Jazz for aficionados

Loved the David Ware piece.  He's right up there with Coltrane when it comes to length of solo.

Nice clip

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Noise Makers are not as numerous as they where once.  Maybe my scathing commentary made them see the light. :)

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Seems as if they 'quoted' the entire "Just A Closer Walk With Thee".

Still good stuff.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EpiTwIK0J68

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That so-called 'Jamaican Beat' gets old fast.  You could be jamming to a tune, and the DJ could change records and you would never realize it.  It all sounds the same.   

The clip is OK.   Just like any other music from that place.  Which proves that being high does not result in creative music making.

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Eddie Daniels:

I think Mr Daniels "classical" training is beginning to show a little too much, considering he is supposed to be playing Jazz.  Brought to mind 'William Tell'.

Ron Odrich:

I make the same argument against this guy, that you make against Wynton..

Both excellent players and have surely mastered their instrument, however......

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Consider this:  Suppose the Violin had the same penetration, prominence and importance in classical music, that the Bass Clarinet has in Jazz.

There's your answer.

Today's Listen:

Thelonious Monk -- THE LONDON COLLECTION VOLUME ONE

From 1971.  Monk's last recorded performance.  Solo Monk.

Outstanding Sound Quality.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZlwxR9duH-Y

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JWGXp8w9F4Q

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fgm5O3BlnLY 

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After all, This is Saturday Night.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FvzNeh4Mq1o

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BTvupngKy6A

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kFYqz1yv0WM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=noFS4_oEakI

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Saint Martin in the Fields is a great group.   Started by renegades I understand.  I also have them doing Water / Fireworks.  With Marriner.

Thanks for the info.

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Question for The Frogman:

I am listening to Handel's Water Music done by 'The Akademie fur Alte Musik Berlin'.

There are 23 players, but no Conductor.  Why is that?   How big does a group have to be before a conductor is required?

Thanks

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Today's Listen:

Thelonious Monk -- THE LONDON COLLECTION VOL 2

All his usual songs are here.  Monk really loved playing all his 'hits'.  But, you couldn't tell by the liner notes, because there aren't any.   Just a folded piece of paper with Monk's name and the title of the CD.   

Amazon listed 6 tracks, Goggle says 8, my CD player says 7.  Requested a return from Amazon, they agreed, said I could keep this one. 

I think this is one of those CDs they make on demand.  I am missing 'Hackensack'.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oM-upmlM_wg

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-IKofzm7fTA

Excellent Sound Quality.  Al McKibbon on Bass and Art Blakey on drums.  They don't add much. 

Again, his last recording as leader, so it's a must have for me.

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@pryso 

Booklets and liner notes are so important, like mini history books.  Sometimes the history surrounding the recording / performance of the music is just as important as the music itself.

There are New Black Lion sets for sale on Amazon for around 600 dollars US.   Some used ones start at around 100 dollars.   I think I will have to manage with my reissues.

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Just what is it, that you expect folks to do after reading 'posts of that nature'?

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We have been at this for over 5 years. Those guys have been posted and discussed many times. Including ’Very Tall Band". This is the last one I posted. The video has been taken down, but this audio only version is still on you-tube.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=abUBJlLHBOI

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The OP should be able to say what is, and what is not, appropriate for this thread.  Most OPs don't stay with their threads the way our OP has.

I just assumed that this was surely a First Amendment crowd.   If JAZZ is not about free expression, what is it about?

Talking about 'social conditions', and talking about Jazz, is almost the same thing.   That's what Wynton said.

Besides, it bothers me that the OP is walking around with all that nonsense in his head.   I feel obligated to show him the light.

That Jazz came from the most oppressed group of people in this country was no accident.  Jazz is freedom of speech.

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Sidney Bechet: Creole Blues

There you go.

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Jimmy Cliff:

I like this guy.  I have a greatest hits CD of his music.  I guess I like some of all music.   Just like everyone else.

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***** Now, while I would disagree with the idea that a thread started on a public forum with a stated purpose has a sort of built-in rule that the OP determines the path of the thread no matter what and concerns of others be dammned, even when that path has title to do with the stated purpose, that certainly is one way to approach participation in a thread.*****

Vintage, The Frogman, The Strawman.   You said that, not the OP, and certainly not me.  The path of the thread has not changed one bit.

***** However, is it inappropriate for participants to disagree with that approach and to say so? I don’t think so. As you say...freedom of speech.  No?*****

Freedom of speech means just that, so I fail to see a problem here.  The OP and anyone else can post as they see fit, and you and others can like it, or not, as you see fit.   And if the OP does not like what YOU post, he can let you know.

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*****Your fallback “straw man” thing is getting a little tired*****

Well then, you can imagine how tired we are of you doing it.

*****Perhaps you enjoy the controversy and the ensuing negativity. I don’t. *****

Most often, when the OP goes off on one of his kool-aid induced rants, I am the only one that responds.   I can assure you, I have no negative feelings towards anyone. 

Now, if folks get negative feelings just from reading what the OP says, then that's a whole different conversation.   Then the OP is not the problem.

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He may indeed!! He does have connections. Remember, he is an Audiophile. He even called the ’moderators’ on me once.

On this forum, the person that answers or responds to an attacking post gets censured. Never the attacker.

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'JAZZ'  Version???     AAUGH!!!!!!!

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Definition of sense of humor : a personality that gives someone the ability to say funny things and see the funny side of things 

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We don't need no stinkin' Bass Clarinets!!!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zRKkk2xJ-lw

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TtdtALTixEQ

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*****We don’t need no stinking humor!!! :*****

Actually, some of you do.

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Cannonball?

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I remember a few years back, when the discussion was, The Best Jazz LP of all time.   The contenders were 'KOB' and 'Something Else'.   Miles and Cannonball play on both LPs.

If not Cannonball on KOB, then who?

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I agree with Pryso.  I didn't pick Cannonball because of his playing on KOB, but because of my perception of his personality.  He was the odd guy out. 

Miles was full of himself.   Didn't care if his audience 'got it' or not.  Thought he was the Lord's gift to Jazz.   Brilliant.  Same could be said of Trane.   Of course this is pre-Sinbad and  Space travel to Stellar Regions.

Cannonball was the opposite.  Check out how he often  gave a verbal introduction to his tunes.   He wanted his audience to be involved.   Had a lot of the Southern church in him.   You could find his music on Juke Boxes.   Brilliant.

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Me either

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CDWyfm_aYxg

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oGR947AOvlg

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ymnXaR6h9p0

From my earliest memories of Jazz

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Carla Bley:

Something Old, Something New, Something Borrowed, Something Blue.

Just don’t call it Jazz.

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Spiritual:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x0PlS8nuceA

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l7aAJAhU0Xs

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*****  I know, I know, Rok *****

I didn't say a word, and as of yet, a person in this country, cannot be persecuted for what he thinks.

Besides, I have always said that Cuba and Brazil are  authentic and legitimate sources of Jazz.

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Someone say Brazil?

We don't need no stinkin' Juilliard School of dance

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=id1scBYfJQ4

If this does not put a smile on your face, git outta music!!!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1VSX1FHhXTg

Frogman, I took your comments as you intended them, however, being the guardian of Jazz is no laughing matter. :)

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Sergio Mendes:

Is it Jazz?  Some of his stuff is Jazz.   Jelly Roll Morton said, Jazz was a style, or way, of playing music. It’s Jazz from Brazilian roots IMO.

My Mom used to tell us the story of how, way back in the day, Cab Calloway got into trouble for Jazzing up the National Anthem. Caused a National ’ruckus’. You can imagine, especially when considering the then current ’social conditions’. :)

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Jive Samba:

@acman3 :

I love stuff like that.   I thought what a loss, referring to Cannonball's passing,  then I realized he has been dead for 43 years!!!

I have such a hard time keeping Jazz and Jazz players in the correct chronological order.  It all seems like yesterday to me.   As if they didn't exist, until I 'discovered' their recordings.

Great Bossa Nova stuff.   Jazz was fun then.

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James Carter:

Another 'Young Lion'  that never quite lived up to the hype.

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ANIT:

I wonder how many people in that crowd have ever heard Dizzy and Bird do that tune on  LP or CD.

Not bad, but wouldn't hurt if they all wore suits and had a real piano.

However I am all in favor of guys playing the Masterpieces from the pass.  Keeps the good stuff alive and fresh.

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I did like him on this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k3C9L6VzOdY

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James Carter:

Being great is not easy.   The greats just make it look easy.

A person could earn a living just placing bets on the contents  of a serious Jazz Fan's collection.  We all know, at a minimum, what Miles, Trane, Mingus etc......... albums / CDs, that any Aficionado, worthy of the name, would have on his self.

Can the same be said about James Carter?

Remember:

The Frogman's first law -- If you are unknown or under known, there is usually a good reason why.

Bill Parcells - - "You are, what your record says you are".

Keeping these in mind will answer all questions.

Very good player, but not in the same rank of those you listed.

Cheers

*****The majority of jazz aficionados like I said up thread are "stuck" in the old days listening to the greats of the 1940 -1970 era.*****

I plead guilty. I am also STUCK in the past when I listen to The Blues and Classical Music. Still stuck in the Mississippi delta with Muddy Waters and B.B. King et al. And for some reason I just can’t get past Mozart, Beethoven, Bach and folks like that. Hell, I still listen, by choice, to Motown and doo-wop. I wonder why that is?

****Name ONE trumpet player? ONE piano player? ONE bass player? ONE drummer?*****

I think you are confusing, mastering the ability to play an instrument, with making a contribution to the art form called Jazz. Current day players are better ’schooled’ in playing music and mastering their instrument.

*****Likewise Stanley Clarke could hold his own with Charles Mingus on bass to name a modern bass representative.*****

No one thinks ’Bass player’ when Mingus’ name is mentioned.. He was so much more than that. Ellington: Piano player?

*****Jeremy Pelt and Roy Hargrove come very close to Lee Morgan, Freddie Hubbard, Kenny Dorham and Donald Byrd on trumpet*****

Surely you jest!! No one, and I mean No one, can touch Wynton Marsalis playing the Trumpet. Greatest Jazz trumpet players? The list would have to be very long for him to be on it. But, he is so much more to Jazz than a trumpet player.

It’s not about how well you can play the instrument, it’s about what contribution did you make to the art form.

Miles once said, there is nothing a person can do on trumpet that Louis Armstrong has not done already. This means, making a significant contribution gets harder as time goes on.

No one is stuck.  We are there by choice.

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Gorgeous day here in Central Texas. Stopped by Barnes & Noble to check out the latest music magazines. When I looked at the latest issue of Downbeat, I thought they had received the issue destined for Eastern Europe instead of the USA. Not a recognizable name in sight. I guess it is all passing me by. Oh well, I was here, and young, during the best and most creative part.

Jammed to this:     Love the trumpet playing.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ojAUGPZ39Dk

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Stuck in the 50's

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MJ_bkuAZD8A

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When I posted  this brother Clarke a year or so ago, everyone started cries of outrage, boo!!!, hiss!!!!   etc....... even worst than with the Bey Sisters.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=en6kmiX0SDc

Now he is beloved by all.   Go figure.

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Bunch of old geezers:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rBxrS4OrhV0

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WARNING TO ALL AFICIONADOS!!!!!

The Frogman has the memory of an Elephant. Be careful what you say.

He never forgets.

He will even go so far as to use a person’s own words against them.

OUTRAGE!!!!

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He also has the annoying habit of being right. I hate that!