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Martin Logan Aerius i vs. Spica TC-60

I've just bought a used pair of Aerius i's to replace my recently-acquired Spica TC-60s, and I've had 'em for half a day now. It's been a very interesting adjustment. Before I get into the comparison, though, I'll first address a 'goner's concern that the Aeriuses might be too bright with my Adcom amps. They are a bit bright, but this is easily offset with positioning, at least in my room. First, my listening chair is quite low, putting my ears at 36". I figured I was too low, so I tipped the speakers forward a bit by raising the back foot 1/2". Whoa. Too bright. Horns were aggressive. Untipped the speakers and toed them in just a bit more than recommended, and that took care of any residual brightness. I like a solid center more than a wide stage, so toeing suits me.

Now, I've gotta say, as far as imaging goes, my old Spica TC-60s put up a bloody good fight, and are actually better on simple, intimate vocal material. The Spicas elicit a "Wow!" on Boz Scaggs' "But Beautiful" and Lyle Lovett's "I Love Everyone", and the Aeriuses don't. Boz' voice hangs in the air like a levitating brick on the Spicas, like a cloud of smoke on the Aeriuses. On "I Love Everyone", the beautifully recorded drum kit is rock solid on the Spicas, a bit see-through on the Aeriuses.

That said, the Aeriuses do just about everything else as well or better. Detail is finer, bass is deeper and rounder, more life-size, but fairly agile. Tonal balance is otherwise very similar to the Spicas. Both could use another dB or two in the upper midrange. Where the Aeriuses steal the show, though, is on more complex material with a bigger soundstage. On the Manhattan Transfer's "Offbeat of Avenues" and Manu Dibango's "Wakafrica", the layered voices are more distinct and have lots of space around them. Little Feat's live "Waiting for Columbus" is amazingly big, live, reverberant and exciting.

I can't see going back to the Spicas, but I'm loathe to give them up, too. Wish I had two living rooms. The whole exercise has given me a new appreciation of just how astoundingly good the Spicas are at what they do best. The going prices for used ones make them an absolute steal.

Not that I can afford to trade up, but I'm wondering what speakers in the $1k-$2k (used) range might combine the Aerius' huge soundstage and detail with the Spicas' rock-solid center imaging and meaty vocals. Any thoughts? I've auditioned Gallo's Reference 3 and a $3k Audio Physic, and neither did it for me.
jacquescornell
doncar
2 posts
 
My Logan experience takes a slightly different tack from previous submissions, but you might be interested. I can't speak to the Spicas, but I did go through a series of Logan upgrades: Aeirius i - SL3 - reQuests (which I still have). Amplification was consistently S/S - Aragon 8008BB.

First: I found that, as the crossover frequency dropped with the increased panel area, the soundstage "depth" grew immensely. (Big surprise - right!) More to the point, the brightness (I thought) I had heard in the Aerius, was just more apparent in the compressed frequency range from the smaller panel. With the SL3 and reQuest upgrades, I could better assess the high frequency range and it wasn't bright at all, just annoyingly aggressive - and that had been consistent with all three models. I tried upgrading the Logan's power cords and, believe it or not, it was instantly smoother! I would try that fix first - before investing large in amps. (And yes, "Spikes" make a huge difference.)

Interconnects and Speaker Cables were also large contributors. Starting with Transparent Link/Wave Plus - the system is now completely wired with Transparent Ultra and the Logans just kept getting sweeter. Finally, I invested in an AudioPrism Foundation 3 - everything was "blacker" and less aggressive again.

Nowhere in any of this, does anyone identify "source"...? All three models of the Logans beat-up on CD Players. I started with a Krell 250, (too digital) then Classé CDP 1.5, (too flat) then Wadia 830, (it had dogs wailing) and finally a Krell 280..."music" at last. I'm wondering if Aerius is revealing the "digital" in your CDP?

I don't know if your into analog but, if you have an opportunity to listen to a decent T/T with your Aerius...well, just try it and see!

Anyway, just my experience - for what it's worth.

Good Luck!
no_money
638 posts
 
I'm with Doncar, I have used Transparent with Martin Logan speakers for 10 years or so upgrading a little over time. Currently I have Ascent with Ultra mm speaker cable.

I had the original Aerius, they can take a LOT more power then you think. Upgrading from a 100wpc CJ (lower end... forget the model) to a Proceed HPA-2 with 250 a channel opened them up big time. I Picked up a used Adcom with 200 wpc while the Proceed was in the shop last year and it did pretty darn good as well for only being $350, just not as refined.
barnes
45 posts
 
I've had Aeris I for about 10 years now. They can take a lot of Power. Although rated at 200 Watts, I Currently have McIntosh Mc402, which I can get them to clip on sometimes. (Use to have a Bryston Hooked up to them). Very sweet sounding with the Mac. Placement is critical though. I have mine in a small room. I don't think there is a better speaker for the money. My dealer would confirm that.
jacquescornell OP
56 posts
 
Thanks, All, for the feedback.

Honest1-
Much as I like and respect the Spicas, I can't keep 'em now that the Aeriuses are imaging well. I don't have room for them, and money's tight. The Spicas have more of a "Wow!" factor on some intimate vocals in near-field listening, and I'll miss that particular thrill, but the Aeriuses paint the entire front wall with sound from farther away, and that's a strength that's enjoyable on a wider range of material. They're very different listening experiences, but I'm finding that although a few CDs work better on the Spicas, most of the time I prefer the Aeriuses. In addition, the extra money spent on the Aeriuses (twice the price) buys more realistic bass and slightly better detail. For under $1,000, the Spicas are incredible. But, the Aeriuses are over $2,000 and worth every penny. (Of course, I bought used and paid only half those figures.) I hesitate to even compare them: it's like putting Sugar Ray Leonard in the ring with Muhammed Ali. They both punched above their weight, but it wouldn't be much of a contest. They're both champs.

I don't know which model of Audio Physics I auditioned, but they were current models retailing for $3k. Serious suckout in the upper bass, and imaging decent but not comparable to the Spicas.

Slikrik-
As they're on hardwood floors, and I'm too cheap and lazy to go out and pay $50 for brass disks, I'm using pennies with tiny dabs of poster putty to stick 'em to the floor and keep 'em from slipping or rattling. Seems to work quite well.

Doncar-
Although I've never heard the larger MLs, I have no doubt you're right about the advantages of larger panels. Unfortunately, I have a brass wallet to go with my golden ears. The Aeriuses are probably the best speakers I'm going to be able to afford for a long time. From here on out, I'm strictly limited to cheap tweaks. The only thing I can see spending more than a couple hundred bucks on in the next year is the front end. As for cables, well, let me confess that I'm a heretic: I've always been skeptical about claims for expensive wire, and after reading the following articles,

http://sound.westhost.com/cablewhitepaper.htm
http://sound.westhost.com/cables.htm

I can't see spending more than $200 to find out if my skepticism is warranted. The first article, by one of the founders of ESL-maker Innersound, seems to indicate that the ESL panel may benefit from low-inductance & low-capacitance coaxial cable, whereas the woofer will benefit from heavy low-impedance solid or braided cable. It makes sense to me, too, that direct biamping would give the amp tighter control over the woofer more than any cable tweak used with passive biamping would. However, direct biamping of the MLs seems to be a complicated endeavor fraught with peril, so I'm content to sit tight and just enjoy the already stellar performance I've got right now. I'm already enjoying sound far better than I dreamed I could afford, so it feels ungrateful to keep pushing for more.

If a $200 set of cables would make a clearly audible improvement over my Monster XP, I'd be tempted though...

No Money & Barnes-
I'm sure the MLs can take more power. I'm just not sure what I'd do with it. Live levels on even low key stuff like Steely Dan is already running the risk of alienating my neighbors in this quiet prewar NYC apartment building, and Little Feat is definitely pushing it.

Thanks, everybody, for the conversation. I'm having fun both listening and learning. Ain't that what it's all about?
jacquescornell OP
56 posts
 
Doncar-
I'm sure you're right about the CDP - it's an H/K CD changer. Although the specs look good on paper (dual 20-bit Burr-Brown A/D converters and HDCD decoding), H/K has never won much praise for its CD players. Probably just competent mid-fi. Not sure where to go from here for $500 or less.

As for analog, I've got an AR table from the early '80s with a Sumiko Premiere MMT arm and a Dynavector DV-10x4 HO MC cartridge that's in need of replacing, but it has sat in a closet up in NH since the mid '80s, when I left the country for most of 14 years. Unfortunately, during that time of inactivity, the weight of the platter deformed the motor bearings, resulting a nasty once-per-rotation "thunk". The motor's gotta be replaced, and as I only ever had about 200 LPs, I'm not sure it's worth the trouble to rent a car (I live in NYC - no car) to drive up and pick it up along with my ancient LPs in unknown but dubious condition. A terrible waste, I know. Haven't decided what to do about it.

BTW, please don't take my skepticism about cables personally. I don't mean to snub anyone, as I'm sure you all have practical experience to back up your advice. It's just a pathology of mine - I don't believe things until I see/hear them for myself, especially when they threaten my tiny puddle of filthy lucre. I'll definitely keep your cable advice in mind, though, as I continue my audiophile education.
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