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Capacitor log Mundorf Silver in Oil

I wished I could find a log with information on caps. I have found many saying tremendous improvement etc. but not a detailed account of what the changes have been. I have had the same speakers for many years so am very familiar with them. (25+ years) The speakers are a set of Klipsch Lascala's. They have Alnico magnets in the mids and ceramic woofers and tweeters. The front end is Linn LP12 and Linn pre amp and amp. The speaker wire is 12 gauge and new wire.

I LOVE these speakers around 1 year ago they started to sound like garbage. As many have said they are VERY sensitive to the components before them. They are also showing what I think is the effect of worn out caps.

There are many out here on these boards I know of that are using the Klipsch (heritage) with cheaper Japanese electronics because the speakers are cheap! (for what they can do) One thing I would recommend is give these speakers the best quality musical sources you can afford. There is a LOT to get out of these speakers. My other speakers are Linn speakers at around 4k new with Linn tri-wire (I think about 1k for that) and the Klipsch DESTROY them in my mind. If you like "live feel" there is nothing like them. In fact it shocks me how little speakers have improved in 30 years (or 60 years in the Khorns instance)

In fact I question Linn's theory (that they have proved many times) that the source is the most important in the Hi-Fi chain. Linn's theory is top notch source with lessor rest of gear including speakers trumps expensive speakers with lessor source. I think is right if all things are equal but Klipsch heritage are NOT equal! They make a sound and feel that most either LOVE or hate. (I am in the LOVE camp and other speakers are boring to me)

So here goes and I hope this helps guys looking at caps in the future. Keep in mind Klipsch (heritage Khorns Belle's and Lascala's especially) are likely to show the effects of crossover changes more then most.

1 The caps are 30 years old and
2 the speakers being horn driven make changes 10x times more apparent.

Someone once told me find speakers and components you like THEN start to tweak if needed. Don't tweak something you not in love with. Makes sense to me.

So sound
Record is Let it Be (Beatles)
The voices are hard almost sounds like a worn out stylus.
Treble is very hard. I Me Mine has hard sounding guitars. Symbals sound awful. Everything has a digital vs. analog comparison x50! Paul's voice not as bad as John's and George's. Voices will crack.

different lp
Trumpets sound awful. Tambourine terrible. Bass is not great seems shy (compared to normal) but the bad caps draw soooooo much attention to the broken up mid range and hard highs that are not bright if anything it seems the highs are not working up to snuff. I have went many times to speaker to make sure tweeters are even working.

All in all they sound like crap except these Klipsch have such fantastic dynamics that even when not right they are exciting!

Makes me wonder about the people who do not like them if they are hearing worn out caps and cheap electronics? Then I can see why they do not like them! If I did not know better from 25+ years of ownership that would make sense.

For the new crossover I have chosen Mundorf Silver in Oil from what I have read and can afford. I want a warm not overly detailed sound as Klipsch already has lots of detail and does not need to be "livened up" they need lush smooth sounding caps. Hope I have made the right choice?

When the crossover is in I will do a initial impression on same lp's. Right now it goes from really bad (on what may be worn vinyl) to not as bad but NOT great on great vinyl. (I know the quality of the vinyl because tested on other speakers Linn)

The new caps are Mundorf Silver in Oil and new copper foil inductors are coming. I will at the same time be rewiring the speakers to 12 guage from the lamp cord that PWK put in. PWK was a master at getting very good sound often with crap by today's standards components.

The choice of speakers would be a toss up now depending on what I am listening to. Klipsch vastly more dynamic but if the breaking up of the sound becomes to much to effect enjoyment the Linn would be a better choice on that Lp. If I could I would switch a button back and forth between speakers depending on song and how bad the break-up sound was bothering me.

volleyguy
volleyguy OP
789 posts
 
In looking for SET amp info I stumbled across this site.

http://home.earthlink.net/~ivol/audio/other.htm

Still debating SET or EL84?

Of interesting note he thought the EL84 EICO fantastic. (for sure with NOS tubes) But more interesting he had the same speakers owned by Dennis Had of Cary Audio used in 89-'90 at the CES audio show. Showing off 300se mono blocks.

What is more interesting is
"Yet, I have to admit, they were immediately thrust to backup duty after 10 minutes with the vintage Klipsch Cornwalls"!

What I think the owner does not realise is he thinks it is all ALNiCo magnets or horns as did I. What I found out beyond a shadow of a doubt is it was the mosty the foil in oil capacitors. When Sonicaps went in the speakers sounded VERY cheap!

One of the coming tests I am going to do is ALNiCo tweeter vs. ferrite. I have both. I have always understood ALNiCo (known as the singing magnet) coveted by guiter guys the world over for tone, to be better. but I have never heard a direct comparison. The vintage Klipsch ALNiCo certainly go for much more $ used always a good indictator.
volleyguy OP
789 posts
 
Peter Qvortrup (Audio Note) rates amps on a 8 point from -2 to +6. He says a Class 0 Push Pull tube amp is the minimum anyone should have for recreating a live event.

He thinks the slide in quality started around 1965 to use cheaper parts.

He is not a fan of any SS calling them (semi conductor amps) half conductors.

In push pull he is a fan of EL84's which no problem with that statement but I have not heard level 3-6. That much better???

He also says a good test is low volume of sound. Which is interesting. I always said my SS system needed to be loud to sound good at all. Yet the big ass klipsch sound very alive at low volumes.

Audio Note is back to putting very little insulation in the boxes as well. My Linn speakers could not take anymore insulation.

Most of all what's with Denmark? I have not been there in 20 years and did not see all these high-end audio people?

http://www.audionote.co.uk/articles/art_level_system.shtml
quoc
2 posts
 
If you have high sensitivity speakers, my personal preference is SET. I have driven horns with push pull, and there is more synergy with SET. And for horns, the SET to have is a 45 SET. Add that with a 26 tube preamp, and one can end the search right there. A 26 mixed with a 45 has a certain magic. I owned highly tweaked K-horns, Lascala and Cornwall. I like the Cornwall, best of the 3. But then I have heard a stacked Cornwall/Lascala, that sound is even more special (the 2 speakers are driven in parallel by a 26/45 SET. I feel there is a massive positive difference in the sound when the SET amp has AC filament heating.
volleyguy OP
789 posts
 
Thanks Quoc

I will check into that.
volleyguy OP
789 posts
 
I am frustrated and confused.

This is not what I expected to find out.

The most important thing in an inductor is dampening. The vintage inductor hard as a rock with the wax paper dampening. Much smoother especially in the mid range.

I can not understand why only Duelund, Jensen and Jantzen that I can find do proper inductors? I think Jantzen uses a poly in there that rings alarm bells to me!

http://www.jantzen-audio.com/image/Wax%20Coil/About%20Wax%20Coil.pdf

The North Creek is coming out and vintage back in. The really the big test will be is Duelund WPIO better than a vintage inductor???

This will be the second time the fight will be with Duelund vs. vintage and not any new part.

I do hope Duelund wins as I will have wasted $$$.

The frustrating part of this rebuild is the poor qaulity of most of today's parts.

http://www.partsconnexion.com/inductor_solen12.html

That Solen inductor looks like wire wrapped around a toilet paper roll with some cheap ties!

I guess I know why old Klipschorns cost $4k (here in Canada) 30 years ago.

In today's parts you are looking at a Jensen (my best guess) for the woofer inductor to be the same as original. A Duelund Aluminum VSF for the mid range and 2 Duelund Aluminum VSF for the tweeters.

This crossover would cost around $1200 to $1500 to be the same or slightly better. My guess is even the Duelund Aluminum VSF tweeter caps are better. Bob Crites sells the crossovers (with poly caps) for $285 but you need to add about $1k for Duelund Aluminum foil in oil to get back to spec.

A new amplifier scares the crap out of me. It could be loaded with cheap plastic! Do new output trannies have a plastic bobbins?

Anyone ever dealt with Maple Shade? They give a 30 day money back guarantee.

http://www.mapleshaderecords.com/audioproducts/tubegear_hub.php
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