW to the Alexia. 
There is a reason for that. 
Some dealers here seems to not like the fact that the DAW are the mostly prefered speaker. They always go crying when people find things are not what they should be price wise....

Your 802d3 are lacking bass ( your words) , not the DAW.
None of them have owned the Alexia. But a lot of them have listen to both side by side.
And you WC, have you listened to the DAW and Alexia side by side ? No. I rest my case.
DAW + a nice Rel subwoofer would be my personal choice.

Mayor, Viber and me have nothing to be teached from someone who bought speakers that lacks bass. It just prooves how good you are when it’s time to buy main speakers...and we are not even discussing the amp match that you made...
WC, you are right.

But mayor started the hostility on me without any provocation from my part. I was only recommending the Wilson Sasha DAW.
I do wish him only the best in 2020, like choosing the right speakers ( this time).
Very interesting WC.
When up with the big boys, ARC tends to render arms everytime. Your experience has shown this with amps and preamps.

Same thing with the 802D3, maybe Mayor ( our most impressive thread speaker expert after WC), can develop on that matter...
We all know this. The DAW is the superior more recent speaker, the Alexia 1 has poor bass control. WC wants us to believe everybody that has heard that uncontrolled bass did not have them set up with proper amps. I know this is mostly wrong, a well made speaker design these days does not need that huge amount of power to work reasonably. Not nearly the case. And Wilson did make the Alexia 2 for a reason , didnt’ they ...

And now the measurements show this also. The one who argues it lives in denial, plain and simple.
But still, the Alexia 1 must be a very great speaker for WC to live with them in his new room. With all his experience, if he swears by them, sure they must sound incredible.

Don’t want to ruin the party with my last post. I have a lot of respect for WC ´s experience. 
Ohh the M3 Magico.

Looking forward to learn about how they compare to the Alexia 1 and the Scala Evos.
Some can be stubborn when the truth is in the front of they eyes. But just won’t admit it.

Wilson changed the Alexia 1 profoundly for the Alexia 2 for a reason. If the 1s were so good and perfect, why change them ? An amplifier can only do so much if the speaker design has a flaw.


The Alexia 1 have a bass / crossover flaw that was recognized by both the audiophile community and Wilson itself by having changed that specific point in the 2s. WC is only minimizing that flaw with better amps... You know what they say, put lipstick on a pig, it’s still a pig...
Yes, they move forward.
But in the case of the Alexia 1 , each day that passes a different user comes here testifying about it’s flaws... Not me. There is smoke everyday about them here, yet you keep saying there is no fire...that the fire comes from others or reviewers amps...that only your amplifiers are the ones that are fire free...


Sure it’s great that all this sota gear is being reviewed.

But if the gear ends up at a dealer close to WC, we have no choice but to take the review with a grain of salt. It would explain why he never exposes directly the flaws of a piece no more. The more dealers or makers with sale interests around you, the more reserved you become in your critics. You do not want to offend your close relationships...

This is still a great thread. With great opinions. We sure have to give WC credit, and some slack.
This is why I do not use a laptop as a digital transport. I use a tower pc , and a IFi iusb power to not transmit any noise from the computer to the dac inlet. I also use the Fidelizer software that shuts down everything that is not audio needed to transmit the audio files.


If one uses a pc also, never use the accessories side usb outlets. Always use the main ones that are conected to the mother board.
The Boulder pre is gone. The best pre he owned. This thread is not about owning the best gear anymore, it has become about moving the gear now...

Sure has the voice of a salesman ? on yt.
theophile , we are all contributing mostly nothing to this thread. Think about it, it’s about WC’s journey. All we can do is give opinions and advice. You don’t like mine, just block me and be happy again.
Ok sorry , I was a bit rude I admit.
This thread is still very good. I guess we will have to keep enjoying the revealing of differences between the gear, instead of knowing which one is good or bad. It’s a bit sad, because that way we try to read between the lines, and that often brings confusion into the discussion . Anyway, that’s the way it’s going to be, will have to live with it.
Was first to watch the 2nd video. Much better than the first by the way.

Very interesting to know the Focal Scala Evos are amp friendly and never need the Pass XS 300 to get out of their class A range. Compared to the Dyn and Wilson.
Any plan on trying MSB to trial against the dCs and Esoteric ?

You could also bring back the Chord Dave, to ear how it compares in your new room and rig.


Still no news about the Magico M3 ?

Let me guess, they lack bass compared to the Alexia 1...
( this will happen to any speaker that doesn’t have overblown bass like this older discontinued Wilson model).
The Magico beryllium tweeter should be better resolute than the soft dome of the Alexia 1. It’s always the case with cymbals decay. The tradoff is normally the beryllium which can be hot at high volumes reproding some instruments. This is why Magico puts a very thin layer of diamond on their beryllium dome. B&W have the best dome imho, all diamond.

Now Viber can write about HF clarity. 😉
Yes he is kind of show offy and his love for the big expensive prestigious is getting through unfiltered on yt. But it’s all fine. He ´s human , we all are, our passion transpires raw sometimes. As long as we don’t take this too seriously, knowing the gear is moving and gets resale and the ´´ reviews ´´ ( entertainment ? maybe not that far) are filtered not to offend... We do get to learn about the ultra high end. WC do have some kind of an open mind, for example he listened to the advice with some music playing in the second video...
You could do video surprises by trying some cheaper dacs that you can compare with your sota Esoteric and dCs. There are many online 30 day trial dacs , so you won’t lose anything as you can return them easy.
Ask yourselves this.

Why does WC does not hang on whatsbestforum with audiophiles like him who possesses sota gear like he does, from whom he could learn and discuss. With experienced guys who also own ultra high end gear...

Because WC doesn’t like advice ? Because he can’t sell something there? Because they are pretty much rational up there and do not not fall into the ´´ the more expensive it is , the better it is’´ camp ?
Who knows ?




Any manufacturer would be bless by the fact you review and compare their much less expensive dac to big guns like the Esoteric Grandioso and dCs Vivaldi. They won’t loose anything. It would only up their sales. What are you afraid of...Would it offend your close relations in the high end business...


My father always said the truth hurts. WC, don’t be hurt by my critics, it’s just audio after all. Drop the ´´ultra high end ego ´´ just a bit. I’ m not the only one saying this. Remember, without us , this thread would be a 1 post 1 user discussion...
OP harassment !! 
Come one guys, let’s get back to audio. Nobody interested to know how those Magico M3 compare to the Wilson ?
Not everybody, only some who like to be off topic and pollute the thread...
Ego still hurt because we have seen through the ´´ never offending friend’s reviews’´. Or maybe because some of us don’t agree with you the Alexia 1 being a great buy ?... Just relax, it’s audio , it’s a thread, some of us will challenge you sometimes.


The Magico M3, are they great ? You are a lucky person, we keep following you. I have even subscribed to your yt channel as you suggested.