Jazz for aficionados
I've read somewhere that Zoot Simms once said, when he was asked about Stan Getz, that 'he is a great bunch of guys'.... ...and Stan was not fan of Chet Baker.... together on concert tour in Sweden, that was cut short due to their mutual animosity... https://youtu.be/OqQWVrfjatA |
Have several Albums of Roland Hanna, think that this album is the best known to wide audience (he plays as sideman) Jim Hall 'Concierto' https://youtu.be/iD6k2E61ABY |
Interesting article about Lee Morgan https://www.theparisreview.org/blog/2017/04/03/search-for-the-new-land/ |
By the time this album was recorded,in 1980. they all have passed their prime, but none the less, its a still a nice record to hear and have. Dizzy, Terry, Hubbard on 'The trumpet summit meets Oscar Peterson big four' https://youtu.be/RvPM2zsSglA more,an album that was made from previously unrealesed cuts from that same gig 'Alternate blues' https://youtu.be/dfbpMTf-SuQ |
Frogman, you said, quote '
He had A LOT of technique and speed; probably more than Miles. But he never sounded like he could play softly and controlled like Miles could.' I am well aware that you are professional, but to my untrained ears Dizzy always sounded like he has full and utmost control of his instrument, his tone has perfect and fine edge,so would you consider a thought that he could play, but perhaps, for whatever reason, choosed not to play many softly or lyrical stuff in a way like Miles played, or even better, Chet? By the way, how is this for 'softly and controlled playing? ''Olinga' from 'Portrait of Jenny' album, from 1970. https://youtu.be/BsYafl7o98M the above mentioned album, that I really like https://youtu.be/PHd1vCIOCUU or, what about this classic tune, at least for the part untill they decide to speed things up? 'Dark eyes', from 'For Musicians only' https://youtu.be/pPbT-96qHZc But,I could never called him uncapable of playing anything he wish, if he wishes to. |
Frogman, for sure, when I wish to listen some gentle or subtle trumpet playing Dizzy is not my first (or second) pick and I agree with you on that matter. All the players you have mentioned had more to say on that subject. . But it seems to me that article you posted proves my thoughts about it... ...'his amazingly sophisticated harmonic insight...his stunning ability to improvise brilliantly at any tempo...instead the limelight was thrown on the one aspect of his playing in which he placed little importance....he always regarded tone as comparatively minor consideration....he had no choice, but to give priority to sound he made' It certainly would be interesting to hear more recordings where he 'had no choice' but to give 'priority to the sound', but it seems that he did not cared for that aspect of his playing,for whatever reason. That was my thought and I simply said that I believe that, by judging on his displayed technique, he could achived that aspect as well, if he only wanted. |
Went to cinema last night, saw 'Miles ahead'. Not recommended. But, it seems that 'we' are going in circles here, with all that 'new' vs 'old' jazz, with or without 'soul'. Just wanted to say, that, looking at the not so good movie, one must try to imagine Mile's chaotic life as described in that moment. Its really obvious that he, regardless of his opinion that music should always evolve, could not create music from previous 'life' or time. To be honest I doubt that anybody could, if he did not lived in a bubble. It would be interesting to check are there any memorable 'jazz jazz' compositions that were made after, lets say '69.? So, maybe we should just conclude that some of our preferences are about certain music in certain time frame and thats all. Naming music from one point of time exclusively 'jazz' is certainly missperception, but one could argue that that was perhaps 'the best' period, but not the only one. Its like that with many other things,there is always a 'glory' period, for some, but life (and music) just goes on anyway |
Regarding 'soul'....Orpheus, it seems that you are following that old moto ’who ever is not with me, is against me’. Personally, my perspective about music in general or about other people’s choices is little bit wider than my own musical taste. With little bit of tolerance toward others, we could avoid such ’discussions’. |
Ghosthouse, listen to a guy playing trumpet on that John Mayall’s album. It is Blue Mitchell, he ’comes’ from this (jazz) side of forum... But if you like that kind music (blues, with some great playing too), here is another album that you may find interesting. I believe that I have posted it before (Mayall too), but never mind. Its a good music and in my defence I can say that lots of jazz greats are playing on it too... Its legendary T Bone Walker, album is ’Very Rare’, from 1973....participatng artists include: Al Cohn, Dizzy,Jon Faddis, David Fathead Newman,Herbie Mann, Gerry Mulliagan, Zoot Simms...proudeced by Leiber and Stoller.... https://youtu.be/ym__EtVfSQQ https://youtu.be/IUbwHrCuil8 https://youtu.be/cC-mMVku5Yw https://youtu.be/Mc4abSHRhEc https://youtu.be/QRzawYcbmJo There is album of ’Jazz at the philharmonic from 1966, where he also plays, got that one too, its even better...here is the link... https://youtu.be/pFqK6PBq-hA Of course, there are lot more great albums, both of Mayall and Walker, but these ones are sort of ’conected’ with jazz or jazz musicians, to say at least.... could not resist, here is another one...'just' the blues...T bone and Shaky Jake Harris... https://youtu.be/NuGW-Ug94Jo |
Sfoth, would you mind to further elaborate? What would be a musical elitist, in your opinion? Do you consider all music to be of 'equal worth'? Do you believe that perhaps music can not be called as 'good' or 'bad' ? I do not argue that anybody can prefer what ever he likes, but liking or relativization that follows it can not be set as principle of 'worth'. Would you agree? |
Stofth, if you follow this thread, I guess you could see by now that here, despite all 'arguing' there is no such attitude towards other people (who are perhaps listening to some 'different', meaning other than jazz, kind of music. Except that we cant agree among self, which music from wich time can be called 'jazz', but that is internal, ongoing joke. Anyway, more or less, everything you said was right, just let me add one more thing about hypocrisy. We all have prejudices, that are based on different aspects of our ego. Can you honestly claim that you do not have them? (no matter are the 'based' on music or some other thing) |
Orpheus, the content of your previous post remind me of this album. Ray Brooks, long time drummer with Horace Silver. His ’Free Slave’ album from 1972., one of few that he made as a leader... https://youtu.be/2HnUNNiTn9k ...an earlier one ’The Beat’ from 1963. https://youtu.be/_NnMVeCBleg https://youtu.be/wK8WGDuJV-k |
...in the meantime..... Stan Getz and John Coltrane, together, live 1960..... https://youtu.be/beCGdmrP8Xc |
Acman, liked the last Tequilla 'shot' too. Make me think of another one...its not jazz, but its fine... https://youtu.be/Uedw8ErZ3ak Frogman, well written post. Still, one sentence made me want to add the thought.... It is when you mentioned the ' coziness of consonance and easily followed and understood musical lines and harmonies' and the way the Coltrane played before the death. Another sax player came to my mind, Ike Quebec and his last album, recorded in the almost same sad sitauation as Coltrane's. Of course, they played 'different' style of music, but Quebec chose to record 'Soul Samba', which to uninformed listener may sound exactly the way you describe time that was absent when Coltrane played. And, yet, I have a same feeling about it, like you have with Coltrane's last work. Almost reluctance to listen it, aldo is one of my favorite albums, becuse of such profound emotions that are 'packed' in and effect they have on me. What I wanted to say is that sometimes the form can be 'simple' like drinking cup of tea, but that still can be a zen experience. Sometimes I like to think (perhaps I am wrong) that many records and music transcends its original form, because of emotion, artistry or just inspiration of that moment and it allows us to feel the hidden depths of 'beauty and soul' It is very seductive feeling and I am very aware of it, looking at it from 'bigger picture' of what else music may represent, but also I think it is the basic root behind of all your and Orpheus 'discussion' |
We have mentioned H.R. couple of times, but its nothing wrong to do it one more time, maybe somebody will search for his music after reading that and I am very glad that now here are more people writing about jazz music they like Here is another guy, that nobody has mentioned before. Clifford Scott, sax player, recorded only few jazz albums This one is from 1963. where he played alto and tenor. He was backed by Les McCann on piano, Joe Pass on guitar, Herbie Lewis on bass and Paul Humphrey on drums. https://youtu.be/Fnhxt8IJEAQ |
Orpheus, just wanted to add that is almost impossible to have all the 'known' and the 'unknown' artists and albums in one collection, so, please, just continue to post whatever comes to your mind. Believe me, there are gaps (certainly in mine) knowledge and I am always very glad to hear something 'new', no matter, or even better, if its from some 'well known' player. By the way, liked both posts of Sonny Criss,will have to listen more of him. Thanks. |
Tablejockey, as you are mentionong the guitar players more than other insrumentalists I will use the opportunity and ask you to listen the excellent last post of Sonny Criss that Orpheus posted. There you will hear Ray Crawford on guitar, we have mentioned him earlier, hope nobody will object as I will post couple of links, in random order,where he played. It is all great music First, with Ahmed Jamal, from 1955, drumless trio https://youtu.be/ZmvwCTMO1Lg?list=PLF1lyo_kLguCy4_Q5RoyyRduydlNUs-JL With Curtys Amy 'Katanga' from 1963. https://youtu.be/wLxxeBRqqKw Than, with Jimmy Smith 'Bluesmith' album from 1972. https://youtu.be/cSgqS7yy5JM His only album as leader, recorded 1961.'Smooth Groove' with great line up, but the label broke before it was released https://youtu.be/fka0tp0WGPs |
Few cheerful songs from a lady singer, Dodo Greene, on album 'My hour of need' with I.Quebec and Grant Green... https://youtu.be/V5cu3C0kKo0 https://youtu.be/8_X35MKGoAo https://youtu.be/Y4w50sdBjgw |
Funny, just bought one of Previn's albums couple of days ago. It's 4 to Go, from 1963. with Ellis, Brown and Manne.... https://youtu.be/egEL6Fchmx4 https://youtu.be/DMlIVQCYldU https://youtu.be/iyYgzno3DeY |
Pryso, 'I've found a new baby' is my new hit of the week. Really liked it, it has some nostalgic tone, no matter that it feels ver much like a dance song. Is there any place where people still can dance on such music? Here is one album that you may like it, much newer (from 1981), but with all old tunes. Joe Jackson 'Jumpin Jive' https://youtu.be/q_scNPUGcDs?list=PL2HjKk62-cN1CqweG5vKQEfSTv3ulkLc5 |
...in the meantime... (it feels like i've said this before)..... Stanley Turrrentine with 3 sounds 'Blue Hour' https://youtu.be/3yxgog5lwkc?list=PL950640CD65762662 |
Ghosthouse,check this album with Zawinul.... 'Soulmtes' from 1963.with B.Webster https://youtu.be/iiSX0fsE-Pg |
One song from italian church....I believe from Genova, Don Galo was from that town..... https://youtu.be/ePP9AHrncjQ |
I've been to Nyc, but if I had to choose some cliche to desribe it by some art work, the influence of Holywood simply I cant avoid. So, in my imaginary world, these are associations of it....now https://youtu.be/_ayns3csL7c and much, much before... https://youtu.be/Ibk3S9Ecd0U |
On more light note, album of a bass player. Sam Jones 'The soul society', from 1960. great line up...N.Addereley,M itchell, Heath, Timmons https://youtu.be/9QQQPcRi6wk Very short after that session, Sam Jones plays on album 'The sound of wide open spaces' the debut album by saxophonist/flautis James Clay made together with David Fathead Newman and they play one song featured on both albums, 'Some kinda mean' which starts here around 19th min. Here is that album as well https://youtu.be/LE7RWpsfbMk |
This trumpet player recorded three albums with Mingus: A modern jazz symposium, East coasting and Tijuana moods 'Their association came to an abrupt end after a violent argument, which caused the trumpeter to break his horn into pieces and leave the music business.' When “Tijuana Moods” was finally issued in 1962, a humbled Mingus wrote;' Not only does Clarence Shaw have a beautiful tone and beautiful ideas, but he is creative and original and plays like no other trumpet man…[He] probably would have become as famous as any other so-called jazz players if this record had been issued six years earlier when it was recorded.' Gene Shaw quintet 'Breakthrough'from 1962. his first album (of three) he made as a leader https://youtu.be/hDycQoNNVU8?list=PLyHn3f7-9IUJSqqqy2v3JtIQU5ZrVxmvF more about him:http://www.jazzhistoryonline.com/Gene_Shaw_in_Chicago.html |
Orpheus, read that short biography about Shaw, he recorded his music in Chicago and even had a club there. Maybe you even have visited it? I have his first two albums, they can be found on Amazon.... When I saw title ’Bohemia after dark’ thought that will hear this version... Kenny Clarke,with Adderley brothers, D.Byrd,H. Silver, Chambers and Richardson... https://youtu.be/As4r4C0ZdMc |
Orpheus, no need to thank me, its a pleasure Maybe you will like this one too (Schubert might) Its not jazz, but still... https://youtu.be/Vx6aKAMYDHk |
Would like to add two more different versions, both on albums from the same guitar player. Kenny Burrell, Caravan, from 'Blue Lights' https://youtu.be/iRXdh_SFh6Q and Caravan from 'Elington is forever'.... https://youtu.be/VBj0tvV64V0 |
Hello Paul, good to hear from you, hope all is well. I have Fresh sound edition, double cd that features both those albums and also 'Down Home' album, with Sam Jones & Co. https://youtu.be/E7Xlgi33Pfc Again, great line up. https://www.allmusic.com/album/down-home-mw0000177176 |
Just a tought about drummer who recorded some music as leader... Dave Bailey 'One foot in the gutter' from 1960. https://youtu.be/clODhUiGBnU 'Two feet from the gutter' from 1961. https://youtu.be/qNkQRjjvcBU 'Bash' from 1961. released also under Dorham and Flanagan names https://youtu.be/RmigWbsUQ0o |
I am quite sure that we have mentioned these records somewhere down the line...just another old record from a drummer....but I like it Roy Haynes 'We Three' (the other two are P.Chambers and Phineas Newborn) https://youtu.be/87YROPcgL5Q This one has also been mentioned, much newer record, another drummer. Like the trumpet player, perhaps somebody could recommend some of his work as well? Jack DeJohnette 'New Directions' ....on trumpet is the late Lester Bowie... https://youtu.be/YVjX1EhNbLw |
...'A great day in Harlem' photo... http://www.udiscovermusic.com/stories/amazing-photograph-jazz-history?utm_source=ka&utm_medium=f... |
I guess with this lockdown, everybody could have more time on the hand, so here is the link with free access to 50 concerts to stream from Montreux jazz festivals. Note, not that much jazz, but still it might be interesting... https://www.montreuxjazzfestival.com/en/50-concerts-to-stream/?fbclid=IwAR02UX7trsJoItlsAcHZ4ko_NZhe3iBsdrIKwd3WRibdCstzOHubdT62RJ4 |
Mercy, Mercy, Mercy.... https://youtu.be/y7FFLYXEOqA I am going out every day, avoiding people, ha, but I feel much better after a training session outdoors. We are fortunate that nature is all around us, so lots of places to go and be alone, more or less. But, hope that all this will stop sooner than later.... |
Pryso, that is an exhibition that I would like very much to see... This next album came on my mind when you have mentioned west coast jazz and swinging.... Released under name of Don Bagley, the bass player, with Phil Woods,Eddie De Costa, Sal Salvador and Charlie Persip... 'Jazz on the rocks' from 1958. https://youtu.be/US9kB467GDY https://youtu.be/cMZ6w0DBOLs |
I stumble on this piece of gold, just now. There was one short clip on ytube, but never saw this one. It is a live show with Kenny Burrell, Grant Green and Barney Kessell, all together!? and it lasts more than half an hour https://youtu.be/_4jMQNJFPO4 Orpheus, thanks for suggestion, that clip was just a little bit 'soft' for my taste. About that other album, I honestly dont know, I am away from home this summer, will check it when I come back. Dave, if this is not too little, too late, this device could be a life saver. https://youtu.be/-vd3I5HSz4s |
Orpheus,that one is classic. Here is the link for Fresh Sound Label, they have large inventory of albums otherwise out of print or impossible to find,all new, you can buy the 'Jazz on the Rocks' there and many more. Take a look, of course, hope that other will too. You can order directly. http://www.freshsoundrecords.com/ |
Hope Orpheus will not be absent for long, as somebody has to 'hold the line' with '
groovy drum CHIN-ka-CHIN’s and beautiful, bluesy melodies inside cozy and familiar structures.'... So, this time, I will take that part.... First, album that Jafant just posted and that I have ordered yesterday. Wes Montgomery and Wynton Kelly, 'Smokin' at Seatlle', recorded some six months after the famous gig at the Half Note...here is the link..... https://youtu.be/aOuIZf5RXc4 Frogman mentioned Spaulding so I decided to add this album as well, where he plays with another of his favourite players, S.Turrentine, together with P.Adams, G.Green,and McCoy Tyner, but still inside the mode of above cited quote... https://youtu.be/OXgEPBYGk-I |
Frogman, I understand your point of view very well and becaue of it I guess I should thank you for your patience and your effort for trying to share your perspective toward music in layman's terms. For my part, I will be glad if I helped you to hear some new (old) music or artist. If I were in your shoes, I would be tempted to feel frustrated sometimes, becuase the 'class' shows very slow progress, if any (smile) |
Frogman, aldo I have few of Mobley’s albums as a leader and probably more as a sideman I must admit that he does not belong in category of my favourite sax players. Perhaps is my taste too prosaic and maybe I just cant place him in neither of simple categories that I like, first of big, lush tenors (exmp. Hawk, Quebec or Gonsalves,etc) or neither in lyrical context of some West Coast players. I admit that when I carefully listen to his lines I often get surprised, because he ’has something to say’ and his music possess a ’continuos drive’, but it is his tone that is not ’attractive’ or particular enough to me, to make me want hear him more often. On the album you recommended he has nice moments, Dorham even more... Than again, I must admit that my taste, already described as prosaic is somewhat particular too.... So, for example, I am not a big fan of Coltrane, except for part of his early work and I must admit that again, the tone is ’problem’ for me there too... Here is one link,of Coltrane, that I like....very simple, but beautiful music... Wilbur Harden plays along him....like him too... ...from album ’Stardust’ from 1958. https://youtu.be/TeFeLaEsHBs |
Well, things now certainly look more like the 'plain talk' that we have here usually. This album comes to my mind, Jimmy Smith's 'Plain Talk', with Blue Mitchell, J.McLean and Ike Quebec... Recorded in 1960.not released until 1968. Perhaps not the type of music you would expect just by looking the names on the cover... https://youtu.be/lnGBpc3mq1s |
