O-10:
Revisited the "100 best from the 1950's" box set today. Listened to CD5 and CD6. On CD5, thru the miracle of science, Paul Gonsalves' solo has been restored to it's rightful place on "Diminuendo and Crescendo in Blue"
The last six tracks are just an embarrassment of riches.
CD6 includes the tunes that started this thread, "Moanin'" and "Along Came Betty". Great stuff, but I think Johnny Griffin's "Cherokee" and Bill Evans' "Peace Piece" may have taken top honors.
Can't get enough of this box set. Wonderful sound quality. I have found a few more box sets by the same folks,'Chrome Dreams'. Will try to determine if they are as good.
Cheers |
Interesting article in May 2014 JAZZ TIMES magazine. "High Notes". Deals with drugs in Jazz. Seems as if drugs are no where near as prevalent today as they were back in the day.
Some suggest that the lack of drugs is reflected in, and has affected today's Music. :(
Damned it you do, damned if you don't.
Cheers |
I went thru an ECM phase also. Didn't quite do it for me, even though I found Jarrett intriguing. Esp the Koln concert. The ECM albums had great sound quality and playing, just did not speak to me.
Julie London was a great singer and actress. She is currently appearing on the Western channel with Cooper, in 'Man of the West'.
Beautiful voice and a stone Fox.
My latest 'discovery': http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1jDDtUFUgbM
Will receive the CDs in a few days. I think I will like his style. Where have these people been hiding?
Cheers |
Mitch4t:
Nice clip of Bey with Silver. His voice for some reason reminded me of this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QPclJvyF_70
I have this Cd, I need to play it more.
Cheers |
O-10:
I have added the following to my cart:
25 Best Jazz Tunes of 1960 2CD
25 Best Jazz Tunes of 1961 2CD
Birth of Soul Jazz 2CD
Evolution: The Road To Giant Steps 4CD
Playing It Cool: Classic West Coast Jazz 2CD
Beat Generation Jazz 2CD
They are all from the same label that produced the 100 best of the 1950's.
Not much info concerning sound quality. I will try the 1960 & 1961, plus the Coltrane set first. Will report after I have listened to them.
The Coltrane set is him as leader and with other groups as band member. Seems to be a good selection.
Most of this music I have, it's like paying someone to make complilations of the best. And as you said, they do sound better than the original album.
I am sort of nervous about the BEAT Jazz thingy. I remember trying to read "Naked Lunch". Sort of put me off the BEAT generation.
Cheers |
The Frogman / Learsfool:
Minnesota is now back in business. Part of the agreement allows for an increase in personnel from 77 to 84.
What does this mean? What sort of players could they now need, that they didn't have before?
Minimum base salary is now $102,284!!
Wow!! nice gig.
Cheers |
Another view.
Schubert is hyperbole personified.
102k is a lot of money. Ask the average working person in this country.
Doctors are immeasurably more important to a society than bassoon players. A ludicrous comparison.
Many / most people, work all their lives perfecting or improving their craft. Not just musicians.
Minnesota is among the best Orchestras, only if that list is made up of many, many ensembles, OR, Europe is no longer with us.
I agree that housing in the Twin Cities, like most urban areas in the country, is expensive.
Cheers |
Learsfool:
http://www.greatbigcanvas.com/category/abstract-art/?gclid=CM6Dpuj4q74CFU8Q7AodqmcACw&utm_expid=771419-1.-OChkEM_T6G01IS00kMx2g.0&utm_referrer=http%3A%2F%2Fsearch.aol.com%2Faol%2Fsearch%3Fq%3Dabstract%2520art%26s_it%3Dkeyword_rollover%26ie%3DUTF-8%26VR%3D3430
Are you saying I have to understand this in order to like Oscar Peterson, Ellington etc...?
Cheers |
If you ever lived in Germany, you didn't pay attention.
and
your post is nonsense.
Cheers |
If you did / do, not realize that the Germans have not changed one Iota since the Nazi era, you did not pay attention.
Lets get back to music. Jazz anyone?
Cheers |
Acman3:
Well, I don't understand why Metheny didn't have a computer play his part. Should have been easy to do, based on his playing.
I hope this is nipped in the bud. What a sterile passionless thing.
Another thing that crossed my mind. These guys do not respect theirs elders or the pioneers in the music. Check out his dress. Does not have anything to do with his playing, but it sure does look disrespectful. It degrades the music. IMHO.
Can you imagine the NYP in jeans, tank tops and ball caps on sideways.
Thanks for the clip.
Cheers |
****Society, especially here in the US, values the arts less and less******
This is true, but, the U.S. Art world is not blameless for this being the case.
Cheers |
Today's Listen:
Roland Kirk -- DOMINO
w/herbie hancock,andrew hill,wynton kelly,roy hanes
This guy is one heck of a Saxophone player. As wonderful as his antics are, he is much more than that.
25 Tracks. A lot of multi takes. Including something called a 'breakdown take'. But all are wonderful. A little chatter after each take. I love that. The last tune, "Time Races with Emit", is 22 seconds in length. hahah You gotta love this guy.
Nice shots of notes on the muscial scores. I think I would enjoy watching these guys rehearse as much as seeing them perform. They say some funny stuff.
Cheers |
*****There is no god or gods. All religions are BS.*****
A lot of people, sometimes referred to as 'armed mobs', have given their lives so you can believe as you please.
But, this is a music thread, and a Jazz one at that, and as we all know, the utilmate source of Jazz is religious music.
Therefore: keep it to yourself.
And if the countries that have renounced God are any indication, i.e. Nazi germany, Soviet Russia, Communist China, Castro's Cuba and North Korea, You should be on your knees thanking God there are God fearing people in this country.
Cheers |
Acman3:
I have that CD. Now I will have to listen to it. Nice clip.
The Blind Boys of Alabama really shine on "The Gospel At Colonus" I have that CD and the DVD. Check it out.
Thanks for sharing.
Cheers |
*****She's maybe a little more grimy, ***** I assume you meant to say 'Gritty'. I would hate to think of Nina as grimy. :)
I love the woman. Nina Simone is a unique talent. I would recommend the 4 CD set "Four Women" if you want to get into her music.
I don't consider London a Jazz singer. She is awesome at what she does, but I would not consider it Jazz.
I am not familiar with Johnny Dyani, but I will search him out. Thanks for the tip.
Cheers |
****Rok, since you like vocals of the religious persuasion, here's one especially for you.******
Wunderbar!!! Maravilloso!!! Merveilleux!!! Wonderful!!!
Do you know how hard it is to find music like this, sung like this. Reminds me of the Fisk University folks.
And this appears to be a good source of other good music. I checked out the brass group also. Great stuff!!
I like the venue also. Intimate.
Our OP does not speak often, but when he does, wow!!
Thanks for the clip and site. I will visit it often.
And I suspect, I am not the only person here that likes "Vocals of the Religious Persuasion. :)
Cheers |
HitforHit:
I agree with you about the drugs vs culture thing. I am currently reading a book about how classical music reflected the times and society in which it was written. I think Boxing changed for similar reasons.
I will check out the labels you listed. Old school Jazz by young guys with modern recording methods. Can't get any better than that.
Avant Garde can be very good. Dolphy and Kirk are too examples. But some others just seem to want to be weird just for the sake of being weird.
Thanks for the tip on Blades. I will investigate.
Welcome to the thread.
Cheers |
Hitiforhit: sorry, got your name wrong. |
The Frogman:
Great tune. Also, thanks for the WBGO tip. I looked it up online. Another source to hear great music. Red is playing with Paul Chambers and Art Taylor.
Just so happens I was listening to a CD today, with Chambers as leader and Taylor on drums. "Bass on Top". He does a lot of work with the Bow.
Bass as the lead soloist takes some getting used to. Seems like it weakens the rhythm section too much.
Burrell and Hank Jones rounded out the Quartet.
WBGO!! Culture in Newark. Who'd a thunk it.
Cheers |
Ones I have:
African American Spirituals
The Concert Tradition
"Wade in the Water Vol 1"
Chanticleer
"How Sweet The Sound"
"Great American Spirituals"
Battle / Hendricks / Quivar
(slighty operatic) but you know Battle can do no wrong. :)
All three have Motherless Child. Very different versions.
Chanticleer
"Where the Sun Will Never go Down"
Awesome version of "Am I A Soldier of the Cross"
Downhome Southern 'Radio' Gospel:
Dixie Hummingbirds "LIVE"
MFSL Recording
Try the group, Sweet Honey In The Rock, and for the best of both worlds, Mahalia Jackson at Newport, and Jackson with Ellington.
Cheers |
The Frogman:
Heated exchanges? You sure? :)
A couple of excerpts from the book.
"We would do well to avoid the notion that art is linear, and that,somehow it just keeps getting better as we go along. Certainly, art, and for us, music, gets different as it goes along."
"There is a reason why we turn to the paintings of Vermeer, the sculptures of Michelangelo,and the music of Bach, Mozart, Beethoven and Brahms, to name just a few, in search of truth and edification, and it has nothing to do with nostalgia for the past. Great art is timeless, and it speaks to us, directly and relevantly, across time."
He pointed out, while talking about art not being linear, "......Stravinsky and Schoenberg better than what came before? Obviously not."
He also said, the more we know, the better we hear. :) Sound familiar? I think you said that also.
He is speaking of Classical Western Music, or Composed Music as he calls it. But all he said applies equally to all genres.
We go back to Ellington, Mingus and Morgan,etc... for the same reason we go back to Bach, Beethoven, etc......
Great book. And I'm just on page nine. :)
Cheers |
Received and listened to today:
Anne Akiko Meyers -- THE FOUR SEASONS
I needed another Seasons like I need a hole in the head. BUT, she is a FOX, and lives in Austin. What's a Gentleman to do? Also her, AIR, The Bach Album, CD is absolutely awesome. And this one is great also. With the English Chamber Orch.
Nat King Cole Trio -- HIT THAT JIVE JACK
Good music ruined by tape hiss.
Cheers |
****Rok, it would take a volume of books to answer the questions you ask in regard to music and the generations.***
Not for much longer. :) Today I learned about PLAINCHANT, which is the basis for all Western Composed music.
Did you know, that, Plainchant represents the single greatest body of music created by Western Culture? :)
It is often referred to as 'Gregorian Chant'. I actually have a CD of Gregorian Chant. The last time I listened to it, it put me to sleep.
But, according to this book that was sort of the purpose of it. To get you in a state of mind, conducive to meditation.
Seems as if we can all be grateful to the Christian Church for holding the fort during the dark ages.
BBC magazine ran a piece about a year ago. 'The most influential people in classical music.' The top three were Pythagoras, Jesus Christ, Gregory the Great.
I am now begining to see why.
Cheers |
Today's Listen:
Andy Bey -- ANDY BEY AND THE BEY SISTERS
Good tune selection. Great Harmony. Laid back slow tempos. I would have liked more like 'sister sadie', which was my favorite.
Beethoven -- DIABELLI VARIATIONS
Andreas Staier on fortepiano
This CD has the distinction of having more tracks than any other single CD I have ever seen. 46!!
ain't got it git it.
Cheers |
you know you like it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2FSXomH4tCo
cheers
|
The Frogman:
The book:
"How to listen to Great Music"
"A Guide to its History, Culture, and Heart"
by Robert Greenberg
The title bothers me. Conceited bastard. He assumes we all agree on which music is GREAT.
Got it from Amazon.
The reviews were great, so I thought I would give it a try.
So far I like it.
Cheers |
O-10:
Thanks for the Monk comment. We can always depend on you to sort out all things Jazz.
****Too many people on the planet. "Stick to music Rok".****
I had to laugh at this one myself. But rest assured, when the herd is culled, we Jazz Aficionados will still be standing!! :)
Cheers |
The Frogman:
To my puny mind, those 'Modal' guys were just playing the 'wrong' notes on purpose. Of course I had no idea what modal Jazz was, or that it even existed.
After reading your post, I ended up deep in google land. Had to hear Maiden Voyage. Found a lot of good sites for music for beginners. This was a link on one of those sites. Meant to prove a point and be funny. It is both.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5pidokakU4I
Your post was excellent, as always. As I read my book, I will also study scales, keyes, and chords. I suspect that a little more of this and I will never listen to music quite the same way.
Thanks for the insight.
Cheers |
Quincy at his best. Great idea. Wonderful music and performances. I wonder what happened to the money?
My guess? Ultimately, and sadly, it ended up in the pockets of French Hookers.
Cheers |
Sorry:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M9BNoNFKCBI
Cheers |
O-10:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AheC9ul5w1A
Also check out the Soweto Gospel Choir. Too much 'performing' in their stuff, but ok to listen to.
Cheers |
One of my favorites. Love the period instruments / instrumentation. Nice history lesson. Seems as if every country is proud of their history, except us.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q27aV-IiQWo
Cheers |
The Article:
I should have stopped reading after this silly paragraph.
*****To be able to enjoy instrumental music, you must be able to appreciate abstract art, and that requires a certain amount of effort. Just mindlessly drinking wine, for instance, would not make you a wine connoisseur. Mindlessly looking at colors (which we all do every day) would not make you a color expert either. Great art demands much more from the audience than the popular art does.******
One of the things that makes Great Art, GREAT, is the fact, that a large percentage of humanity, considers it great. Great Art is accessible Art. Art is never great, just because, the artist thinks it should be. And a few 'elites' from NYC does not do the trick either. No one has to 'push' or make arguments in favor of the art of the Masters. It speaks for itself.
A person should not have to 'figure out' what the artist is saying or protraying. There are a few exceptions, the one that comes to mind, is Picasso's masterpiece, "Guernica". It's a horrible looking painting, because it represents something horrible. A person without the historical knowledge, might not 'get it'.
The Japanese stuff was silly. None of his 'facts' are supported by academic research. And they do not withstand logical scrutiny.
The Frogman's post was excellent, but this article did not demand or deserve the time and effort of such a detailed rebuke.
Cheers |
My book tells me, if I have understood it correctly, that all western music has a common orgin.
Bach, Beethoven, Mozart, Mingus, Ellington, Monk, Elvis, The Beatles, Little Richard etc... all water from the same well??
Cheers |
*****That is exactly what is going on today. On what do you base the notion that it is not? *****
What do you think, a present day photo, similiar to the "Great Day In Harlem" photo, would look like today.
Cheers |
Indicators:
Could Nica write her book today?
Could we have JATP today?
Who, currently travels the globe for the State Dept, as Jazz / goodwill Ambassador?
The state of Blue Note.
The state of DownBeat.
Proof of anything? Sure it is.
Go out to hollywood to take a group photo of all the great western / cowboy stars. You may find a couple. They are all gone. Because Westerns are all gone.
Cheers |
The Frogman:
I am still 'discovering' Jazz music by people that died in the 70's. So it is possible I am not up to speed on the current crop of Jazz players.
Could you recommend a couple of albums for me to try?
Cheers |
0-10:
I certainly do not wish to limit the discussion. I am ready and willing to broaden my horizons. I will also tone down my negativity concerning modern and world Jazz. Can't learn anything with a closed mind. Thanks for broaching this subject. I, for one, do tend to go off on tangents.
Cheers |
The Frogman:
English Baroque Soloists / Gardiner -- WATER-FIREWORKS
Received this yesterday. It's on 'Authentic' Instruments.
I noticed that the horn sound was much smoother and rounder than the horns on the Proms/French piece. They sounded almost liked modern valved horns.
Is it possible that the French horn players, played the piece exactly as they intended. Could it be that that's the way the horns would have sounded when Handel wrote the piece. The BBC presenter did say the sound would be 'different' to modern ears.
Why isn't all, or at least most, Classical music played on the instruments in use when the music was first written and performed?
Cheers |
**** As I said before your points go to the issue of popularity; what does that prove?*****
To most artist, 'popularity' is EVERTHING! It's priceless. It means success. Financial security. It also 'proves' the artist is connecting with the intended audience.
Popularity is the whole point of being an Artist.
People just have to accept the fact, that the unwashed masses, decide the fate and fortune, of all Artists. :)
Cheers |
Learsfool:
****Rok, I must agree 100% with Frogman - your comments in your latest post are way off base. Laughable, even. Are you trying to troll us? Seriously?!*****
I assume you are talking about the 'popularity' remarks. I don't get the humor. Do you disagree?
Name me one artist that is considered great, but not popular with his audience, intended or otherwise.
I have no idea what a 'Troll' is. Must be an 'Audiophile'
thingy.
Cheers |
The Frogman:
Donny McCaslin:
Both clips were good. The C-Jam Blues clip had a lot of energy and enthusiasm. The tune they chose to play didn't hurt matters at all. He did play longer than he should have. Sometimes, players continue to solo, after the solo is over. Youthful exuberance??
Casting for Gravity:
This guy does play Jazz. Would have been better without the electronic stuff. But it was Jazz. It would be silly to compare these young guys with the all time greats, I just expect them to play Jazz. This young man does. They will find their groove, and get even better with time and experience. I just hope he has the patience to stick to it. And, ditch the electronics.
Cheers |
Miles defending Dixieland?? That's incredible! Nothing wrong with Dixieland, it just sounds incredulous.
I was just wondering if this was Miles, Pre or Post, dressing like a buffoon(wynton Marsalis) and looking like Sinbad the Sailor(our OP). :) We won't get into the 'Bitches Brew' Era.
Did Monk indicate how a players was suppose to eat and play rent for those 15-20 years? Spoken like a man with a secure income. (from that european countess, or whatever she was)
Looking back probably caused Miles too much pain and regret.
The last quote from Monk is true, I guess. That's why I have CDs of the stuff I like.
Cheers |
Mahler wrote Classical Symphonic music.
People didn't like his music
Mahler and his music are not POPULAR
Mahler is not great
Mahler dies
New people begin to play and listen to his music
New people like his music
New Orchestras play and record his music
Now Mahler's music is very POPULAR
Mahler is now recognized as a great composer.
I don't see a problem
Cheers |
The Frogman:
Your links didn't work. Please re-check them. I did youtube her, and I don't get this 'faint of heart' business. I find her stuff very accessible. Maybe because it has cohesion.
It could be that watching a performance creates empathy for the players that LP/CD do not. It's great seeing young people trying to create SERIOUS music.
Cheers |
*****That is a very strange and illogical question.*****
When I read that, it hit me like a bolt out of the blue!!
THE GOOD LORD IS TESTING ME!!!! Just like Job.
But the real shocker for me, is that not one of our 'pros', commented on the performance of Water Music and Fireworks by the French Orchestra. ESP, the conductor!! What do you think of this guy?
Last Chance.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q27aV-IiQWo
Cheers |
Under the heading of: You learn something everyday, I always thought Water Music and Fireworks were written during the same time period, and for the same event. Turns out that Fireworks was written 30 years later. Don't I feel silly.
Cheers |
The Frogman:
****Well, if you insist; and, please understand that my lack of enthusiasm for this performance and Niquet is the very reason that I had not commented.*****
Negative reviews can be more instructive / valuable, than the positive ones. This is the stuff I most want to hear.
Forgot to say this earlier.
Cheers |
*****First of all, for a really great performance of this beautiful music on original instruments try Trevor Pinnock with The English Concert; and for my favorite with modern instruments but still using period performance practice try the Marriner/St Martin In The Fields.******
I have the Marriner / SMIF CD. I am almost embarrassed to admit I have six CDs of this music. The first one I purchased years ago was "The Academy of Ancient Music / Hogwood" It's on authentic instruments also.
****Niquet is the type of conductor that drives me nuts. There is, again, a sense that it is about what looks good. His technique is showy and dramatic with large motions that serve no musical purpose.*****
My thoughts exactly. I remember thinking, this guy is demonstrating that maybe Conductors are not needed past rehearsals. But the man is French, so looking good is important. Did you check out the shoes?
I understand that Andre Rieu is an excellent musician, that found he could make a lot more money as a showman. His stuff is not serious. I just love 'Amazing Grace' on bagpipes.
The band Barenboim conducted was the Israeli-Arab group he established. He did all nine symphonies during that Proms. There is a DVD out. Thinking of getting it. Like I need more sets of LvB.
I thought the horns were the highlight of the performance. They sounded so 'real / natural', on my computer setup. I love that sound. Not disagreeing with you, just to my amateur ears. And, the visuals were great. I think that makes a tremendous impact on a person's perception of the performance. The sound and video were excellent by youtube standards.
Thanks for your review. Very insightful.
Cheers |
