O-10:
Mungo Jerry: good driving music.
Dr. John: one of those special artist that never makes a bad record. All of his stuff is very good. I think because he is an authenic artist. He lives in the enviroment that produces the music.
Check out his CD "dis dat or da udder". Not a weak track in sight.
BTW, anyone into Shaped Note singing? I love it.
Cheers |
O-10:
****Charlie Ventura is apparently new to all of us, and I like his "musical voice". Our chances are better for finding something else by him when we go on a combined search on you tube.*****
Following your orders, I did search him out and listened to a lot of his stuff. It was all Ok. Just didn't grab my attention. Besides all the stuff seemed to be taken directly from an LP. Lots of clicks and pops. The recordings did show the age in which they were recorded. Sounded muffled. Like the juke box playing in a 1940's film-noir, grade B movie. Reminded me of my old Dual 1229Q. Where is my Burwen? :)
I don't understand why everyone is going Gaga over Ventura, and no one had anything good to say about Andy Bey and the Sisters. A huge step up, in my, less advanced opinion.
Cheers |
More from Episode Three:
The first Jazz scat. Armstrong says his music score fell off the stand so he just improvised.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ksmGt2U-xTE
Sad story of Bix Beiderbecke. Shows that segregation cut both ways. Had to jam with Louis behind locked doors.
Artie Shaw had some interesting comments about the near absurdity(my word), of trying to get sounds from his head out of a piece of wood with holes drilled in it. "Rarely happened, but when it did, it was better than sex!"
Might have been what the guys in Nica's book meant when they said "I wish I could play what's in my head" Could the instrument be the main obstacle in music?
Dramatic shots of the Mississippi river flood in 1927. Down there it's called '27 highwater'. My mom loaded sandbags on the levee.
Shows how much the instruments themselves have changed over the years. The trumpets seemed much longer in length. Some HUGE saxophones. A man could crawl in the bell.
Cheers |
O-10:
The CDs and Artist I sometimes have a urge to hear are:
Oscar Peterson -- GIRL TALK
esp like his version of 'on a clear day' contained on this CD. I paid a lot to get this one on CD. Awesome cover photo.
Mingus -- OH YEAH
Contains 'hog calling blues'. I have to hear that at least weekly.
Wynton Marsalis -- MARSALIS & CLAPTON PLAY THE BLUES
exquisite arrangments and playing. Esp on Clarinet and Trumpet. Wynton is not Armstrong, but hell, who is? But, he comes closer than anyone ever has.
Anything by Morgan and Silver.
I never have the urge to hear Miles or Trane. Interesting.
Cheers |
Good call on Al Grey. I have him as group member on a lot of stuff.
It's that time of year once again. There is something just not right with this performance. Not sure what.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oZe1j1ybGEg&index=1&list=PL_men8Mkj32-xrxr6eh-OiMV9auTBEClI
Cheers |
Acman3:
I never added the markup thing before. I just copied and pasted, and once I sent the youtube, the address appeared as a clickable link. appeared as " www.youtube "
I don't know why it stopped. I think it has to do with the link itself. When I send the 'Gaithers' links it works just fine.
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Cannonball: The CD is "Cannonball Adderley Sextet, Lugano 1963".
Cheers |
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Two pieces of good advice:
1. Never believe anything written / spoken by white people, about black people, and their history and culture.
2. Never believe anything written / spoken by black people, about black people, and their history and culture.
And no, I did not make a typo in #2.
When its come to race, everyone has an agenda. The central theme being what I call "feel good history". Every other group has an "Old Country", so black folks want one also.
Every CD I own by Weston has some so-called African theme, if nothing but the clothes he wears on the cover. But I never hear any African in the music. He is just trying to create history out of thin air.
Even Ellington went around the Third world trying to find the source of certain music, and found it all to be much ado about nothing. He cut his tour short and came home.
Africans take their cue from, and are influenced, by AMERICAN / WESTERN musicians, not the other way around. If Blues, Jazz etc... was from Africa, it would still be there.
The African contribution to music centers around the Human Voice. In that area, they are unmatched! They have a sound that no one else can duplicate.
Some of this African stuff is sort of like 'Indian" music we used to hear in the western cowboy movies. When the soundtrack played 'Indian' music we knew they were coming.
Did Real Indians really play that music in their villages? Or were we just conditioned to associate it with Indians. Same goes for oriental and Latino locations. The music told us the location. Was it legit, or Hollywood? Same with "African" music. Esp the Drum nonsense.
The best percussion I have ever heard comes from Cuba and other latin American countries.
Just one Frenchman's Opinion.
Cheers |
Fascinating story. The clip gives the impression she was in Denmark when the Germans invaded and was arrested and put in a concentration camp. Others accounts say she was arrested by the Danes and kept in a Danish Prison. The facts: She was arrested in 1941 while on tour in Denmark. Denmark had been under German contrrol since around May of 1940. Along with France and all the Low Countries. That means, if she was touring in Europe, in 1941, she was touring in German occupied Europe. When Hitler Declared war on the US on the 11th of Dec 1941, she immediately became an enemy alien. Was later exchanged in 1942 as part of a prisoner exchange. There is that 'agenda' thingy again. Louis Armstrong always called her the world's second best Trumpet player! :) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r6e7ye-fiJACheers |
O-10: I once told you computers don't go on the fritz these days. Well, computers might not, but internet providers certainly do. Just got back online. Previn: Very nice clips. I love that type of playing. Like a slightly less bombastic version of Oscar. I have several Classical pieces with him as conductor or accompanist. At least one with his wife, the great German violinist, Anne-Sophie Mutter. I also have the DVD of "Christmas at Carnegie Hall" with Battle, von Sade and Wynton. He conducts the Orchestra. Towards the end of the concert, they gather around his piano for some solo singing of Jazzy Christmas tunes. The look of Previn's face said it all. This was the part he had been waiting for all night. The good stuff!! I think Jazz might still be his first love. I only have one Jazz CD with him as leader. "After Hours" with Joe Pass and Ray Brown. It is excellent. If you like Previn, you gotta have this one! The man is a prime example of what is meant by the phrase, 'accomplished musician'. Any genre he can not only play, but excel at playing. "After Hours" was his first Jazz recording in 27 years. You couldn't tell. Here is a clip. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s8KSBxVoF2MThere are several more from this CD on youtube. |
**** The "influence lineage" is something that has been missing here IMO*****
Well, first of all, we need to define 'influence'. I think of it, as it's used in astrophysics.. A thing exist and has certain properties. Then another thing, causes the first thing to change.
Example: The orbit of an asteroid is changed because it travels too close to a Star. The presence of the Star, and it's gravity, 'influenced', or changed, the orbit of the asteroid.
So in Jazz, we have Jazz, and then something or someone comes along and changes the way that pre-existing Jazz is played. That's 'influence'.
There are few people that have 'influenced' Jazz. Armstrong, Parker, are the obvious and quick answers. I am sure you aficionados can name many others.
BTW, if a player does change direction and no one else follows, he has not 'influenced' anything.
Cheers |
****Ham Hock Blues**** I almost clicked on that one myself. I really like it. Nice and easy swing. At first I wondered about the name "Ham Hock" But, since Milt Hinton(Mississippi) is on board, I guess it's OK. :)
****Calloway's Zoot Suit*** Looks like my 'sunday church suit'. Mine is dark blue. Loved the bowtie. A person really has to have a lot of self confidence to wear something like that. I remember my Mother telling me that Calloway got into trouble for "Jazzing up' "The Star Spangled Banner" During the war I think. Now, it's dissed, on a daily basis.
****Rabhi Abou- Khalil****
Very good. Not so sure I could hear the Jazz part, but it was an enjoyable listen. I think I will check out this so-called Arabic musical influences. I didn't know there was such a thing.
Cheers |
My LAST word on Jazz and influences and Africa.
If we go to certain areas of this country which include, Eastern TN, Western NC, West VA, and Northern GA & AL, we will see and hear people playing their local music. You may ask, where did this music come from? I would answer by putting us all on a plane, and flying to Ireland and Scotland. There, we will see, and hear where it came from. Notes be damned. Nothing to figure out. Just look and listen.
Africa and Jazz: I want you to tell me, where would we fly to in Africa, to see and hear / see the orgins, linkage or seeds of Jazz.
Since notes are physics, no one music type or genre can 'claim' them. I want to go to Africa and hear Jelly Roll and Pops. Where do we go?
Some of you seem to think slaves came ovcer here on work visas. green cards. With carry-on baggage. To you I say, take a look at a diagram of a slave ship. The drum thing in the Us is all myth. It was used to 'explain' why Africans play drums and Blacks in the US don't. Answer, the drum is a poor man's instrument. We had access to trumpets and other western instruments.
In the Book, The Diary of Mary Chesnut, she recounts the scene the day they fired on Fort Sumter in Charleston, SC. She said slaves were running all over the place, with GUNS. Ready to fight them Yankees. If they were allowed guns, surely drums were not seen as a threat. Read the story of Nat Turner. He didn't need no stinking drums! :)
And, where did these drums come from? And what is the distance a drum can be heard? The whole things seems silly to me. Reading more US / World history and alot less music theory, will answer all questions.
Cheers |
O-10:
Today's Listen:
Ella Fitzgerald -- SINGS THE DUKE ELLINGTON SONGBOOK
2 CD SET. CD1 is her singing with small group backing. CD2 is her with the Ellington Band. The small group was more to my liking, but both are flawless.
This woman has COMPLETE control of her voice. Every time she goes down into the lower register I brace for a Billie Holiday type moment. No cracking here, she gets down there with authority. No coming down to it, or up to it, she just nails it!
It's amazing how in the middle of a well known Ellington tune she will just change it, as if she is saying, "well Duke, you could have done this" and just change the pace and rhythm of the song. It's amazing.
On the number "Rockin' in Rhythm" with the Ellington band, she does not sing, she plays Sax. :) Amazing!
Everyone, who is anyone, is on board. Including:
Ben Webster, Paul Gonsalves, Snuff Smith, Johnny Hodges, Cat Anderson, Clark terry, Dizzy, Duke, Strayhorn, Oscar Peterson, Barney kessel, Ray brown and Sam Woodyard.
You gotta have it. Next up, is "Ella and Basie". Got them both today.
The entire CD is on youtube. Check it out
Cheers |
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Visited my Doctor today. The Phlebotomist is a great Jazz fan. She was playing Nancy Wilson and Cannonball on her BOSE table CD Player. She is also from ST Louis.
I don't think she knew Miles, but she knows EVERYTHING about him, and his family. Where he went to high school his Mama and his Daddy etc... Calls him her 'homeboy'. :)
BTW, she says KOB is so, the best Jazz record ever!! I said yes ma'am. I don't argue with anyone holding a Hypodermic needle.
When I mentioned the Voodoo aunt, she went quiet, and just mumbled,"I don't know nothing 'bout that". :) She did know about Miles and Cicely Tyson. Every detail!
Cheers |
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"KOB" vs "Somethin' Else":
Following the OP's instructions, I listened intently. Used my CDs thru my system.
Somethin' Else: I was riveted throughout the entire CD. Staying focused was easy. I heard every note. I can see why someone would consider this to be maybe the best Jazz album. The playing was just awesome. Loved the way the solos went from Miles to Cannoball, back to miles then to Jones. They all did their individual thing, but you always knew they were playing the same tune. I also liked the Tune selection. The whole performance was flawless.
KOB: Great players, and great playing. I did not like the Tune selection as much as "Somethin' Else". I had to TRY and stay focused on the music. Mind would wander. The solos just were not up to the standard set in "Somethin' Else". Overall, it did not impress me nearly as much as "Somethin' Else". I don't know why anyone would consider this the best Jazz album ever. I realize, it is the best selling album. But there are many on my shelf that I consider more enjoyable to listen to. Like efforts from Silver, Morgan, Cannonball and even "Swiss Movement". I consider "Blues and the Abstract Truth" to be much better than KOB.
I suspect 'Audiophile' hype is at work here.
Just one Frenchman's Opinion.
Cheers |
O-10:
Allow me.
****Really, what is the point of making a case for why one really good apple is better than a really good pear****
how about:
(1)someone declares that the apple is the best fruit.
(2) someone declares that the pear is the best fruit.
(3) someone asks, which is the best fruit?
Of course, in this case, the statement is not even on point, because we were asked to compare two music albums. Both firmly in the Jazz genre. The comparison is valid.
I think KOB, is the end all, be all, for that certain class of "Audiophiles" with $200,000 systems and six LPs / CDs. They like it primarily because they have not heard much else.
Just one Frenchman's Opinion.
Cheers |
"Really, what is the point of making a case for why one really good apple is better than a really good pear?"
"Then the attempts at comparing KOB to SE began; a good and potentially interesting exercise."
Each of the above statements were made by either Rok or The Frogman. Who made which statement? Get it right and you win all my Kenny G cassettes, and a NM DVD of LULU!! No peeping!!
Hint: It seems inconceivable that both could be made by the same person.
Cheers |
The Frogman said:
"As has already been pointed out this all began (this time round) with the Kaplan article. I expressed my disagreement with some of the points he made (one in particular) and you went on to bash the guy and call him a farce without a single specific substantive point of disagreement and only blanket condemnation"
I say:
I introduced the Kaplan article. Said it was interesting. Suggested we all read it. Then, after a little Wiki, found out he was in the Les Aspin Sec Defense. Do a little research on the incident known as "Blackhawk Down". That's Les in action. Never mentioned anything negative about Kaplan in relation to KOB or any other music. Suggested he might be another Tony Cordesman. My comments were off topic, but not about KOB or music.
Damn!! I think we have a problem right here is "Aficionado" City!!
Cheers |
Today's Listen: This has been a good Jazz week for me. All my recent purchases have been killer, and I have 'discovered' two new artist. Gregory Porter and Cecile Salvant. Both seem to be a breath of fresh air in the classic and traditional Jazz genre. Julia Fischer -- BRUCH & DVORAK This clip is from the Proms, but the CD has her playing the same Music with the same Orchestra, but not in front of a live audience. I love it! Why? We'll let The Frogman tell us. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8bCksc4TgUMCount Basie -- ATOMIC SWING The clip is not the CD. Could not find one. But it is Basie!! The CD is very good, but does not swing as hard as this clip. The sound quality is EXCELLENT. You don't often find big band music recorded this well. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TYLbrZAko7ECheers |
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O-10:
I guess I spoke tooo soon. After getting excited over Salvant and Porter coming into the Jazz family, seems as if we just lost a giant.
The latest Issue of Down-Beat reviews the latest CD from Dr John. Seems as if he has "replaced his New Orleans-Based band, with a Sarah Morrow led group dubbed The Nite Trippers".
Two questions, why would an Icon of Nawlins music replace a New Orleans-based band, and Who, and WTF, is Sarah Morrow?
The clips on Amazon do not bode well. Better get his old stuff while you can. This is an outrage. And then he had the nerve to name the CD "The Spirit of Satch".
The entire magazine, which I don't read very often, will just brings tears to the eyes of any Jazz fan. Real Jazz, that is. My, how the art has fallen on hard times. Lots of quanity. Little to no quality.
If you just read the track list you would be very impressed. Great tunes, and Guests, from the Blind Boys of Alabama to Arturo Sandoval to Shemekia Copeland. A different guest on each track. But, the arrangments tell the story. Can you imagine Dr John backed by Lawrence Welk??
Sad day in Nawlins!!
Who or what is at work here? Miles' aunt or Marie Laveau???
Cheers |
The Learsfool: (Our resident Brass guru).
In the latest issue of GRAMOPHONE, in the obituaries, is listed the Principal Trumpet player of The LSO. He was Principal for 25 years. Killed in an auto crash.
Before the crash he had excperienced health issues and had asked to be assigned to the Third Trumpet chair. No action had been taken before his death.
My question is, if his request had been granted, would all the trumpet players just move up one chair? Would they look for another principal?
Paganini: Some time ago we discussed "playing all the notes in a piece by Paganini". I think you and The Frogman said it could be a matter or taking all the repeats, or not. Well the magazine returns to Paganini, and this time what they mean is clear.
Apparently many condutors and/or players just cut out certain portions of the music. In a performance by Michael Rabin, 151 bars are cut or deleted.. The article implies there is no rhyme or reason. So if you want to hear every note of Paganini do your research.
Speaking of brass: Just received a copy of Dvorak's "New World". Wiener/Karajan. Brass galore!! Outstanding recording!
How great, if any, is the ability between the Principal players and the others members of that section, in an Orchestra. Esp the Brass players.
Cheers |
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1116 Today's Listen: Billie Holiday -- THE QUINTESSENTIAL BILLIE HOLIDAY VOL.9 The last in the 'Quintessential' series of Nine-CDs, issued by Columbia. Excellet Booklet and notes. I guess most would consider the notes 'provocative', i.e., he tells the truth. I might get the other vols for the booklet ands notes. Lester Young only appears on one tune. :( He is more prominent in the other vols. The sound quality is excellent by mere mortal standards. Can't speak for other species. First tune is "ST Louis Blues". Seems as if, Everyone has to pay their respects to the OP!! The singing? It's a Billie Holiday performance. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NCyyTISP9eIThis is the song, but not the CD. Cheers |
Today's Listen: Art Tatum -- THE COMPLETE CAPITOL RECORDINGS VOL. ONE http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-6TBaZfVqLoThis guy is really a virtuoso!! But I think the Emperor in "Amadeus" was right about him, he plays tooo many notes. On the last four tunes, he is, mercifully, joined by Guitar and Bass. Much better. Art Tatum -- THE ART TAUM SOLO MASTERPIECES VOL. ONE And the flourishes just keep a coming! Couldn't get through to the end of this one. Just a little too much solo piano. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1SnJSHfMAxQI think he played more notes on this CD than Basie did in his entire life! I like him much better with a group. But he is a seminal player, and way ahead of his time. And you cannot help but admire his ability, it's just that he plays so many runs, or embellishments, that it's hard to keep the song in your head. After the first few bars, he could be playing anything. And an entire CD of this gets old. But, I bet he would be wonderful to see live. Cheers |
Today's Listen: Cecile McLorin Salvant -- WOMAN CHILD Could all the hype be justified??? I think it could be!! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nHDuWv_44g0 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tX4javSA26M "If anyone can extend the lineage of the Big Three, Billie Holiday, Sarah Vaughan and Ella Fitzgerald, it is this 23 year old virtuoso" -- Stephen holden, NY Times. I think he may haver nailed it. With all respect to Miss Dee Dee, of course. Highly Recommended!! |
Today's Listen: Heritage Blues Orchestra -- AND STILL I RISE Could and should have been a homerun! They will have to settle for a triple. But I love that fact they are out there playing this music. They play all the right stuff, Muddy, Ledbetter, Son House and other traditional blues. And the voices are great. I think the arrangements are just a little toooo slick. A little more grit would have put them over the top. But, what they play is a billion times more 'blues' than most of the stuff going around these days. I think this production has it roots in Europe(France). That could be the problem. "Clarksdale Moan" never gave me the feeling they had ever actually BEEN to, or know anything about, Clarksdale. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1GeoZQMXKKEhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6xk2bMTjLQUCheers |
Today's Disappointment:
Billie Holiday -- THE QUINTESSENTIAL BILLIE HOLIDAY VOL 5
A great talent saddled with third and fourth rate material. She manages to save some of it. That's how great she really was.
No sign of any Jazz. A Bunch of Second rate, "B" Movie themes, and tin pan alley castoffs.
Just made me angry to listen to it.
Good sound quality, by the usual Holiday CD standards, and her talent comes through, in spite of everything.
Cheers :( |
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And no, there is no such thing, as too much of a great thing! Ella had those horn players under a lot of pressure. I had to laugh out loud! The Trombome player tried to rise up, but she quickly slapped him back in his place. I think the Sax player knew better. Played his little solo and sat down. When she is on stage with a band, she is in command! I love it/her!! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9ePqKd4yF5ACheers |
Very interesting question. I think the instrument players will win out in most cases. Ella being a possible exception. Of the two tunes you posted, I preferred the instrumental versions in both cases. I didn't think Lorez brought the required amount of passion to her performances. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Softly,_as_in_a_Morning_Sunrise http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oqPzi99xOCM I also think Billie did a much better job on Love Affair. She captured the feeling. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oxSldEPISwoThe Wes clip was good, but I found it a little too long. They could have stopped long before they did. Didn't keep my attention. The MJQ clip was, MJQ!! Have they ever been less than great?? Interesting comparison. Thanks. Cheers |
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Today's Listen: Charles Mingus -- THE GREAT CONCERT OF CHARLES MINGUS 2CD set. Very long tunes. 7.55 - 14.29 - 21.47 - 22.45 - 27.04 - 27.46. These are the lengths of some / most of the tunes. He often plays too long. Eric Dolphy really earned his money on this set. Tunes include: Fables of Faubus( I wonder who remembers Faubus), Sophisticated Lady, and Parkeriana(dedicated to Bird). https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kilr601kki0If he were an actor, you would say he had tremendous range. Fats Waller to Bird!! Interesting music, but I could not help but think of what Armstrong said: "If you can't dance to it, it ain't Jazz". And anything Pops said, was like getting it from the Mount Sinai of Jazz. To be fair, some of these artist do seem to resist having their music called Jazz. Maybe we should listen to them. Mingus makes some very Juvenile and silly comments on the opening of 'Meditations On Integration.' He sure liked to talk the Race Card, esp overseas. This was recorded in France. And curiously, coming from a man who was too 'scared' to tour the South with Armstrong. A Jazz musician afraid to tour the birthplace of Jazz?? I still think he was a hell of a musician. Just not the man I thought he was. Cheers |
Lord, Lord, My Burden is great.
If Concentration and Internment are the same thing, then we can say, Auschwitz-Birkenau, Buchenwald, Sobibor, and all the rest, were Internment Camps. And that don't even sound right!! Sounds as silly and stupid as what Mingus said.
Mingus went to France, and said, in the introduction to a tune of his, that the US Government was building concentration camps to house black folks. This was in 1964. LBJ was President. He gave no indication this was said in jest.
The French, having operated at least one camp for Jews in Paris, must have been a little nervous, at the least.
A person can say somethinmg and change your entire perception of that person. A former hero of mine once said, speaking of some "plot" by the US Government, that there were B-52 bombers orbiting the planet Jupiter. I didn't know whether to laugh or cry. I have a different set of heroes now. None of them well known or famous. Just regular courageous folks.
BTW, the estimates are that about 20 million died in the European "Internment Camps". Anyone know the figures for the Japanese/German/Italian camps in this country?
Cheers |
*****What danger? And why "danger*****
The danger is that people will forget the people that created this wonderful music. That people will make the noise makers the standard by which Jazz is played and judged.
This is esp true since the most critical Jazz was performed either before TV or when TV was in it's infancy. You have to search it out. So you have to know who to search for. I.E. if you wanna hear Tunisia, you look for Dizzy, not some Russian.
That represents a DANGER in my universe. This music has been under attack since it was created. I said this, 2000 posts ago. :)
And stop using all those big words like 'Dogmatism' and 'Fascism'. I have to get a dictionary to decipher your posts.
Cheers |
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