Ddraudt, actually David, I think for about two hours you can hear the HF cables at pretty much what they will ultimately sound like, but they go downhill thereafter. Fortunately the Enhanced will be largely back in about one or two days. I noted no dramatic improvements after about two weeks.
Rick Schultz does say that he is going to burn in his cables more lengthily than he has, so what we both say may be less true or not true now. |
Ddraudt, I agree with your logic about the breakin of the HF cables. Perhaps there are two breakin relationships with one being the breakin of the cables and the other is their influence on the components. I can make no judgment of which would take longer. I do know that after they have stabilized, a slight movement of them sets them back for perhaps an hour. I also know that initially they sound better for about two hours and then deteriorate from which they come back even better and that this period is longer with the better series, such as the Ultimates and Ultimate References.
Calloway, there is always the question of affordability, but in reality these are very inventive cables. It is quite clear in my discussions with Rick Schultz that each of the four series of these cables all represent further improvements and performance, but I must say that my greatest shock came when I first hear the original CT-1s. As you say, one can work up in these cables and be satisfied with each level. |
Tsushima1, I've been using High Fidelity cables for eleven months now. The conductor in them has more resistance than silver or copper. There is some question as to whether the reduction of noise with these cables means that the work by the amp is reduced. At any rate I have noticed no change in where I play my music. I do think I do play music louder than before given the realism with these cables. |
Siddh, Rick argues that his cables remove the noise that in getting through with other wires and being amplified thus sounding louder. I do know that on a sound pressure reading, I am listening to Rick's cables louder than I listen with other cables. I also know that my wife doesn't complain that I am playing my music too loud. This is especially the case with regard to the first cut on Cantate Domino. I play it very loud and enjoy it enormously. |
Morningstaraudio, I think my Ultimates and Ultimate Reference speaker cables are now broken in, but I do remember several big jumps in performance as you describe. I do think each successive cable in his multiple series takes longer to reach their best and that each is a jump over those preceding it. Price is the only off-putting aspect of the newer series. |
Ddraudt, I totally agree. |
Tonereef, yes is the simple answer to your question. In my experience the Es took longer to reach their best than the originals, and the Ultimates took considerably longer than the Es. Certainly my early versions of the URs took a month to break in.
I would also say that better and more extended bass is one of the characteristics of the Ultimates once they have broken in.
The slippery slope will continue with the ac filter using UR waveguides. It may take a month to break in. |
Charles1dad, good but tough question. I would really have to do a long time A/B comparison, taking one out and allowing its effects to drop out, listen, and then do the same for the other. Also, I'm still experiencing improvement with the new HF WGPC. I guess that the HF WGPC is a better buy for the money, especially as I have the Troy ground wire to the mains, but I'd hate to be without either. |
Leicachamp, I think there is much learning from experience in the HF cables. As I understand it the CT-1Es came about in doing phono cables using CT-1 standards. My guess is that the initial cables aren't selling much and will be discontinued. I also think the uptick of prices is the cost of rare earth magnets and more magnets.
Presently, I'm using a $3500 amp with cables worth many times that, but the sound is better than had I invested only in amps of perhaps $20,000 or more. And then there is the HF ac conditioner. I'm beginning to think that cables, isolation, and conditioning ac is more important than amps, preamps, and even speakers. |
Leicachamp, there is another reason for discontinuing the original CT-1s, namely that they aren't selling.
On your other posting, I did use CT-1Es with another company's speaker wire for a while. They too were improved by having the Enhance cables upstream. |
Leicachamp, I use a full loom of Ultimate ics and early Ultimate Reference speaker wires. When I went from Ultimate to Ultimate Reference speaker wires, I certainly heard an improvement, but it took a long time to reach its best. I'm trying to recall when I got a full loom of Enhanced with my Exemplar Portals being replace for the High Fidelity. I think I was very impressed. I must have been as I put the old cables back into a box. |
Jwm, I did the same thing for compact discs. I bought three on Oxford st. while in the UK two years before there were any discs or players in the US. |
Audiolabyrinth, I care little about whether you have a system or not. On your question about whether there are balanced HF cables, there are none. I doubt there ever will be such. I can just imagine what the XLR would look like to have three sets of magnets properly set around the conductors. Since these cables break the paradigm of what to expect of top cables, such as the conductors not being silver or copper, perhaps balanced would be no improvement. |
Charles1dad, I have BMC gear which has the benefit of "current injection." But this improvement only works with balanced cabling. I had been using Exemplar LLC silver Portals with exceptional sounds. The HF CT-1 Es in single ended and without current injection were better. Needless to say the Ultimates and now the Ultimate References are clearly better than better.
As you say I am merely enjoying the HF cables and not waiting for balanced versions which might be even better but certainly are not imminent. |
Nic10pin, no cables should ever touch the floor and the best isolator is glazed ceramic. The guy that used to own Rightway Audio used to argue also that only one isolator per cable should be used. This is pretty easy if you have a high single isolator.
All of my HF speaker cable WGs have been use atop my 18kv 15 inch high isolators with a Rightway audio isolator taped to it and a Harmonix cable supporter on top of it. Overall, they are about 22 inches high.
Email Rick and ask him. |
Audiolabyrinth, I don't think they are in business. Try ceramic audio isolators on Google. There is a company that has a brown on top and white on the bottom isolator that is still available. I don't really know that the brown glaze is best but it was used by utility companies forever. Of course, they also used glass one, which in my experience, are no good. |
Yes, but as I said I am pretty sure they are out of business. Also, I can no longer find the brown top ones. |
Nic10pin, yes, I talked with him about all of this. He thinks rubber may be sufficient. I agree that it may be sufficient, but I would never be satisfied with it. |
Calvinj, fly or drive down and hear my ss system. I have two solid state amps, the BMC M2s and the LSA Statement that I think will impress you, and one is fairly cheap. Ask Rick. |
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Theaudiotweak, I think this is the opposite of my experience as you are using conductive materials, while I'm using non-conductive materials. |
Theaudiotweak, but my experience is that even most dielectrics aren't any good. Static electric charge is probably the culprit. |
Theaudiotweak, at the top of my pile is the Harmonix cable support. True this may not be the best vibration isolator, but the enomous variation in performance between just the 18 kv isolator or no isolator suggest that static is a greater threat.
I did find that putting StillPoints Ultra Minis which have ceramic ball isolation within them did help the sound of platforms of wood filled with shot.
There really is much to explore with isolation of cables in addition to components. |
Audiolabyrinth, yes I once invested in a live end/dead end room. After about two nights of hoping I had not wasted my effort and money, I tore it all out. The Tube traps had the same impact. Then are read about diffusion. From The Handbook of Acoustics I had profession model WPG diffusors built. They lasted about five years.
As I said, now I have eleven little 1/2 inch bowls on my walls and ceiling. I have no absortion at all other than me, a carpet, some furniture and thousands of records and cds. |
Theaudiotweak, Ddraudt, and Geoffkait, perhaps it is my age and long experience with trial and error improvements, but I resent the time I have to commit to dampening, coupling, demagetizing, removing static interferance, etc. Heaven knows I have done a great deal of this. I do value my limited findings, as well as the success of some companies with their efforts, such as StillPoints, Star Sound Tech, Rightway Audio, AudioTop, Essence of Music, Zilplex,TriPoint, cable charging by Synergistic Research and Exemplar, and of course, High Fidelity Cables, among others.
Carry on guys; I will always listen to demonstrations and hopefully know when there is an improvement. |
Theaudiotweak. Tom, I am not being critical; I'm basically expressing my frustration that we don't know enough about this to have engineering predictions of what is best. I'm tired of trial and error. |
I once had ten tube traps, I once had eight Room Lens, I once had four Shatki Holographic room treatments, I once had 22 RPG diffusors, and I once had mylar room mirrors. Now I have Zilplexes which are eleven tiny cups. I've had it! |
Silemus, I can answer question #1.Yes it does change the sound. In fact the manufacturer said that one magnet in the wrong direction among the many on each cable harms the sound.
The sonic change of all the High Fidelity products sounds much the same, namely great speed most evident in the leading edge, great dynamics, and on many recordings, a lighting up of the recording that makes you think you are there. I have heard these characteristics only in their power conditioner. |
Jmcgrogan2, I guess that I have always been a leading edge guy. I love compression drivers for that reason. But these cables from the first CT-1 on have an ease and speed about them that is novel. What is most endearing about them, however, is their allowing the room to light up as though one were at the recording event.
I have no doubt that other components also contribute to this, but I now hear this on perhaps a third of my recordings. In my thinking it is the decay of notes defining the recording event that allows this, so I would say that attack and decay are both there with these cables. |
Charles1dad, I don't think the philosophy implied in your comment that "there is no anything that lacks flaws," is destructive of improvements. I think that my philosophy is that nothing cannot be improved is better and clearly the Enhanced and Ultimate cables improved on the original cables. |
Metralla, since there is no universal agreement about cables, and turmoil in all generitic threads, I think Ddraudt is right, that thread with a single focus are the only beneficial threads. Of course, all that those of us interested in the High Fidelity cables should just ignore the intruders. |
Ddraudt, I must say that yesterday I had really the first instance where something was jaw dropping. I got several HF power cables. We put one in prior to the HF Magnetic Waveguide power filter, listened briefly and went to lunch. On our return Rick and I both looked at each other in disbelief for what we were hearing.
I find this jump greater than any other I have ever had. More to come but not here. |
I learned last night that the HF Ultimate References take a month to reach their best, which is shockingly superior. Too expensive but absolutely imperative if you want realism. |
Ddraudt, I envy your being able to use the HF UR RCA digital cable. I need USB or FW. |
Snook2, I did that once and initially thought the Ultimate were at least as good. Fortunately, I put the URs back and gave them more time. They are clearly better and ought to be given their price. Don't try them if you cannot buy them. |
Jafox, while I agree with you about the price, my strong advice to you is do not ever listen to these cables, including the $1600 for 1.5 m. original CT-1s. |
Ddraudt, I have heard the Crystal Absolute Dreams but not in comparison with the HFC Ultimate Reference cables which are $18,500 for 1.5 m ics, $29,000 for 2m speaker wires, and $10,000 for 1.5m pc. They are very good. I know of nothing else that might rival the HFC Ultimate Reference line and probably never will get the opportunity to hear a comparison.
I find it curious to consider the cost of cables with components and to dismise higher prices for cables. I certainly remember running a $2000 ARC Dual 75 with a $2.95 Radio Shack pc. But recently I heard the new HFC Ultimate Reference Rhodium pc ($13675/1.5 m) on my $4500 LSA Statement Plus amp. I was totally in shock at the improvement in the sound and it rivaled amps that cost $30,000.
I certainly have not heard everything, but the HFC gear just continually amazes me. Good work, Rick. I have no stake in HFC. |
I'm sorry I wrote the above quickly when dinner was needing my attention.
Ddraudt, I have heard the Crystal Absolute Dreams,which are $18,500 for 1.5 m ics, $29,000 for 2m speaker wires, and $10,000 for 1.5m pc. But never heard them in comparison with the HFC Ultimate Reference cables The Absolute Dreams are very good. I know of nothing else that might rival the HFC Ultimate Reference line and probably never will get the opportunity to hear a comparison.
I find it curious to consider the cost of cables with components and to dismise higher prices for cables. I certainly remember running a $2000 ARC Dual 75 with a $2.95 Radio Shack pc. But recently I heard the new HFC Ultimate Reference Rhodium pc ($13675/1.5 m) on my $4500 LSA Statement Plus amp. I was totally in shock at the improvement in the sound and it rivaled amps that cost $30,000.
I certainly have not heard everything, but the HFC gear just continually amazes me. Good work, Rick. I have no stake in HFC. |
Calvinj, are you in Dallas/Fort Worth? |
Calvinj, I guess this as I knew Rick was out and about demonstrating the pcs. I am in College Station. |
Linkster, although the ribbon tweeter on the Arcadias is quite good, I do miss the diamond tweeter on the Tidals.
Leicachamp, I put one on the HFC ac filter first, but the amp also was an improvement. There are two lessor pcs, the Ultimate ($6900) and the Ultimate Reference ($11,900). I haven't heard the Ultimate Reference. |
Calvinj, I have had the good fortune of knowing a few guys who manufactured components in small numbers and who sought the realism in music that I want. I always cringe when someone says their system is "musical." I want the sensation that I am there at the recording. Impossible, many would say, but wrong I would say to them.
I should say several things about the manufacturers of which I speak. One none are college trained; two, most are military trained; and all have had a hard time making their business fly with one no longer making anything. |
Jafox, I am now 75 and been at this for over 50 years. Now I don't wait for anything. Full speed ahead.
Don't listen to the Ikeda 9TT cartridge or the BMC PureDac. |
Audiolabyrinth, no I do not use a full loom. HFC does not make a USB digital cable, nor do I have a set of phono cables. I do have a pair of RCA to XLR adapters that would allow me to have his UR phono cables but frankly I cannoot afford them yet.
Also, I use 13 power cords and really cannot afford to replace all of them even with the Ultimate power cords.
Have you not tried any of these cables? If so, my most sincere advice is to not do so. Not because they are no good, but rather because they are a very slippery slope. I cannot just turn around and go back. |
Calloway, my experience thus far is only with the top-of-the-line Ultimate Reference Rhodium, but after about two hours you think it is really great, but you are only part of the way. Mine are nearly a month old and still getting better. I would suggest that you first put it from the wall to the power filter or distributor strip. Then the amps! Yes you need two. I have four now but really can only afford two. Wow! |
Guys, I entirely agree. I've been climbing toward the peak of audio since the late 1950s and only got out of the foothills about four years ago and think I'm now near the peak. |
Leicachamp, I do know that the hot pins on RCA plugs in the various HFC series differ. I have had some variation in how difficult it is to insert HFC cables on components, but none have been so loose as to not make contact. I guess the question I have is whether the hot pin is loose or whether the ground ring is loose. In the past, I have had RCAs that had ground ring get too loose. I had solid copper RCAs that constantly needed this. |
Calloway, having the whole room light up with these cables, to hear the decay on each note, and to hear background musicians placed where they are and contributing clearly to the music is a place I've not been before.
Leicachamp, I do wonder about the Stage III Kracken ($8400), but have not been able to have one side by side with the HFCs, but I have heard it on my speakers, dac, and amps but not in my room. It does do these things. |
Calvinj, did the system have HFC power cords? I think they are more impressive than the ics and speakerwires. And using them throughout ones system would be more expensive that ics and speaker wires. But wow! |
Leicachamp, I don't believe you have ever said that the cables fall out of their own weight or that the cables are intermittent. I presently have HFC cables where one RCA is very difficult to get fully on and where the other is easy. Similarly I have owned other cables that fit quite loosely.
I know that you don't "think" the warranty covers your scratching the cables, but I doubt if you have ever seen the warranty, so how would you know? |
