Building high-end 'tables cheap at Home Despot II

Ah Jejune, living up to your name as always, and waiting for the first sign of trouble. I have written repeatedly about different arm-cartridge combos, and their interactions with various electronics. I am just putting a positive spin on a negative development. Don't try to make this worse than it has to be, a stock-in-trade of your own. Try something constructive for a change. And to get the facts straight, I use the epoxy not to glue the plinth or glue the Lenco to the plinth, but simply to fill in gaps in the metal top-plate and kill resonances. Otherwise, there was just speculation as to whether epoxy was a plus or a minus in gluing the layers (elasticity vs rigidity), no "insects" involved, other than a trouble-maker much like you, the first one, who was not pushing epoxy in the design/plinthing of Lencos. Produce the relevant passages and we'll look at it more closely.

To those out there watching whose behaviour mirrors Jejune's, don't try to capitalize on what has been an amicable "break-up" and make it ugly, the experiment is over, we see things different ways, and I'm very grateful to Rick for giving me the opportunity to go as far as we did, as I repeatedly emphasized. Now let's move on. I know I will, and will take the lessons learned to further develop my own Reference System.

Hi Harvey, the solution is inelegant but effective: increase the effective mass of your tonearm. The easiest way is with Blu-tak and quarters on the headshell, then move the counterweight back to compensate to achieve the correct tracking force. If this works, then the Twl tweak is the way to go, with weights attached to the sides of the main bearing to increase mass, more elegant too once the experiment is confirmed. There are weights out there which are meant to increase trhe mas of the cartridge, which increases the tonearm's effective mass. Elegant-looking solution too.

Hi Mario: I did in fact try my RS-A1 very briefly, and with the tapped headshell I simply didn't have an untapped cartridge in my arsenal to compare with the Concerto or the Benz LP, all simply outclassed. So it was down to the SME IV/Concerto (in my system superior) or JMW/Concerto (in Rick's system superior). I will be reaming out the threads, finally. I do LOVE the combo of RS-A1/Denon DL-103"E", which is not only neutral tonally and extremely detailed, but ROCKS like all get-out with incredible PRaT!!! Of course, the Grado's richness and midrange magic will always be the Grado's signature: the MAS/Grado Woody combo will be reserved for my Electro-Voice system.

Have fun all!!

Hi Phill: the 103s need the right tonearms in order not to sound aggressive, and this means mass. There are also all sorts of preamp issues as well. Given a sympathetic set-up they can sound utterly unaggressive and yet still slammin'! I have heard the 110, and it shares in much of the 103's sound, a great bargain in its own right!

Over here I have RE-discovered the Spendor BC-1 speakers, which mesh SO perfectly with my custom-made Pierre Amp (100 watts of SET-like push-pull SS power) that they have become my reference in-house speaker! The Pierre amp struggles with the high-sensitivity Klipsch Cornwall speakers, and yet makes the BC-1s, normally considered difficult to drive, into hugely dynamic slammin' rock-n roll speakers!! AND with amazing delicacy, detail, imaging and so forth, with surprisingly deep bass. Now I see why Malcolm is so enamoured of these: the right amp is required (high voltage?), the other amps I had in the past not enough to make them jump. These are now amazing at PRaT and gestalt, and amazing also in all traditional audiophile areas.

AND, in the Klipsch Cornwalls my rebuilt 12-watt Leak Stereo 20 now sounds like a Krell! Seemingly limitless power, with excellent bass and incredible dynamics and detail! NOW my garage system is set (simply too powerful for in-house....with a Lenco backing them up anyway ;-)), the Leak being too bright with the fab Electro-Voice, I hope to do swappies Cornwalls for the E-Vs, which are just right (the E-Vs being just right in my buddy's system).

I also scored an Ortofon 2M Black, will report on this presently!

Hope you're all having as much fun as I am!

I'd like to wax poetic at this point on the merits of the Klipsch Cornwalls which are HUGE by modern standards (almost cartoons of speakers with those huge 15" woofers and super-wide baffles), and so as low on the WAF scale as it is possible to be. But, if any of you can get these beauties past the spousal alert system, these are so far THE most actually [tonally] neutral and balanced speakers I have ever heard: we're talking studio neutral but with HUGE dynamic reserves, detail and bass and speed. And to boot they SCREAM with low-powered tube amps. AND, to boot, they also sound great with powerful solid state amps, which goes against everything one hears about horn-loaded speakers!

I've run them with the 12-watt Leak Stereo 20, which, at least with a rebuild using the latest state of the art components (and paper-in-oil capacitors at critical areas) is incredibly fast and detailed with beautiful bass, and sounds like a Krell with the Cornwalls. And I've used them with a Perreaux 100-watt pre-power (SP2/1150B) with which they sound excellent, with no hint of aggression, brightness, hardness or "horniness".

The Cornwalls, with their big 15" woofers, reflex-loaded to boot, go DEEP in the bass, which is DEEP, tight and beautiful, and so which goes a LONG way to showing just how potent the Lenco bass is when compared to other machines. The Cornwalls are also VERY revealing, easily showing shortcomings (and improvements) of various electronics, tonearms, cartridges, also in terms of PRaT and gestalt. Bad electronics need not apply. I'm hoping to get my hands on an ARC SP-8 as preamp and a Classic 60 as driver amp to set them up, with of course a Lenco, with likely the SME IV/Clearaudio Concerto as source (the workshop floors are very bouncy, so unipivots are just to trickey/unstable). Now THIS should be a truly stellar vintage system (though the ARC stuff isn't SO vintage, I want the best I can put together from experience: ARC SP-8 + Classic 60 equals SUCH PRaT and gestalt that we have the Kundalini Effect!!), for that extra power, as the Cornwalls can suck it up and dish it out! Those visiting Eastern Ontario are invited to drop by, try some of the local award-winning beer (in Germany no less!!), Beau's beer (with painted-on tractor on glass bottles, and on ceramic bottles with rubber caps, cool). Perhaps you'll see the local beauties riding by on their horses :-).

Also, this weekend I expect to hear the Reinderspeter Lenco via the Perreaux/Cornwall system, so some very important stuff coming up VERY soon. Can't wait to fire it up!!

Have fun all, hope to see some of you for a Beau's beer and Lenco Madness!

Hi Ian, yes, I am in fact waiting For a piece I can play with! For thiose wondering, I've been cut off from the internet out in the country for weeks now, but am moving back to town where I will once again regularly report on experiences and experiments.

Just a quickie from here at the public library: I tried Reinderspeter's top-plate, and those looking to it to "control" the Mighty Lenco exhuberance, SLAM, bass, and excitement, look elsewhere! The bass is deeper, tighter, more detailed (!!!) and even more powerful! The PRaT is there in spades, elsewhere the race against a glass-reinforced original top-plate is close-run. To remind people, the original Lenco top-plate reinforced with glass-epoxy slugged it out with the SME 30 (famed for its powerful bass) where, in the bass, it was overall more powerful, tghter and more detailed, depending on the recording, to the point it was thought by some (not all) the Lenco was coloured. Well, the stronger steel top-plate makes the bass even more powerful and exciting. Full auditioning and comparisons has not yet been done.

On the Garrard Front, I have to declare the Kokomo bearing mod from Germany a necessity, as it easily doubles the Garrard's sound quality all on its own (when the Garrard is Direct Coupled to a massive plinth). The clarity, speed, air, information-retrieval and bass all improve vastly.

When I'm connected at the new downtown address, I'll be able to report in greater detail and depth on all these exciting developments! Have fin all, and keep the Idler Faith, the Great Idler-Wheel Revival is truly on!!! Vive la Idler Wheel, Vive la Lenco!!! Have fun all!

Phew, I see I've missed a lot of action by being cut off from the internet, including reviews of exciting new analog products!! Forced to use free internet for 15-minute pops once a week when I went to town led to such great typos as "Have fin", which is entirely appropriate considering the Dolphin pump Mike recommends for the Terminator tonearm :-).

Speaking of which, reminds me of early days in the original thread when I believe it was Reinderspeter who was using his DIY version of the Ladegaard tonearm on his first Lenco. I see I have a lot of catching up to do with respect to reviews and buzzes on products on Da 'Net after my long isolation in the country. Lots of surfing to do to catch up!! The Terminator sounds really exciting Mike! I was speaking with an old buddy I bumped into in town last week who had me build him a MG-1-adapted Lenco, the MG-1 being another low-priced air-bearing tonearm, as he has fallen completely under the spell of his MG-1 after years, the Lenco/MG-1 being one of the few pieces to survive an across-the board clearing after he had decided to sell everything off (including recent components from Audio Research, Bryston, Aesthetix, etc.) and start over from scratch. Others, on the other hand, find they can't live with the air-hiss noise, which is barely audible. Is it audible with the Terminator Mike? Not that this bothers me, we all have different things we can tolerate. I'll soon be building my long-threatened Lenco-Noll, using the Maplenoll tonearm on the Reinderspeter top-plate Lenco. Maybe I should re-think this and go for the Terminator. Having lived with the Maplenoll for years which was excellent in both audiophile and musical terms, I do have a thing for air-bearing parallel-tracking tonearms.

Speaking of the Reinderspeter top-plate Lew, yes, it seems to be an across-the-board improvement over the "regular" Lenco, but with losses of convenience (you have to remove the platter and manually slide the idler-wheel arm to adjust or change speeds), and with the clearance between the platter and the top-plate itself so small that even paint thickness can cause rubbing/scraping problems. So assemble first and then see how much paint you can use, as there are variations in both main bearing height, and in platter height/thickness, the latter likely due to variations in the brass insert to seat the platter on the main bearing. I had to go through my collection of platters and main bearings to find a match which cleared the professionally recoated top-plate. All that said, again on a rather brief comparison (there will be longer ones to come as I set up in the new abode/soundroom), the Reinderspeter top-plate did outperform the "regular" Lenco on all counts, across the frequency range, including motor noise. And again that said, I will always keep a "regular" massive glass-reinforced Direct Coupled Giant Lenco on hand for its convenience and ease of use, and because, let's face it: if it can square off against $50K record players (and above) then it's good enough for me! And improvements in the bass by the Reinderspeter top-plate aside, Mike's experience with the Terminator tonearm shows that improvements in the bass can be achieved by other means (if necessary: the Lenco bass was definitely more powerful than that from the SME 30, for instance, and every other 'table it has been pitted against so far, colouration questions aside), so the regular Giant Direct Coupled Lenco can be further improved by all kinds of means, and is already unbelievably (literally) good.

Speaking of which (again), my experience with the superb Kokomo bearing mod for the Garrards, which uses a "soft" ceramic ball bearing, suggests that such a creature might improve the Lenco main bearing, I'll have to try the Lenco bearing mod at some point with a softer ceramic bearing.

Now I'm setting up in a new place, I've tripped over and acquired lots of new equipment for the new sound room! First off: I walked into a used audio shop just as a pair of very unlikely speakers I would never have considered otherwise were playing, and I was entranced: a pair of Technics SB-4 speakers, being "Linear Phase Honeycomb Disc Speaker Systems", having flat diaphragms made of a very light and stiff metal honeycomb material. It is the smallest of a series of three-way speakers (the others being the SB-6 and SB-8), and is that mythical beast: a dynamic driver speaker which actually does sound like an electrostatic, having no speaker-box/resonant sound, and being extremely detailed with enormous clarity, speed and a chameleon-like ability to sound exactly like the driving electronics. To drive them I bought both a C-J PV-7, which simply does the best palpability/3D/air-resonance retrieval I have ever heard from any preamp (and so which makes live recordings sound better than I have ever heard them), and a C-J PV-8, which is the big and warm-sounding PV-7's polar opposite, not sounding like the pure tube preamp it is (it was designed to compete with the Audio Research SP-9, which at the time set the benchmark for detail and "neutrality" in reasonably-priced preamps). Of course I write of all these things with respect to each preamp's phono stage, but used as a complete preamp. Finally, to go along with all these things I heard and bought a Mitsubishi amp, the DA-A10DC, a 100-watt dual-mono design from way back, and one of the best transistor amps I've heard. Has no reputation, can be had cheap. Ultra-detailed, powerful, clean-sounding with no nasties. The speakers verge on the bright, but with no screechy nasties, which is why I favour the PV-7 for now. Of course, I'll soon be trying the Leak amp with them which though only 12 watts will do, as the Technics speakers are also sensitive and easy to drive. Oh, and I was using the AKG P8ES MM on a Rega RB-300 the whole time, and I was not missing my higher-end tonearms or cartridges at all, I LOVE the P8ES, which is very detailed, warm, magical and retrieves air and resonances itself like a Grado, and am again amazed a how good the good ol' Rega tonearms are.

Lots more too, but that's enough for now, I'll report back as I settle into the new sound-room and catch up on some reading. Have fun all!!

Hi Peter: you're becoming like Microsoft :-)!! No sooner one thing bought than it's already been superseded and it's time to upgrade!! But sonically they are identical, so what the hey, I'll STILL be rebuilding my own MKI top-plates (one blank for the Maplenoll tonearm, the other a two-tonearm version), having bought two HUGE ones. I'll play with washers, I still remember when a difference of 1 mm on the ball bearing destroyed the Lenco sound way back when when I lost the little thing (in the early days four years ago before we discovered new sources of ball bearings and all sorts of stuff), so some auditioning ahead to make sure sound quality is not affected. I'm sure the bushings in the main bearings can be pushed around to compensate.

Hi Mike, great to hear there's no audible hiss, the one failing of the also ultra-light MG-1 tonearm, which is made of carbon-fibre and plastic. There'll have to be a Shootout, and I'll throw in the primitive blunderbuss ultra-high-mass Maplenoll tonearm to boot, which made the Maplenoll 'table incredibly dynamic and with THUNDEROUS bass (before my discovery of the idler-wheel superiority in this respect). It'll be interesting to find out what is doing what.

And yep, I can't believe just how amazing those Technics speakers really are, with incredible clarity and detail and speed. Brightness is from the accompanying electronics and system, the SB-4s sounding lush when the C-J PV-7 is in the circuit, and now with the system reconfigured, no brightness whatsoever from the Lenco/JMW 105i/Decca Super Gold/C-J PV-8/Mitsubishi DA-A10DC system. Now the C-J PV-8 is also sounding better and better, and I'm in Music Heaven daily with either pre (and having fun switching back and forth according to taste and mood), in this new abode which is more conducive to extended auditioning and experiments. While the PV-8 doesn't have the incredible midrange of the PV-7 (but not far behind), it is far better at the frequency extremes, and in terms of gain: it is MONSTER of phono gain, which means LO MCs can be run directly into it, for those looking for a reasonably-cheap but superb and adaptable phono stage. The PV-8 is also much more flexible than most PV line C-J preamps, having a mono, stereo reverse, and so on switch. I'll try my Denon direct into it for some more fun and report on this soon. Both the PV-7 and PV-8 blow the crap out of any sub-$1K separate phono pre I've ever heard. The fellow who sold it to me wants to hear a Lenco through it: he won't believe what this preamp can REALLY do in terms of detail, air, dynamics, bass and clarity, as he has only heard it so far with digital sources. He's also curious about the Idler Thing :-).

Ah the Ortofon M15E Super, I can't wait to hook it up too, was again and again my fave cartridge of all time, and see how the AKG P8ES measures up, they being similar-sounding. The new address means lots more experimenting and auditioning to come, it's got an attached workshop to double my fun, AND a better soundroom! Many more experiments to come all, hope you're all having as much fun as I am!! Good luck in building your new phono pre Mike!!

And speaking of phono pres all, I have been going crazy in my slowly-developing new soundroom, as in addition to the CJ PV-7 (incredible HUGE midrange) and PV-8 (hugely dynamic, incredible bass and clarity) I also scored an EAR 834P and decided to have a big shootout to see which I will keep. This via the Leak Stereo 20/Technics SB-4s or the Mitsubishi/Technics SB-4s. The speed and agility of the little 12-watt Leak continues to astound, as once again it comes out sounding like the big 100-watt SS amp (powerful and DEEP bass, hyper-speed, mighty dynamics to suit the Mighty Lenco) while the big SS amps come out sounding gentle in comparison. Wait until I get the big Klipsch Cornwalls into the living room, the neighbours are going to LOVE me ;-). The Klipsch, in addition to being hyper-sensitive, also having 15" woofers...and being THE most actually neutral (as opposed to a "dry" dessicated sound masquerading as neutrality) speaker I have ever heard. AND, contrary to popular belief, the Cornwalls sound great with SS too (being actually neutral and all ;-)). BUT, the Technics SB-4s have incredible clarity and speed (AND real neutrality), and incredibly musicality, so that the innocent next-door neighbour, a musician utterly innocent of audiophile concerns, loves just coming over with beer (being a musician) and saying "So, what'll you play now John?" As all truly experienced audiophools know, its the innocents who are the true judge of the musical success of a system, audiophiles in general being far too prejudiced and often unaware of the concept of "musicality" as opposed to sound.

Now I post this for those looking for high-end sound on a budget, in the great Lenco tradition :-)!!Anyway, I used, of course, the giant Lenco as platform, and tried the MAS 282/AKG P8ES (superb, the MAS having been designed by Mr. Ito of Ittok fame, the MAS having impressed me so much I now have an Ittok, though it was fashionable in the early days of the Rega RB-300 to crap on the Ittok); the JMW 10.5/Decca (always incredible, and about as fast as it is possible to be, especially on a big idler-wheel drive) and the JMW/Clearaudio Concerto.

Now, the Concerto is not cheap (but not especially expensive these days in terms of high-end cartridges), but it has a musical magic, repeatable across systems, tonearms, electronics and speakers (the first in my experience consistently so, others only reaching this level of musical magic when the stars are in the right alignment) which makes it, in the context of incredible detail retrieval and so forth, the best cartridge I've ever heard. Because I place musical magic/shivers/hairs rising up on your arms above every other audio experience. Which is also why I champion the Lenco and other big idlers above all other 'tables. But, like the Lenco, the Concerto is not ONLY about magic and musical power (gestalt, PRaT, SLAM, etc.), it is also, being a Clearaudio, excellent at detail, speed, transients, and dynamic shadings. Though the Decca STILL has it for transients and speed, and possibly bass, it cannot match either the AKG P8ES (a close second to the Clearaudio in terms of magic, and perhaps better at retrieving air and resonances, like the Grado, which makes me suspect moving irons are quite simply superior to MC in this respect, just as idlers are quite simply superior to everything else :-)!!) or the Concerto (and perhaps the Denon DL-103 and a few other MMs including Grados) for this indefinable magic. You can see I've been busy ;-).

Anyway, the EAR, in almost every review compared against older CJ preamps, does indeed sound great. I used it as a complete phono preamp (mine has the volume pot), using it directly into my amps. The EAR is completely stock, down to the no-name tubes. It does indeed blow away all stand-alone phono preamps I've tried (nothing too exotic mind), sounding smooth, detailed, lively and with great air and imaging. Something about it is methodical. At first it sounds kind of boring, but as time goes on, this grows on you, as it indeed retrieves quite a lot of information, including dynamics, quite a bit of detail, and imaging information. You get the feeling it is just getting on with the job at hand, and in a civilized manner, at a rather high level (if you recognize yourselves in this description, then this is the phono preamp for you). I find it closer to the CJ PV-7 than to the PV-8, as the EAR's bass simply does not compare with the bass from the PV-8, which is Decca-tight, fast and resolved. The PV-7, on the other hand, has a gentle pillowy bass and an equally pillowy high frequency range. The PV-7, though, has it for the midrange, being better than either the EAR or the PV-8 at resolving information here, and being quite simply HUGE and lush with larger and more spaced images. Perhaps too much so, but rivetting nevertheless. Now the PV-7 IS that classic tube preamp, and with a healthy dose of that hypnotizing musical magic common, I now see, to the vintage CJ preamps, and the late, lamented ARC SP-8. I'm not sure about the PV-7's highs as compared with the EAR's. Is one better than the other? I suspect the EAR is more matter-of-fact neutral here, but I'm not sure, as though the PV-7 sounds rolled off (like the EAR) there actually is quite a lot of delicate high-frequency detail.

The PV-8 is quite simply killer. It is liquid, more detailed than the EAR everywhere, much more dynamic and lively, with higher highs and lower lows. It is exciting, and makes the hairs go up on my arms, as does the PV-7 (which, however, doesn't have the PV-8 dynamics). But, I have to say that so far, the EAR hasn't done it for me, though it's obvious I like excitement and am not interested so much in "the Truth" (which I think is a frumious bandersnatch). Those who want the truth will find it in the EAR. I didn't tube-roll with the EAR, but then again I didn't with either the PV-7 or the PV-8. I might end up experimenting with all three, as in many ways it's a close-run race. The PV-8 has that thunderous excitement, allied to liquidity and extended frequency extremes. The PV-7 has that HUGE midrange, and can be improved with little effort (this is in the works for mine) and, like the PV-8, can raise the hairs on your arms (with both the AKG and the Concerto). I'm hunting around for some tubes to roll into the EAR for now.

I hope those looking for some more vintage fun will benefit from these experiments. More experiments coming up for the long-delayed Rek-o-Kut now my new workshop is rolling, as well as the Ittok and other tonearms and cartridges and turntables (the reappearance of the superb Sony 2250 for one). Have fun all, and Vive la Idler Wheel!!

Hi Mike, don't want to keep you on tenterhooks, I'll be doing some tube-rolling with the EAR and see what happens, but haven't had time yet. But, I have to say, it's a matter of the heart: I LOVE the CJ preamps (both of them, though in some ways they are polar opposites, they both share that ability to make the hairs stand up to attention!), while the EAR is, in comparison, more of an intellectual exercise. But I've got vintage tubes on stand-by to juice up the EAR :-). I'll post more when I get around to it (in the middle of moving, packing and unpacking, arranging and rearanging).

Hi Mike. I substituted some older 12AX7s (nothing exotic though) for the no-name ones that come with it and indeed did get an improvement. The bass deepened and the detail improved to the point where the EAR was now much closer to the CJ PV-7 which was in the circuit before. But - and there's always a but isn't there? - the magic which makes both vintage CJ preamps SO compelling was still absent, relative to the CJs of course. Don't get me wrong: the EAR IS euphonic, smooth, tube-like in all the best ways but more neutral than the Golden Age tube equipment of yore. The owner of such a unit could sit for hours without listener fatigue. But, all these qualities which give it a leg up on the current competition are heard by most without the context of certain older CJ preamps (PV-5, PV-6, PV-7 PV-8, PV-10) AND ARC preamps (the great star of magic being the rightly famed ARC SP-8, but also the SP-6 and of course SP-10). The EAR is euphonic, yes, but it isn't "magical" as these older preamps are. And the PV-7 also has no-name tubes; while the PV-8 has GE tubes for the line stage but Sovteks in the phono stage (which might explain the brightness, time for more tube-rolling tomorrow!!).

Both CJ preamps have a sense of propulsiveness, the music enhuberant and forceful, lacking in the EAR, and this apart from simple dynamics, which are also superior to the EAR. Allied to this is a sense of cohesiveness, of the music working together in incredible harmony, perfect timing, that together with the propulsiveness makes both CJ preamps very difficult to turn away from, even when there is something else to do. The EAR, on the other hand, lacks this as well, like an artist who is technically trained, but with no feeling. In reading certain high-end rags these days, one would think that these qualities -cohesiveness, propulsiveness, "continuousness" - are just now making their appearance in cost-no-object designs. But methinks certain writer/reviewers need to immerse themselves in some of these superb older units in order to establish context, aural history.

Today an acquaintance dropped by to pick up a spare laser assembly for a Pioneer CD player I sold off (I got myself a tubed Luxman CD player....GASP! I DO have a CD collection!!) and saw my Ultra Giant Lenco sitting high on a shelf, hooked up to the PV-7. I offer to demonstrate it, he agrees, and I played the new Wynton Marsalis/Willie Nelson collaboration on Blue Note (superb music AND recording/pressing!). He's a pure CD guy, but finds himself rooted to the spot, moving only to place himself in the exact centre of the soundfield. He stood there, not even sitting, immobile, through the entire side of the LP, and had it not been for the phone call from his wife (nagging ;-)), he would have made me play the entire four-side disc while simply frozen to the spot. I'm fairly certain that had the EAR been hooked up, he would have been impressed, but would have left after the first song. But maybe he would have loved it as much as the PV-7. But it's telling he reacted exactly the same way I did to the PV-7, as did also the musician next door who loves to come and sit for hours listening to my system. I could hear and identify the magic, he simply found himself mesmerized. He said one word: "Unbelievable".

Now we get into the same problem which faced us and STILL faces us with respect to idler-wheel drives and Lenco: the issue of exactly what is subjective/illusory and what is objective/real, and what is the "truth". Recall the Great Lenco vs SME 30 Debate. I believe in my body's reactions to the music, that it has some objective foundation, and also believe that this is fairly representative of the human race (who react to the same things I do, as did CD guy). I believe digital conversion of music will ALWAYS be audible to the human ear, which is far more sensitive than the scientists and engineers claim/believe, so that no matter how high the resolution they achieve, it will always leave the listener relatively unmoved (which is different from unimpressed, as in impressed by sound). Ah, the Great Sound vs Music debate. And, to throw this in, the human ear is far more sensitive to certain forms of speed imperfections (i.e. belt-drives, DDs) than to others. While idler speed stability may not be perfect (but is damned close, ESPECIALLY the Lenco), the human ear finds its imperfections - which are not related to groove modulations - far less intrusive (and the music thus much more enjoyable) than with systems which do react to groove modulations, or are referenced to intrusive sampling frequencies (i.e. quartz-locking), which are similar to digital chop-chop (but which can be GREATLY mitigated by Direct Coupling to a high tonally neutral mass). The fact that Lencos and other idlers have become SUCH a phenomenon since I started the first thread shows that other people DO hear what I hear, and ARE sensitive to/recognize what I feel, including you, Mike ;-), which shows there IS something objective beneath all this "frisson", "magic", "entrancement", musicality (as in poetic music, "music to soother the savage breast", "music to my ears"), in short, emotional/physical reaction. Anyway, the older CJ stuff (and certain ARC pres) does something the EAR doesn't, however similar in some ways the raw information is. In addition, I just tested all the tubes in my PV-7 and they are all sub-par and in need of replacement!!

So, when I first heard a crappy idler-wheel drive (a humble Garrard SP-25 record changer) I was gobsmacked, the musical POWER and dynamic explosiveness hit me between the eyes, and this energized me to track this particular prey for years, and spurred me finally to trying to start an Idler Wheel Revolution (first attempt a flop, second bull's-eye). THIS was magic, THIS was musical power. And reading the various reviews of Garrards in the audio press, I wasn't the only one to hear this quality (and overall stunning audiophile capabilities of the idler-wheel system). I poured money and time into it. The CJ strikes me similarly, and the buyer of one of my Lencos, a high-end tube amp manufacturer (the same fellow who did my Leak Stereo 20), has offered to turbocharge my CJs at a very good price (with serious premium parts, and basic repairs/adjustments and likely improvements). I'm going to take him up on it, as the caps anyway are likely getting tired. Personally, I'm not moved by the EAR, so I'll sell it on rather than pour time and energy into it, but keep an ear out for someone else's rebuilt/turbocharged unit, and then give it another go. For those wondering if I've abandoned vintage Sony, not at all!! In fact, CD guy also picked up my Sony 2000F preamp and is going to restore it to full functionality for me (it was quite noisy)!! These old Sony units also have that sense of cohesiveness and propulsiveness, though perhaps not to the same degree as the two CJs.

Anyway, the CJ PV-7 can be had for $400-$500 or so, and the PV-8 for about $600-$700. The PV-8 has so much gain it can handle low-output MCs too. Combined the Mighty Lenco (or other Mighty Idler) to a vintage CJ, and prepare to find yourselves melted like overheated wax and conquered.

When I moved out to the country, I had put my computer in mothballs, and my photos along with it. So, I post for the first time a photo of the Ultra Lenco I had planned and delivered to Cyprus for the non-review. And for contrast, a photo of one I had built at the same time: fun with colours!! My new workshop is nearly finished, I'm motivated, time to start having some fun with various 'tables and designs!! Keep us posted as to your new phono pre Mike, beautiful work on your latest plinth! Have fun all!!

Oh, and PS Mike: that Trans-Fi Terminator tonearm looks utterly cool, just saw one surfing (Enjoy the Music Awards), and it got my drool glands going, gonna have to get me one...;-)...

And again Mike, I've read that 5751s do wonders for the EAR, and that a shielded AC cable makes an difference too. Have you tried these simple things? Wouldn't you know it, my PV-8 has a pair of GE 5751's, and I'll resort to the Sovtek 12AX7 to brighten things up at the front ;-). I'll try things that require no actual modification of the circuitry, as I will want to sell it on at some point, and report on this: can't wait!! So, more experimentation ahead, since Tim de P. apparently borrowed the circuit from Marantz, then there's gotta be hope for some magic!! I'll play with cables, and my FR transformer too and see if I can't coax some magic out of it without redoing the guts. My Labour Day Weekend consists of setting up my new abode and workshop, the better to play with audio, though I tell my lady friend I'm doing it for her ;-).

On the agenda soon: MAS/AKG P8ES and Ittok/Clearaudio Concerto, let's see what Mr. Ito can do. Mr. Ito was famed for his bearings (and rightly so), and the MAS 282 is a killer low-mass tonearm (doesn't look like much, but it easily outperforms the Regas with one arm tied behind its back, and I LIKE the Regas!). The Ittok was named after him as well, and handling one - which I mocked in ignorance for years (sorry Mr. Ito) - is a joy and a pleasure: very substantial, with the usual incredible bearings. I will also have an Ultra-Giant Garrard 301 (Mass is Class), which is in my workshop right now, with bearing thrust-plate upgrade, and top-of-the-line Loricraft power supply to play with, I'll report on the results of this no-holds-barred approach, along with the cheap'n cheerful cherry tonearm being sold right here on Audiogon. Have fun all!

Hi all, really busy right now so consider this a guerilla hit and then I have to run. Be back later to elaborate. Yep, that 5751 makes a world of difference, in the EAR 834P anyway. Considered a lower-noise tube than the 12AX7 even the reduced gain aside, and more accurate to boot. I wanna try it in my too-much-gain CJ PV-8 too, though there are risks, I'll leave the cover off and observe for any out-of-the-ordinary events, smoke, fire.

Now to the real news: I've just come up with a near-free HUGE and important improvement for the Lenco, as events at Rick's place (the floppy/drunken idler-wheel arm post), experimenting with Reinderspeter's top-plate and a recent rebuild of a Lenco and preparation of a Technics SP10 MKII all conspired to Show me The Way. Haha a teaser :-)!! Still listening right now, so I'll keep it under my hat until I know for sure.

On the speaker side, there's nothing in this world will touch a BIG horn-loaded speaker, now I've got those incredible Electro-Voice SERIOUSLY blowing me away (for Mario if he's watching: a 12TRXB (two-way dual-concentric) crossing over to a T25A horn-loaded midrange, with two L-pads. These speakers need a truly well-damped (over-damped?) room in order to perform with no nasties, but once that's done, there's nothing I've ever heard which will touch these: talk about TECHNICOLOR. Makes everything else sound anemic and tired. The best and tightest bass I've ever heard (and I mean LOW reach, tightness and the SLAM of George Frasier, if anyone remembers); a detail-meister; even the highs are rich and glorious (if not ultra-extended like angels squeaking)!! And talk about seductive RICHNESS, like drowning in an ocean (and I mean ocean, the sound envelops you so) of dark chocolate, but with with razor-sharp candy (transients) and explosives (dynamics to level the Rockies) inside. Those looking for a "vintage" system which will duke it out with the best of modern/current, look for these, or for the big Klipsches: next stop the Battle Royal between the Cornwalls and these particular E-Vs (whatever they are). But think shag carpeting, big fluffy couches, tons of crap lining the walls, suspended ceilings. Or you'll know what your tooth enamel is made of, or was made of. Maybe a couch, some books and a rug will do, I'm working on it. At my buddy's place (you guessed it: big fluffy couches, shag carpeting, tons of crap on the walls, suspended ceilings), simply the best I've ever heard, anywhere, ever. At least it doesn't take a carpenter and a gazillion bucks, just some bad taste, and a trip to the used furniture shop ;-). Speakers plus these furnishings, much less than any speaker which can stand in their shade :-).

Gotta go pack my car, I'm off on a trip for a few days looking for Templars in the Northern forests ;-). Have fun all!!

OK, the EAR 834P DOES do magic! I switched the V3 tube to a GE 5751, and the other two to Sovtek 12AX7s, and Bingo-Presto! tons of PRaT, gestalt, propulsion and excitement, all the good stuff an idler-wheel drive can dish out, putting the EAR in the same league as the good vintage CJ and other glorious tubed preamps of yore in this sense. I wouldn't have credited a tube change to affect the character of a piece so deeply (information, air, imaging, detail, yes), so a whole new area for me to obsess/get neurotic about, a whole new can 'o worms. Learn something new every day. So, count me among EAR 834P fans, though with the new price it is no longer the screaming deal it was. But, now I'm casting an experimental eye on the coupling caps, and also wondering how the Sovteks would do in my CJ PV-7's phono stage. Good news that a fix for the EAR is a cheap new tube, the Sovteks' brightness and clarity providing the counterbalance to the EAR's gentleness, seeming darkness and seeming (with stock tubes) lack of focus and musical energy (relative to superb vintage pieces like the CJs); and the 5751 providing that needed sense of focus (detail and bass tightness and control increased immensely). Though I'm not certain exactly which tubes did what, extrapolating from readings of reviews and forums. Replacing the stock tubes with mellow-sounding vintage tubes was like pouring honey on syrup to cut down the sweetness: it barely touched the overall sound quality/character, leading me to believe the sound could not be meaningfully changed. Now I'll shut up until I have some real new news to relate, the EAR is a Contender, and Sovteks have their uses!! Thanks for egging me on Mike. Have a good Labour Day weekend all, the rest of the weekend is tube-rolling, beer and enjoying a late summer bloom!!

Hi Lew, just taking a break from building shelving and thought I'd take a look. From the grapevine I've heard in fact the precise opposite concerning the AMT4's (these are the "smallest" stand-mounters) woofer/tweeter integration, and this is how I hear it (it's the larger AMT1s which had the integration problem). Several well-heeled audiophiles visiting my various soundrooms have always been wowed by these specific speakers again and again, as opposed to the rest of the list which leaves them less impressed all taken in all, as the ESS garner universal/unanimous approval, while the rest get raves from some and not from others, more of a mixed bag of reactions. A simple Googling reveals many fans still of these speakers, who won't let them go for anything, even while owning highly-regarded current designs. Evidently synergies exist.

Things have changed over the years with respect to cabling (I use a mix of Petras for interconnects and solid-core for speaker wire, both very smooth and aggression-free), and set-up (specialized metal stands which I use with my AMT4s, Tiptoes and so on), which might account for the lack of annoying colourations, and their existence back when. Of course, some amps excite the tweeters more than others, as with all speakers, so I go with what works, again as with all speakers.

The Heils and various spin-offs are currently being used in a rather large variety of pricey high-end speakers still today (especially in Europe), and their specs are magnificent: a 97-db efficient driver capable of taking up to 300 watts without distortion and with a frequency range going from a typical 1200 hz (sometimes as low as 800) up into the stratosphere. The trick is implementation, as always. As always with most things, YMMV.

That said, I prefer a variety of other speakers as far as PRaT/musicality goes, which is why the AMT's don't simply stay in the system, perhaps there is a dissociation between the tweeters and woofers being revealed here. But, I've never replaced the elements in the crossover, they sound so good, we'll what happens when I do. Others are not so sensitive to PRaT/timing issues, which explains the more ambivalent reactions re. the other speakers on my list, who prefer the smooth raw detail/information and beautiful string sounds of the AMTs (no other speaker in my experience plays guitar playing like the Heils, for string fans). I do prefer the vintage Sony amps for the Heils, or the Pierre Amp which is ultra-smooth/velvety, which are both tubey-sounding. The Heils are ultra-revealing of any hardness or brightness in an amp, or wiring. Tubes and the Heils don't mix so well, as then there is a glassy colouration, so far in my experience, though I'll try the Leak again with the Heils at some point.

So far, the Technics SB-4s (!!) are leading the charge, the Spendors go downstairs, the ESS go up next, I'll report on this between shelf-building.

Hi Lew and Mario, back from the Great White North, the scenery on the way up was incredible. Now I can let the cat out of the bag, it was to deliver a Lenco, which conquered (in a system consisting of Joule Electra preamp, Sonic Frontiers phono stage, large VAC amp, large Proac towers) the fellow being a "true" audiophile, in the sense that he trusted his ears and left prejudice aside. I agreed to go up there as I'm a Gypsy by nature and was damned curious. Also, I had done some research suggesting that there may have been a European mining outpost up there before Columbus sailed, be returning to check that out further. Some shenanigans going on up there in the 16th/17th centuries for sure. For those who don't know, the area around Lake Temiskaming is an incredibly rich mining area (one village called Val D'Or, "Valley of Gold"_, gold, silver, cobalt by the literal ton. About two-thirds of the way up signs informed me that from that point up, all rivers spilled into the Arctic reservoir. I wonder if that's the northernmost Lenco :-)? Signs, once IN the town, ask you to PLEASE DON'T FEED THE BEARS.

Anyway, yes Lew, I've already replinthed several Technics SP10 MKIIs, back from when in the day I considered the big DDs the only REAL threat to Idler Supremacy. Now I'm re-working an older plinth, will take a look to see what further I can do to extract more. So far, the Sony 2250 DD is a better machine, likely because it can be Direct Coupled while, so far anyway (I'm looking into it), the SP10 can be bolted but not screwed, so to speak ;-), and so not Direct Coupled. The Sony also has a superior main bearing, simply incredible. Anyway, I'm playing with it once again. To underline something, it has been a dictum among SP10 fans since long before I started my Audiogon/internet/forums activities on behalf of the Idler that a minimum of 60-70 pounds of plinth is required to make the Technics truly behave/sing. Heavy plinths were already de riguer in dealing with Garrards. I took this as a starting point and added Direct Coupling and materials, attention to the mechanisms and so forth.

The big horn-loaded vintage speakers have something for which there is no substitute, no going against the laws of Physics: VOLUME. A BIG box translates into a BIG sound, with POWER behind it. Match this volume to horns with massive cast baskets and magnets (the EV drivers - used in many Klipsch speakers - are awesome to behold), and you are in for an EXPERIENCE. But, and there's always a "but", a seriously damped room is a must, the midrange horns especially can be problematic, interacting with a room to create a piercing upper midrange sharpness. But, with carpeting on the floor and big fluffy things, this disappears entirely, to leave the speakers do what they do best, which is almost EVERYTHING. I'm going to put heavy carpet/rug on the floor, and perhaps a second couch or large chair on a side wall. I the meantime, I have a true high-end vintage system: Lenco idler-wheel drive (of course); vintage CJ preamp (PV-7 and PV-8) and rebuilt Leak Stereo 20 (EL-84s) going to big horns by EV and Klipsch. And the sound has never been more modern: ultra-fast, incredible air and imaging. The only thing NOT modern is the ultra-powerful bass and limitless dynamics, and the UTTER absence of an analytical quality/colouration (to turn the tables ;-))!!

Hi Mario, the enclosures on my EVs measure 22"W x 28"H x 19"D, being large vintage television size. I'll post photos when I get everything set up. The Klipsch Cornwalls are much larger, and have 15" woofers to boot! The resolution on these horn-loaded speakers is amazing, something I had not heard mentioned on most websites, the "little" Klipsch Heresy's for instance out-detailing everything else I've had in my system, including the ESS ribbon midrange/tweeters, legendary for detail/resolution. They are ultra-fast. So, once the Cornwalls set up, I expect great things. Ditto the E-Vs. One pair I keep, the other pair go to my buddy's place.

The new Lenco mod is SO simple I'm amazed I never saw it before, but that's always the way with great things, isn't it? It was the result of the drunken idler-wheel post in the Great Shootout with the SME 30, playing with Reinderspeter's top-plate, rebuilding the Northern Lenco, and working on the Technics SP-10, for which I bought small washers for repair, and so had next to me. The mod is simple: It is to stiffen the little idler-wheel post by means of inserting washers above and below the top-plate, so that the threads/nut can be tightened completely. That's between the post and the slider on top, keeping the spring-washer between the new washer and the slider, and again underneath the top-plate, between the nut and the under-slider. As I worked on the Northern Lenco, I was drawn to the slightly floppy post, and wondered if, as at Rick's place, it was a mismatch (top-plate not thick enough). I double-checked with another Lenco and found that all was "fine". Since the Lencos had always sounded so fabulous, I had never REALLY closely examined and looked at the idler-wheel post, which indeed as designed DOES reel about in all directions like a drunken sailor. I realized then that making the post stationary would vastly increase speed stability, which MUST increase sound quality. Things to expect would be even more razor-sharp transients (and let's recall that a Lenco with a truly drunken/broken idler-wheel post duked it out with a SME 30, matched it in resolution, beat it in terms of dynamics and transient speed and a sense of 3D "thereness"/palpability, matched/edged it out in terms of bass information and reach, though all these were dismissed as colourations by the SME owner), tighter and more informative bass, and a greater sense of cleanness. Sure enough, this is what I heard in my own system, briefly, and again in the far North, where this all was VERY clear via that high-resolution system. The bass - even on the "small" Proac towers (by vintage standards ;-) - was amazing, and the CLARITY was incredible. Best of all: the Lenco "magic" - its sense of fluidity and inexorable power, its overall dynamics and incredible gestalt (which I was worried might in fact be attributable to the drunken post) - was left intact! Be warned that the much stiffer post (stiff as a 14-year-old boy at a nudist colony) makes speed adjustment a chore. but once done, it will STAY, making the Lenco much less sensitive to transportation to boot.

And another note on the subject of Russian birch-ply/MDF recipe: it was clear, AGAIN in a very high-end high-resolution system (and I have heard many Lencos in many MORE high-end high-resolution systems), that this recipe is tonally "perfect", letting the true sound of instrument shine through. The highs ultra-extended, the bass bottomless, and everything in-between in proper balance, not to mention limitless dynamics across the frequency spectrum unmarred by brightness, hardness or grain. It is a sickness among audiophiles -exploited by many - to seek the complex, exotic, EXPENSIVE solution, and to dismiss - against the evidence of their own sense, anything which is practical and "cheap" (not so cheap). This is simple prejudice. Of course, there are varying degrees of success in this recipe, careful clamping and design is a must, and there are varying qualities of both MDF and birch-ply. Leave it to the tonearm board to play with material, I favour solid wood, walnut most of all, but am presently experimenting with rosewood (also used in instruments), and such dense woods as ipe and so forth. Finally, Direct Coupling, which makes a VAST improvement/difference, can only be achieved (easily/practically anyway) with wood products.

After I had thought of the little post/washer mod, it occurred to me that Reindersperter's top-plate, which played a part in my thinking, was superior to a glass-reinforced original top-plate not so much because of the extra-thick top-plate (a great idea anyway) or isolated motor (also a great idea), but because the post screws into a sold piece/slider, and so is stiff and not loose. In other words, because of increased speed stability. I'll be testing out this theory. Whatever the case, those who have stock Lenco top-plates, Get Ye some little washers, a few cents, and stiffen those posts!!!

Finally a word about speed stability and the music encrypted in those black discs. This proves that it is not absolute speed stability which is most important, which is impossible to achieve in the physical world, but the form the speed INstabilities take. A belt-drive's speed instabilities are a direct response to groove modulations, and this is heard in inferior transients, dynamics and bass power. A quartz-locked DD's speed instabilities are caused by the electronics, which are heard digital-fashion by the human ear (dash-dash-dash), and so which sounds like digital: dry and analytical (some prefer this sound, but it IS a colouration). An idler's speed instabilities are caused by the drive system, but is is ANALOGUE (momentum of motor and platter)/smooth, and so LEAST damaging to the musical signal. And regardless of rumours of less torque with idlers (faulty mathematics/missing-misinterpreted information somewhere), a simple effort to stop the platter on any big idler (VERY difficult relative to both DDs and belt-drives) settles the issue. So what happens when you take a powerful big and very evolved idler and perfect the speed stability even further? Tighten those posts and find out!!! And, finally, Direct Coupling to a high inert mass improves the speed stability of ALL systems, smooths out quartz-locked DDs, making them more musical, and should also do the same for belt-drives, though to a lesser extent. But so far in my experience, the Idler still rules.

Have fun all, more to report once the dust settles!! Vive la Ever-Improving Lenco, Vive la Ever-Improving Idler-Wheel!!!!

Hi Lew, yep, you'll have to dismantle the thing to get at the nether end of the idler wheel arm, but I am planning on going down to do a whole slew of Lenco updates later in the fall, you might wait.

Moving my Cornwalls in tonight, along with my furniture and proper stands! In the meantime, I have to say those Technics SB-4s are incredible, and if the bass from the Big Boys is too much for the neighbours, as seems eventually likely (the EVs with 12" bass drivers is already awesome, who knows what the Cornwalls with 15" woofers will do?!?), then the Technics it'll be, as they won the battle amongst the normal stand-mounters, though in many ways the Klipsch Heresy's edged them out (the Technics just having a transparency and PRaT and gestalt which is incredible). Back in the day Hi Fi Answers were utterly smitten by the special Technics flat-diaphragm honeycomb drivers, and thought they were the wave of the future, but I guess Technics just doesn't have audiophile cred.

Back later with more to report, can't wait to hear what the Cornwalls will do!!

Hi TIA: the answer to the first question is how much is it worth to you? Considering that just sitting on bricks with a Rega stuck in the hole the Lenco easily bested a fully-tricked-out Linn LP12, and with not much more than that a VPI TNT (as reported in early days on the first version of this thread which can be downloaded on Lenco Lovers), then I would say forget about what others are paying and just get it. As done all the way, the upper limits have not yet been found, up to $50K belt-drive set-ups. But, the higher end seems to be about $300 (ridiculous, ain't it?).

The answer to #2 is to stay away from European motors in NA, and vice versa, as the windings are different and you don't get full performance (i.e. torque) in NA anyway, and NA ones just won't work in Europe. Wait for a NA one, or get a European one, but buy a NA B55, which are cheaper and have the same motor and idler-wheel as the bigger Lencos. Good luck!

D'Oh! Pleased to meet you Bill, gotta stay on top of Internet-ese.

On the speaker front the Klispch Cornwalls become my Reference Speaker, not because they're better than the big EVs, but because they simply interact with my room better (no horn colourations, which in the right room disappear with the EVs). It must be said mine have been modded with paper-in-oil capacitors, which are said to tame the Mighty Beast. But the detail is exquisite, the dynamics limitless, the bass awesome, and they are unfailingly musical and easy on the ear, as in pleasing to the ear (not the bogus "musical" which means "informative")....in fact, all the characteristics of the Mighty Lenco!!! Nevertheless, they are more "neutral" than the EVs; which are, in their turn, more exciting and spectacular. Good thing they're going to my buddy's place, where I can enjoy them periodically.

And as a warning not to judge given limited information: with the EVs the CJ PV-7 had superior bass and dynamics, but with the Cornwalls, the CJ PV-8 takes the lead. The Klipsches have a more "modern" sound (and are more modern, mine being the series II), while the EVs are older, Sixties era I believe, perhaps they respond to the more vintage circuit in the PV-7. Lots of wrong conclusions about older circuits (which perform better with older speakers, which are themselves unsurpassed since, like the EVs, you've GOT to hear some) out there!! Glad I have both!! In both cases, PV-7 and PV-8, I used the Leak Stereo 20 to drive the Cornwalls. Be interesting to hear the Cornies (?) with some of my SS amps, but some other night: those 15" woofers are producing some SERIOUS bass, time to upset the neighbours!! I made a trip to Home Despot to buy some cinderblocks to put under the Cornies, to tighten the bass and raise the tweeters. But still some VERY serious bass!

Have fun all, I'll post pics of my vintage system once I have daylight to shine on those Cornwalls, which are so big - with 15" woofers lost in a huge baffle - they are almost a caricature of a speaker!!

Oops, and thanks for reporting in with your corroboration Travbrow, I'm currently swamped and lots of things escape me these days!! But, I have to say quickly, that regardless of the system into which it is injected, the CJ PV-7 ALWAYS has that beguiling magical sound. I'll test it out with one of my SS amps and see what happens via the Cornwalls. The PV-8 is sounding fabulous via the big Klispch Cornwalls however, glad I have both!! Anyway, gotta run, in the middle of listening to Reinderspeter's top-plate again!!

Well, over here I am fine-tuning my new Reference System - those big Cornwalls are truly spectacular, but my neighbours will hate me ;-) - and, I've found a stone-working business which will give me a large variety of options, and I'm quite excited as it looks like I'm finally coming Full Circle.

Back when I first tripped over the Lencos, '92, I had had a financial backer - after he had heard that first Lenco which shows at the top of my system page - who was interested in getting into some sort of manufacturing. But that fell through, as at that time the large companies - Thorens, Shure, etc. - had announced they would cease production of analogue hardware, and it looked like CD had utterly won the war. Finally, many years later, I decided to simply give the audiophile world the secret of the Lencos (and the Idler Principle) and their improvements for free, here on Audiogon. But back at that time, I had planned on building plinths out of marble, as I was in love with Greece (as I still am), and marble seemed a "chaotic" material (CLD) which would give good sonic results. Marble being a chaotic material in the sense that it is compressed and heated limestone with deposits/impurities in it, which gives it that "marbled" effect.

I walked through a very large display of types of stone at this business, and gave a variety of stones - granites, marbles, travertine and slates - the Ping Test (holding up a piece of each of flicking it with my fingernail to test its deadness/lack of ringing). To my surprise, both some forms of marble and some forms of quartz (not all) rang less than slate. Travertine, a porous type of quasi/limestone/marble (and quite beautiful) - was deadest of all (and so I should some day comminssion a plinth out of this), after a truly striking impure marble (think huge swirls of intrusive material). Slate is layered and metamorphized shale/sedimentary rock whose main attribute is chemical -not physical - inertness. Marble can more truly be termed a "constrained layer damping" material - as is advertised - for it is a true mix of disparate materials. A Ping Test of a truly striking piece of marble, with gross impurities of definitely different types of stone (accounting for its striking appearance), gave the deadest of all "pings", being a true dull "thud", followed, as written, by travertine. What surprised me more was that some examples of granite were incredibly inert, which is counter-intuitive as they have high crystal content. But, again, quartz is an agglomeration of materials, as is also limestone, made, like slate, out of successive deposits, being a sedimentary rock.

Now, as with Reinderspeter's top-plate - which I eventually discovered sounded better than the regular Lenco not because of the reinforced top-plate (though this does improve things) but also largely because of the solid idler-wheel post which greatly improved speed stability and so focus, transients, detail and so on - we don't know if it is slate specifically which accounts for the alleged improvement in sound quality, or if it is the simple fact of the rigidity advantage ANY stone has over wood. I say "alleged" because audiophiles frequently fall into the trap that increased brightness/hardness - as one would expect from metal being clamped to stone - equals more information/actual detail. In a system tending towards darkness this would be a big plus, but more than that, we live in a current audiophile obsession with detail, which means Detail Uber Alles, detail trumps all, and so we have to be careful of any vogue. Interesting that all this current furore over slate started in Wales (that company lifting/plagiarizing both my system text and one photo from my Audiogon "system" in their advertising/website), which once dominated the world market for slate. Now, stone UNDER a Lenco definitely brings improvements to the machine: does it do this more effectively (i.e. eliminate flex/vibration as it does as a platform, bringing with it increased focus and control, which is why I consider a stone platform a near requirement) when the plinth is itself stone?

Given all these choices, and the high cost of having these made, I have to choose only two, so to settle the issue to my own satisfaction, I will commission a plinth made of slate, and one of marble. They can also make one for me out of soapstone (or anything else I can imagine), which should be a good material, but these pieces will be expensive so for now I restrict myself to two. If the marble is as, or more, effective than slate, then this opens up a whole new area of aesthetics, as anyone can choose any colour/type/pattern of stone according to their own tastes, and as with wood, the varieties of beautiful stone are practically limitless: blues, greens, reds, mixes of all of the above, swirls, gold-in-black, white, etc. Then let's not forget the MAIN issue of whether or not stone is better in the plinth or under a wooden one.

I am excited because for the first time since '92, it looks like I will finally have an actual physical example of that first Lenco I had planned, a brass-coloured Lenco (I will have it recoated as such) set in a white (ish) marble plinth. In admiration for ancient Greece ;-). So, Full Circle back to the first thought I had. Will be set in a place of honour, regardless of sonic results. So I use fluted columns :-)??

On other fronts, I have fine-tubed my Klipsch Cornwall system - and my buddy's Electro-Voice system, to achieve equally spectacular results from both! Holy Crap the sound!!!! But now it's time to go out to the country for a riverside beer, so I'll be back later with a whole slew of fresh lessons learned! Have fun with your idlers all!!!

Just a quickie, just supercharged an original Lenco tonearm to fantastic results! I used ultra-thin solid core internal wiring (the best tonearm wire methinks) soldered directly to Petra (Music Boy) interconnects (still my fave), replaced the original rubber V-blocks for the knife-edge bearings with brass ones sourced from Sander (can be contacted via Lenco Lovers), and drilled out the connecting end, drilled out a 'real' headshell and epoxied the thing in place, basically a repeat of what I had done way back in '93 or so when I first discovered the Lencos. But THAT Lenco was not Direct Coupled to a plinth and mounted with a Reinderspeter top-plate, and now the result is fantastic. How fantastic? Haven't had time to do comparisons yet, but sounds very clean, detailed, dynamic and with excellent tight bass with the Denon DL-103"E" (phonophono in Berlin).

I've now got the Reinderspeter Lenco sitting next to an Ultra Garrard, the Garrard having both the Kokomo bearing upgrade AND a Loricraft power supply, as well as being mounted in a truly gigantic plinth (Ultra), for ultimate refinement and the usual Idler POWER and SLAM. Not only that, while the Super Lenco tonearm sits on the Reinderspeter Lenco, the 12" Cherry tonearm (available here on Audiogon for $200) is also sounding excellent on the Ultra Garrard (it being mounted with the famed Empire 10PE MM, smokin'!). So it's the battle of the budget wonders (the Lenco tonearm much better-built than the cherry, but it's the sound that counts) on two Ultra-'Table Contenders!!

Also got myself an NOS Dynavector Karat Ruby, a superb MC, only just mounted but already sounding excellent.

Be back with further reporting and photos later. Have fun all!!

I'm still in Greece, the weather and company are just too fine, and last summer was, quite frankly, crappy, time to make up for it, so I keep adding weeks to my initial 3-week voyage. Staying away from Da Net as its a holiday, and also because availability is so spotty on this isolated and undeveloped Greek island. I'll be stopping by in Athens on the way back to discuss record players and shop for vinyl in Monastiraki :-)!! See ya all next week, for real this time ;-)!! Lots of excellent audio experiments to begin the moment I return, and already being set up to boot. Can't keep a good analog-er down. Thanks to Dave for passing on my news, and apologies to everyone for constantly changing my itinerary. See you soon for more audio adventures!! Yamas, time for my daily Greek salad :-).

Hello all, I'm now back from Greece and struggling to re-adjust to both the former lifestyle - over the previous hiking lovely mountain paths in the mountains overlooking the Aegean, swimming in said sea, and drinking with the locals late into each night - and the temperature difference: sweating as I hiked compared with chilly sub-zero temperatures and constant snowfalls! But, I've already been active demonstrating my monstrous Ultra Lenco, for which demo I rewired a Rega RB-300 with ultra-fine solid core and Petra. As always when I take the time to properly set up an RB-300, I am stunned at how good it is.

The secret to the RB-300 is high-quality MCs (and rewiring). When used with MMs (especially Grados) or lower-end MCs, the Rega RB-250 sounds better, but as the MCs (especially, though some MMs, like the late lamented Shure V15 VxMR, sound incredible on a rewired RB-300) mount in quality, so too does the RB-300. I had first tried a Dyna 20X HO (latest version with the microridge stylus and tapped body), which sounded decent, but when out of curiosity I mounted the NOS Karat Ruby I had I was stunned at how much better it was. If one cruises the various forums looking at reports of the 17D vs the 20X, one reads it is a small but definite improvement, but what I heard on the Lenco/rewired RB-300 was an annihilation, and whole new order of excellence. It was MUCH faster, MUCH more transparent, MUCH more dynamic, fast, organized....the Karat Ruby (23RS) is incredible, (and one assumes the 17D MKIII is better still), and in many ways seems to outclass much more expensive MCs, though more listening is needed to confirm this, as bass is light and tight on the Karat, while bass on pricey MCs is much deeper and richer. But no contest in terms of speed and resulting organization, as the utter lack of smear means instruments are much easier to differentiate in dense passages.

This is evidently due also to the much greater speed and dynamics of idlers over belt-drives, which consequently goes much further to highlight the sonic differences between ultra-fast cartridges like the Karats (with their ultra-short gemstone cantilevers) and higher-end MCs, or indeed any other MCs or MMs (excepting perhaps the Deccas). Belt-drives, with their slower transients and much smaller dynamic palette minimize these differences, and maximize differences in bass reach and power (the Karats being drier and more damped). But, more auditioning is needed to find out exactly is going on. But, the Rega RB-300/Dyna Karat Ruby is in the same league, in terms of information-retrieval, as the much pricier JMW/Clearaudio Concerto I matched earlier against the SME 30/Graham Phantom/Benz Ebony, and which matched it in terms of detail, imaging and overall information-retrieval (other judgment aside). On top of this, the RB-300/Karat has excellent PRaT and gestalt, is not bright or fierce and so is natural-sounding with all recordings, making it a musical joy. So, extend this to include an RB-300/17D as a killer reasonably-priced match.

I'll be playing with other big idlers now winter's here, such as the Rek-o-Kut and Gates (built in some ways like an EMT), as well as various stone plinths and more on the Sony 2250.

One of the great impressions made by the Giant Direct Coupled Lenco in a Shindo eledtronics/Devore system is silence: a near-total absence of noise, including normal surface noise, making for ultra-black backgrounds.

Have fun all!

Thanks Pat, the Shindo/Devore set-up certainly highlighted the Lenco's soundstaging and imaging abilities, as well as the particular strength of the Rega/Karat Ruby excellence in instrumental separation, due to the aforementioned speed. Michael and the others attending (hi fellas!) would be interested to know I later mounted an Oracle Thalia MC to the Rega, which is identical in construction and in specs to the Benz Ebony H (but with a retail price which is much lower), and there was a huge increase in bass reach and power (and the image is HUGE and instrumental separation excellent), so the Lenco/Rega pairing can go much further.

And in a further paean to the Rega RB-300, since it has a dynamic downforce which the RB-250 lacks, it is much more versatile: using the spring, one can either reduce the effective mass (reduce the downforce to minimum and so bring the counterweight closer to the pivot point) or greatly increase the effective mass (by increasing the dynamic downforce, compensating by moving the counterweight further back), and indeed experiment with everything in-between to extract the best performance from any given cartridge in this tonearm. Add to that the higher-precision bearings and stainless steel construction, and you have a tonearm which, when re-wired, can go a very long way with high end MCs (especially when mounted to a large idler ;-)). It is, furthermore, solid and easy to use, and with its canted and decently-proportioned headshell, accommodates every cartridge I have ever tried with it, which I can't say for many tonearms. My rediscovery of this tonearm is due mainly to the ultra-fine solid core I recently found, which consequently has no spring effect to interfere with the bearings' freedom of movement, and which, being solid core, simply performs better than most, if not all, stranded alternatives. I'm not saying there aren't better tonearms out there, just that the Rega must be taken seriously, and when it is (paired with serious cartridges), it takes some beating.

Anyway, exposure to Michael's system means I'll be reconnecting my Leak Stereo 20 (EL-84 amp like the Shindo), and see how it fares with the Mighty Lenco/Rega/Thalia combo!! The Thalia is slower than the Ruby, and could use the Leak's/EL-84's super-speed to compensate (I'm currently using the Pierre amp, which is a rich and tubey-sounding SS amp). In the meantime, it sounds like I've added a subwoofer to the system!

Amazing that you persist Dung Beetle, as always, very constructive as always. So do like the insect you are, and do us all a favour and disappear until spring, at least. For those who, like Dung Beetle, may not be able to read and understand, by killer reasonably-priced match I mean in some ways as good as the current state of the art. But I know that the rest of you understood this. Limitations of insects and all that. Please ignore and excuse the interruption in our normal programming.

I am going to regale the audience here with a choice bit of wisdom, from one of the world's greatest writers, Khalil Gibran: "It is easier to write upon the water, than to teach a fool anything."

We'll let that stand alone up there, apart were it can be savoured. Which, translated further, but at a lower level (meant more for insects and such-like) would mean "Don't waste time with fools." So, henceforth, I give notice I won't even bother to read posts from this source, the Fool Pool, life is too short and I have better things to do, this is a waste of my - and everybody's - time. If, in one chance in 100 billion, the posts have any value at all (but I think I am safe in assuming "NO"), then I profusely apologize. If, on the other hand, such posts reveal the smallness and meanness of certain characters, then this is the only wise way to deal with it. Like stepping in excrement, then stuck on one's shoes, it may not be my fault, but I'll take the smell of it into the next room I walk into. 'Nuff said.

In my last and most recent voyage, I had brought a laptop with me, on which was downloaded years of research in science and history I accumulated through roughly 15 years of travel around the world. Various people I met around the world over this period had dreams of a man traveling with a typewriter, and then met me along the road. It was on this extremely lengthy travel-adventure that I discovered, in Helsinki (I met a beauty in the Greek islands, who agreed to meet me in Cairo, and I in turn agreed to follow her to Helsinki), the existence of the idler-wheel principle, and failing in my search for a Garrard 301 or 401 (before the days of the internet) found instead the Lenco. Upon my eventual return to Canada years later, I fell back into media analysis which, thanks to the internet was now done from home, with e-mail attachments. I had resisted the internet to this point (and still resist the cellphone), but had no choice. While on-line and bored, I discovered Audiogon (I feel for them) and started to make trouble - but ** constructive** trouble - via certain threads I initiated, debates I joined in on and, of course, the Home Despot thread/Lenco/Idler movement. Simply clicking on the links under my monicker confirms this, for those who think rather than excrete noxious airs. The time I will continue to devote to record players is limited, I am working once again on the book, which thanks to fortuitous meetings and findings, is once again on-track.

I'm currently playing with an Antique Sound Lab AQ2006DT full-function all-tube preamp, being a great fan of the ASL sound (full of PRaT, slam and excitement) and it is a sweeeeetttt honey of a preamp. Makes me want to buy matching ASL amps. I love the budget ethos, I love the sound (Joseph and I see ear to ear on what music reproduction should sound like). For now I have it matched to the Leak, but it is soooo sweet I will also match it to the ultra-fast Mitsubishi dual-mono SS amp and see what happens. Can't stop fooling around. In the meantime, I have to re-tube my CJ PV-8.

Anyway, remember the fun all, and watch what you step in.

Thanks for the welcome Michael/Oregon, and thanks for the kind words Michael/Mikeyc8.

Hi M167607: my opinion here is not set in stone, but is a combination of experience (the Grados in particular seem happier on '250s, a friend uses this combo to stunning results) and seemingly near-universal consensus that the '250 is the superior tonearm. With MCs anyway, and with both rewired and with identical metal end-stubs/counterweights (RB-300), I always found the RB-250 relatively grainy and bright/harsh. With smoother/slower MMs (like the Grados), this would be counted a plus in many systems, leading to a better balance, which I think partly explains the adoration of the '250s. A complicated situation. The two tonearms differ as well in the vertical bearings, which are very different one from the other (and yet another reason the ‘250 is considered superior); as well as the spring-being-audible thing (I know all the arguments, but trust my ears), which can be addressed by simply applying some grease to kill any ringing, if one is really worried (but a fair comparison does reveal the ‘300’s greater smoothness/refinement, so what exactly is being heard apart from neurosis?), and preserve the extra flexibility the dynamic downforce offers. One has to remember that the whole ‘250-is-superior thing started with Origin Live, which established itself as a business by exactly this claim, offering upgrades to the ‘250 (just as the current slate craze for plinths started in Wales, a world exporter for slate, with no comparisons done against other stones) which became very popular.

With MCs however, and also as the systems go up in terms of resolution and high-frequency extension, the picture changes and I find the RB-300 quite a bit more refined, and especially so as the MCs go up in quality. It also works extremely well with the Shure V15s, and likely certain other MMs. Anyway, it's probably more complicated than this, but I'll stand by the general sonic differences between the two arms, one being more aggressive ('250) and the other smoother and more refined ('300). Of course, as the MCs get better, especially in high-resolution, extended-highs systems, the RB-300 increasingly takes the lead.

After hearing Michael's system, which excels in imaging, soundstage, and easy differentiation of instruments as I could definitely hear, I decided to re-insert my own EL-84 based amp, my rebuilt Leak Stereo 20. I’d already mounted my Oracle Thalia/Benz Ebony H (which I ended up with due to a series of accidents) to the Rega with excellent results, bearing out the superb quality of this currently maligned tonearm, as is fashionable today to do, people forgetting that once upon a time the Rega RB-300 was the new Enfant Terrible of the tonearm world, being a victim in the public mind of its own success.

I am a media analyst by trade, a researcher who is paid to analyze how the reporting of facts and rhetoric are used to influence people’s thinking, and the results. So please indulge me as I find these developments fascinating, as I did the rise of the Belt and the “blacklisting” of the Idler.

Many believe the Rega followed the SME V, being a cheaper copy. The reverse is true, as everyone knew back in the ‘80s: the RB-300 came out first, in 1983, to great acclaim. It won an engineering award for its extra-long casting. SME followed in 1984 with its prototype SME V (the finished product came out later), as SME themselves admit, showing a greatness of spirit seemingly utterly lacking today: “The new SME arm aims to solve a major headache in one bold stroke, one already partially addressed by Roy Gandy in his Rega RB300.” I often read, when I very infrequently cruise the forums to see what’s being said, about the very poor construction of the Regas. Excuse me, but what the Hell are they talking about?? Its one-piece cast armtube is evidently superb. Its bearings, horizontal and vertical, have no detectable play: anyone who has handled several tonearms can feel its evident superb quality. Are they talking about the plastic arm-lift/antiskating platform? Most tonearms have these made of plastic. And the Rega is cheap. It was the Roksan/Rega combination which knocked the then-reigning King of Turntables, the Linn LP12/Ittok pairing off its throne, as reported in the world hi-fi press at the time, none other. It was as a result of the Roksan/Rega pairing that the door was opened for varying designs, and brought high end American record players into the mainstream of hi-fi (the honourable ARs aside), by leading to the proliferation of design, since the Roksan broke the three-spring suspension rule, allowing the acceptance of alternatives (which many still resist, considering a three-spring record player to be still the only acceptable option).

People often have to go after the Big Gun, not out of a desire for the “truth”, but simply because they are so motivated. This leads to unfortunate results, as knocking the Regas out of various forms of ignorance and misplaced aggression only promotes the Audio as Status agenda, making the ultra-expensive tonearms more secure in their assumed superiority (based on their price tags). I started the Lenco/Idler change as a way of combatting the Audio as Status sickness (I was laughing as I wrote out the title of the first thread, “Building high-end 'tables cheap at Home Despot”, knowing I’d be tweaking the noses of these types), but this is far from over, as it infects even idler fans (who go after such unobtainium as EMTs and automatically assume superiority, and ditto DDs, the rarer and more expensive, the more the assumed the superiority…the price tag is the product to these types, and this further contaminates the search for facts/truth). New exclusivity clubs arise, and Rega-knocking by ignorant budget audiophiles, relying also on Origin Live marketing, unwittingly supports and nurtures this agenda.

Anyway, all that investigated and aside, installing the Thalia was like adding a subwoofer to the system after the Dyna Karat Ruby, but it lacked the absolute speed of the Ruby, as most, if not all MCs do. So I hooked up the Leak hoping to balance this out, and the result is music, glorious music: smooth, fast clear, lush, rhythmic, gorgeous. I suspect the longer I am away from the Karat, the less I “remember” its great speed. For now, I’m satisfied with the Lenco/Rega/Thalia, but will likely try the Karat again at some future point. Though ultra-fast and detailed/organized, the Karat is tonally/atmospherically threadbare as compared with the glorious richness of the Thalia/Ebony, not to mention the matter of the bass. Two presentations, both of them enjoyable (since both excel at PRaT and gestalt/togetherness).

Anyway, have fun with your various projects/plans all, take what you read with a few tons of salt, do your own research, exercise that rarely-mentioned and fading thing called "critical thinking" (and by this I mean **thinking** based on knowledge/research, not blindly attacking for the helluvit) think for yourselves, and trust your ears!! 'Scuse me for this return to the past, Ranting Into the Void, it just happened, Vive la Lenco, Vive la Idler Wheel!!

Thanks for that, Musicfile, just continuing what I started back at the beginning of 2004, can't turn my back on that since I got you guys into this mess ;-), though eventually I'm going to live in a cave overlooking the sea on a Greek island, like Caliban, getting tired of shoveling snow :-).

Hi Michael, by "just so" I mean screw down the Direct Coupling screws so the contact is firm, but not so much you deform the top-plate surface; ditto the four bolts, which should be tightened only so much as is required for the edge of the top-plate to be seated firmly against the plinth surface, as over-torqueing can also deform the top-plate at those four points. Deformations of the top-plate is stress, and stresses can be heard as a hardening of the sound/upper midrange and also affects PRaT/timing. The whole idea in traditional CLD plinth-building is also to avoid stresses and make contact/gluieing as perfect and firm as possible, so take care in clamping. The more perfect the clamp, with the least amount of stress (forcing each layer to "behave" via clamps to the point there is warping is a sonic no-no, and makes further clamping difficult) is also heard. Eliminate stresses and make as perfect and firm and even a clamp as possible, which means the CLD mass is a single non-resonant and neutral mass (the varying maerials do cancel each other out, something the birch-ply/MDF combination does very well, the utter tonal accuracy can be heard, as well as the dynamics across the frequency spectrum which are not emphasized or depressed at any frequency) and this is heard too. Like any recipe, the more perfect the execution, the more perfect the result. Once the plinth one firm mass with no stresses, and the bolts and screws screwed down just so, it can be heard, and leads to the Master-Tape-like sound, and very definitely to the Amazon in Full Flood sound the Lenco does so well, when compared to ANY record player out there, including the famed EMTs. This is because, while the Lenco does not approach many classics out there (Garrards, Thorens TD-124s, EMTs, etc.) for build quality, its design is highly evolved, and there may be an element of chance here too: I mean, while the Denon DL-103 after 40 years continues to astound, did the Denon engineers know what they were making when they made it?!?

It is evident from listening to a Lenco in any condition (original plinth or not, though replinthing brings out these qualities more) that it is intensely, EXTREMELY fluid-sounding, more so than any other record player I have ever heard, and I have heard very many high-end spinners, up to the $50K level (more than this has so far escaped me). This is because of the combination of vertical idler-wheel (which does not stress the bearing rotation like a rim-drive by pushing outwards) with platter with much of its mass concentrated on the rim (more so than any other turntable to my knowledge, though the rim-drive EMTs may match it here) which is hidden beneath the surface of the top-plate (giving it that elegant, modern look) and finally, that designed-for-playing-records-motor, high mass high speed and so self-regulating 1800-rpm motor (its own momentum - a combination of speed and mass) serves to smooth out its own speed imperfections. Put it all together, and one gets what I have written back since the winter of 2004:

"Due to the high rotational speed of these motors, great relative mass and so high torque, no expensive solutions need be made to address the weak motors now used in high-end decks. The platters on the Lencos weigh about 8-10 pounds, with much of the mass concentrated on the periphery: the old boys understood flywheel effect to ensure stable speed. The Lenco platter is a single cast piece, of a zinc alloy of some sort, very inert for a metal, and then machined and hand-balanced in a lab. No ringing two-piece platter problems to overcome. Even the motor is hand-balanced in a lab, and weighs something like 3-4 pounds, and runs silently on its lubricated bearings. Think of it: a high-torque motor spinning at well over 1500 RPMs (compared to a belt-drive motor's average 150-300) which pretty well wipes out speed variations by itself. The idler wheel contacts the motor spindle directly, while contacting the platter directly on its other side, thus transmitting most/all of that torque without any belt stretching. Many high-end decks offer thread belts which don't stretch, thus giving an improvement in sound. The Lenco does the same with its wheel. But the platter is also a flywheel, and so evens out whatever speed variations there may be in the motor. It's a closed system (motor-platter, platter-motor) and speed variations brought on by groove modulations don't stand a chance in this rig, and it is clearly audible."

So it comes down to preserving speed stability in the face of stylus force drag - and considering the various mega-buck record players we know just how serious this effect truly is, from multiple motors through to extremely high-mass platters, which in spite of ridiculous price tags, DO show just how much more information can be retrieved when one proceeds on the assumption stylus force drag is VERY serious....along with motor speed imperfections, which must be countered by high mass and multiple motors and expensive electronics aids - and the ways we use to achieve it. Each method of achieving true speed stability - as opposed to the bogus speed stability claimed by many belt-drives in which, like the clever accounting methods used to make various businesses, including banks, use averaging methods to achieve much better figures than they would under older calculating methods - leaves its sonic signature, as THERE IS NO PERFECT SYSTEM ON EARTH. Sorry folks, but that's the way it is. While spending quite a lot of time on the island of Bali, I noticed that the cats all had crooked/broken tails. This is because the Balinese believe perfection is not allowed on Earth, and cats being perfect creatures (according to the Balinese, they are incredibly graceful and beautiful and balanced, like the sonic signature of a Lenco ;-)), the Balinese break their tails when they are young. Before the e-mails start pouring in, I do not condone this or support it, just presenting a philosophical/physical reality: THERE IS NO PERFECTION ON EARTH, and, as the Balinese believe, this is SO true it is not even allowed.

So, what about the Lenco/Idler way of doing things vis-a-vis the other two systems? Well, as you all know, I believe the belt-drive is barely worth talking about, it is, in engeneering terms, a disaster. This doesn't mean it doesn't give pleasing results, it does, and I have enjoyed many pleasurable hours listening to my vinyl on various lower-end and high-end machines, from the Rega Planar 3 (my first serious machine) through a variety up to the Maplenoll Athena (with 40-pound graphite platter). BUT, the motors are not designed for playing records (off-the-shelf from other applications), they are weak, the belts introduce unacceptable variables...it is, in short, a disastrous idea. It is only the very badly set-up idler-wheel drives of the time (set up to maximize rumble and diminish its sonic potential as idlers were designed and manufactured originally during Mono times, and in Mono there is no rumble) which made the belt-drive solution seem so good. I've written it before and I'll write it again: if it takes from $40K to $150K to realize the potential of an elastic/thread driving a platter via a cheap motor, then the system is literally bankrupt. Engineering is about manufacturing to a price point, and if we built our bridges according to the principles enshrined by belt-drives, then they would cost $100 Billion dollars each, on average.

Then DD. This is a better solution than BD, in terms of getting the job done. But what is presented as a technological tour-de-force (WOWZIE!!) - the extensive computerization - is, in point of fact, a weakness. Remember the Balinese and their cats. There is no perfect system on Earth. The faster a motor spins, the more its own momentum will work to eliminate departures from absolute speed stability. The slower it runs, the more its speed stability imperfections will be audible. DD runs at 33 1/3 rpm, necessarily, for a 33 1/3 speed. Given the extreme slowness of rotation, it requires the extensive computerization/circuitry to control it and hold it to accurate speed: this isn't a plus thrown in, but a bandaid which is required by the slow rotation and exposure of this world's imperfections. Not that it doesn't work once the kinks are worked out, but complex circuitry and computerization isn't an elegant solution (as multiple motors, belts, drive-belt-driven flywheels, electronic aids and montrous platters are not), necessary yes, elegant no, elegance being simple and not complex. In DDs with lots of torque (like the SP10s), this means the computerization is audible, given the slow speed of the motor, and the insufficiency of mass needed to overcome the motor control circuitry/computerization, which becomes audible as all SP10 MKIIs sound (haven't tested the MKIs, which are servo-controlled and not referenced to a quartz crystal's pulsing, and MKIIIs): somewhat digital in their delivery, dry (which some laud as "accurate" when "analytical" is the better word), dynamically constrained (which some might describe as "controlled"). Which is not to say that quartz-locking is inherently a-musical, as my rebuild of an SP-25 demonstrated, which ended up sounding very fluid and musical. This is because the SP-25s torque is MUCH less than that of the SP10, which means in turn that the platter has sufficient mass to overcome the imperfect motor's sound signature, AND, the SP-25 can easily be Direct Coupled, and Direct Coupling helps keep a 'table stable, and also eliminates many audible problems, including various types of noise/vibration/energies. Many quartz-locking DDs sound clinical, dry, and dynamically constrained, but the SP-25 experiment, AND the Sony 2250 experiment, shows that DDs CAN be very fluid. Many belt-drives easily beat many quartz-locked DDs in the fluidity sweepstakes, because their gross speed instabilities are **analogue**, meaning that they fluidly and from pure momentum go from too fast to too slow, with no quartz pulsing imposing its sonic signature onto the works. Which shows that to many, it is easier to live with flawed but fluid sound than with accurate but start-stop/"digital" sound. Unfortunately, the wow is much more audible than with either DDs (quartz-locking or otherwise), and so on sustained notes and so forth, even belt-drives into the stratosphere show their spots on such sustained notes as piano decays and so on. Still, that fluidity counts for a lot, and so many prefer the less accurate but more fluid sound of a BD over a more accurate but "digital-sounding" quartz-locked DD.

Finally (you knew it was coming) we have the venerable Idler-Wheel Drive, which combines the torque of the bigger DDs with the fluidity of a musical BD (and some BDs have managed to impose a digital sound signature, took a lot of work to achieve this ;-)). This is because Idler-Wheel Drives DO have a lot of torque, which is why all record changers up into the '70s were idler-wheel drive. Don't believe all that impressive complicated mathematics which concludes that belt-drives have more torque than idlers: simply use the finger test, try to stop an idler with a finger, try to stop a belt-drive with a finger. End of complicated mathematics, which like the statistics which support the superiority of belt-drive in speed stability and current Big Business accounting practices, is a fiction. The Idler-Wheel Drive uses the platter as a flywheel to control the very powerful motor, the motor's own speed acts as a flywheel itself to smooth out speed instabilities, and the coupling between flywheel/platter and motor is much more effective via the wheel than the similar relationship between belt-drive motor and platter: good grip (unlike tape and thread), no stretching and contracting as with rubber belt. Of these, the most successful combination of flywheel/platter to motor is the Lenco, which signs itself in EVERY system by its INTENSELY FLUID and powerful/irresistible sound signature (perhaps another imperfection, but a supremely musical, powerful and beguiling one), instantly recognizable by any who have heard Lencos.

So, don't be fooled by bogus "accuracy", which is in fact a gross colouration: music does not come out of a lab, it is supposed to come from the heart and, if we are lucky, the recording engineers capture this, and for those lucky enough to have one, the Lenco captures this in all its glory. There are also various means to emphasize detail, but emphasis is not creation: the Lenco (Direct Coupled to high mass) preserves/recaptures, ALL of the information, but it is presented naturally, without emphasis, across the frequency range. Read reviews of the megabuck vinyl spinners, and see how rare an attribute this is: what separates the Men from the Boys is not EMPHASIS, but natural and unhyped presentation of information, with all its soul intact. Amen :-).

So, phew, I'm pooped and Christmas is on the way, so Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year, don;t know how much time I'll have to spare between now and the holidays. Vive la Lenco, Vuive la Idler Wheel!!!

Hi Jloveys, tell you the truth, until I hear it for myself, I can't say. Which is why I am commissioning two stone plinths, one of slate and one of something else. Also to realize - finally - that first dream I had of a marble Lenco back in the Helsinki days. But, my alarm bells ring when I read statements like "the best minds seem to be going towards slate", when, in fact, slate was never compared to any other type of stone and reported on and, as well, that the current slate craze started in Wales, world exporter of slate (and not much else, all due respect to the Welsh).

Add to that various well-known crazes in audio, like digital amps (which lose their allure after one gets used to them) and the well-known audiophile equipment trick of emphasizing the higher frequencies in order to present bogus detail (which has worked repeatedly over the years), and the fact that stone will reflect energies far more than any type of wood so leading to this similar unbalance, and I have cause to be suspicious. Add, furthermore, the well-known propensity of many audiophiles to always look for the exotic and difficult over the simple and effective (consider cables, complex circuitry, multiple-layer podded belt-drive monstrosities, etc.). But, I also respect many of those espousing slate, which explains why I will go to the trouble of having a slate plinth made. Finally, slate is not the CLD material it is made out to be, what it is is endless layers of the same material, fractious exactly where these layers meet each other, which might lead to yet more detail emphasis rather than, like certain wood products, absorption of noise and neutral preservation of true tonalities and so forth. Marble and travertine, however, both made of conglomerates of disparate materials, far better deserve the characterization of "CLD" (and are beautiful to boot). Anyway, we'll find out, and I will report honestly, as always. Might be my farewell present to myself.

In other news, I recently finished a Garrard 301 project, which involved a Loricraft power supply. I built it into an Ultra birch-ply/mdf plinth (larger than the usual 23" x 19" x 6" plinth), mounted both a Triplanar VII and a 12" cherry tonearm to it (and tested that with my Denon 103"E") and found it to be exceedingly good. This was definitely the best result I have ever gotten from a Garrard, and the fellow it belonged to reported it was the best playback he has ever heard (saying it handily outperforms both the exotic-material Raven and the SME 30) and that it beat his EMM Labs digital set-up (retrieving previously-unheard detail), though it's hard to say whether it was the mass, the power supply, or both. Coincidentally, in a recent talk with someone (I forget who now) I was told it was an underground understanding that Garrards sound best at 240V, and the Loricraft power supply allows just this. So, for those who own Garrards, it might be something to try to get a step-up transformer - assuming you have the "original" European wheels - and try this out to see if it makes an improvement.

I've been playing around with that Antique Sound Lab preamp, and though it is not in the same league as the CJ preamps in audiophile terms (but not too far behind), it just has SUCH literally hair-raising timing (as so many of the ASL pieces have) that it has become my premier beloved preamp: when it plays MUSIC (even with digital!!), I just start to melt, to shiver, to experience that long-lost (since the ARC SP-8 days) Kundalini Effect!!! Caveat: according to the dealer here in town, you have a roughly 50-50 chance it will blow up on you. But I've always had good experiences with ASL gear. Now to roll the dice on an ASL Typhoon :-). My dealer will have a heart attack.

Anyway, I'll soon also have my Sony 2250 set up in one of my Giant Direct Coupled plinths, that same beastie which I reported on a while back trampled the legendary Technics SP-10 MKII underfoot (but not a Lenco, using the same RS-A1/Monster Cable Sigma Genesis 2000 - currently the mind behind ZYX - on each ;-)). In addition, the Sony, which has an absolutely superb main bearing (clearly better than the Technics), DOES respond to power conditioners, quite well, further improving things. I'm thinking of putting an Oracle mat (hard metacrylate, not so heavy) on the Sony platter. Will report on THAT combo in the near future, before starting on the Rek-o-Kut.

So, have an equal amount of fun, laddies and lasses.

Hi Bob, actually, my system is a mish-mash of mostly vintage components as, like Jloveys, I tend to spend my money on the source: record players (Lencos, Garrards, Technics SP10, SP25, Sony 2250, etc.), tonearms (JMW 10.5i, RS Labs RS-A1, Rega RB-300, various vintage tonearms) and cartridges (Oracle Thalia/Benz Ebony H; Dynavector Karat Ruby, Decca Super Gold, Grado Statement Master, AKG P8ES, Empire P10E, etc.).

So, first of all, I get to hear my Lencos in various state-of-the-art systems quite often, and so rely on my "true" findings on these demonstrations.

As well, I tend to change components in and out quite a lot, in search of special synergies which lead to astounding PRaT and gestalt (nothing less will do) and also to hear various aspects of the experiments with record players I am conducting. But, I'll list my current reference components. For preamplifiers I currently favour a variety of vintage CJ preamps, which I found, after comparisons, to be sonically superior (especially the phono stages) to many current favourite phono stages (including the EAR 834P, sorry chaps). These include the CJ PV-1 (dead quiet with a stunningly accurate phono stage, and line stage), the CJ PV-7 (gorgeous romantic BIG and intimate sound I never tire of), and the CJ PV-8, which has monstrous gain (and so can take low-output MCs straight in), terrific musical excitement and superb bass. For pure pleasure, however, I prefer the ASL AQ 2006 DT, which faithfully communicates the incredible Lenco/Idler way with both gestalt and timing/PRaT better than anything I've ever heard (and so which is, for this specific application, my test equipment). But it's shortfalls in both bass and some detail prompt me to test with the others. Or the vintage Sony stuff, being the superb 2000F, which has been declared by some superior to the latest run of ARC equipment. But, if I say this out loud, then there are those who will use this to discredit my record player findings, so please, hush ;-).

For amps, I truly have two reference pieces: one rebuilt-to-modern Leak Stereo 20, with all modern top-of-the-line resistors and so forth, a wonder; and a 100-watt SS push-pull Class AB amp a country gentleman built just for me, which so far has wiped the floor with every bit of kit to come my way. I don't know how he did it, but it sounds much like an SET - with an SET's crystal clear delivery, utter lack of grain and purity of tone - but with limitless dynamics. Another wonder. And, again, I love the sound of various vintage Sony amps, being two mostly, the 3130F, and the 3140. They both beat the crap out of most modern amps in the areas of dynamics and rhythm/timing/PRaT. Seems timing is fast becoming a fogotten art. Which is one reason I push the Lenco/Idlers so much.

For speakers, if I want full-range, then I hook up my big Klipsch Cornwalls, which are superb in every aspect, but they scare even me (especially with an idler behind them), so for the moment they are downstairs. My current reference are the Technics SB-4s, which are three-way flat-diaphragm metal honeycomb driver speakers, high sensitivity, and utterly transparent. No audiophile cred, but Hi Fi Answers, back in the day, declared this Technics technology revolutionary and the wave of the future, they are incredible, that rare beast often discussed but never found: a dynamic speaker which sounds like an electrostatic. A few well-heeled audiophiles have recently come into my listening room and been stunned, and gotten up to examine what appears to be an ordinary, unremarkable speaker...until you hear them. I also use Klipsch Heresy 1s, AR 2ax's (nothing does percussion instruments, including piano, like an older AR) and the favourite of many who have auditioned my systems over the years, the ESS AMT4's, which many consider the best woofer-to-tweeter match of the entire ESS Heil Air-Motion Transformer lineup. But, recently they were finally beaten in every way by the unassuming Technics SB-4s. All of the above I found to be quite the superior of such darlings as Proacs, which I have tried in my system (but apparently Proacs need tubes to truly sing). I am currently considering either Magneplanar 1.6s (to hear my Lencos in my listening room via a planar), or Vandersteen 2CEs (great with percussion, dynamics and rhythm). And a few others.

Finally, cabling. Excuse me, but cabling is a swamp I don't want to get into. I do believe and concur that they indeed make a sonic difference, but what exactly is happening? No one truly knows. So, I trust my ears and close my wallet: I use solid core for speaker cable (single-strand 24 ga.) and Petra for interconnect. Before you laugh at the last, often available for less than $10 for a six-foot pair, I have very often brought them with me into cost-no-object systems, accepted challenges against favoured $1K interconnects, and left with $10 in my pocket, minus the cable. I am quite satisfied with these, and I no longer search.

My experience with audiophiles who promise to try 24-ga. solid core in their system goes like this: they insert the cable into their system, listen for precisely 5 minutes, declare them horribly thin-sounding (interestingly exactly as they look) and without bass (in spite of my warning they take 7 hours to burn in, and again as they look). They then buy cables at $1K to $2K, burn them in for six months/1000 hours, then declare them incredible, with the caveat they require 6 months to burn in before they can be fairly judged. Which explains why they are still considered bad-to-middling.

So, there you go, my system is extremely changeable/fluid, and in addition and sadly, if I listed my various systems, many would take this as an excuse to throw away my findings. So I leave them guessing.

I do have a single semi-constant system out of all these options however I am very familiar with, in order to hear what is going on in my various experiments: either the PV-7 or PV-8 (most often the PV-8 for its superb bass, precisely where Idlers and DDs outperform belt-drives most audibly), the 100-watt SS amp (ditto bass), and the Technics SB-4s (surprising bass from these 3-way stand-mounters). Using the RS-A1/Denon DL-103E combo, I test each record player with the identical set-up to be fair and minimize variables. And then, of course, once I am certain and infused by the fire of discovery, it goes out to some state-of-the-art system to be tested full-range/current (someone always curious).

You're welcome Bob. I also rely on reports from afar: for instance if you look under my system, there is the report of the fellow who owned a Platine Verdier/Schroeder tonearm/Koetsu Urushi combo, and who reported it's easy defeat by one of my replinthed Direct Coupled Garrard 301s (oil bearing) matched with a Dynavector DV-507 MKII/Denon DL-103 combo. Such reports as these are very common too. As I continue to underline, if such a report comes from the very owner of said megabuck belt-drive (or indeed the distributor of others), then it is reliable, since he/she has no reason to support the cheaper 'table.

Hi Michael, the answer to the elliptical-tipped Denon is phonophono in Berlin, they are the only ones to offer a simple substitution of the original conical diamond with an elliptical one, without touching the cantilever. They reported this was much better than the Denon DL-103R, which they also sold. But, they are funny, as they will not simply take a new DL-103 and re-tip it: you have to use your DL-103 (or DL-103R) first, and THEN send it to them for re-tipping. As to the collar, it just takes elbow grease and the appropriate set of pliers. It'll come off. You may have to remove or simply bend some of the rest of the tonearm hardware in order to get a sufficient grip.

And over in my system, the Oracle/Benz continues to burn in (becoming more and more detailed and controlled with time, sounding more Karat-like in this sense, but with deep bass), and the re-wired Rega RB-300 continues to show its mettle by both handling the Benz and showing this progression, with precision, clarity, and musicality.

I've also finally picked up a Gates idler-wheel-drive, super-heavy-duty, as if I didn't already have sufficient of these projects!!

Hi all, the other night I once again heard vinyl sounding like Master Tape, on a vintage system which still sounds better than any other I've heard, backing up those Fab Electro-Voice speakers (simply the best I've ever heard, period, The End) now residing in an overstuffed listening room.

By Master Tape I don't mean simple detail (though that was there) or imaging and so on (which was all there), but the utter absence of the sound of a mechanical system: no stylus dragging on vinyl, no sound of any sort of friction, no intrusion of any sort, which only becomes audible when it has disappeared (and then your ears perk up and you say WHAT?!?). Mounted on the traditional Giant Direct Coupled Glass-Reinforced Lenco was a rewired Rega, and mounted on THAT was the latest-edition Dynavector 20X-H (which was, in audiophile terms, slaughtered by my Dynavector Karat), with new Micro-ridge diamond. I sat there stunned as I recognized that sound: the sound I heard back on Cyprus when the Ultra-Giant Lenco (100 pounds) duked it out with the EMT 930 and won. I remember being struck there when I first that sound (of Master Tape...or better, as the owners of the EMT, who made master tapes of various ensembles playing in various spaces, said) coming from the EMT/RS-A1/Shure V15V, a then from the Lenco (but with even superior fluidity and power and resolution than the EMT). The Shure as well had a Micro-ridge diamond, and I'm now wondering if this utter lack of a mechanical sound (of friction or "working") is due not only to the Lenco - which continues to be THE most fluid-sounding, and yet powerful, turntable I've ever heard - but also to the Micro-ridge cartridge? Now I don't think I've got any Micro-ridge cartridges (maybe the Karat Ruby), but I will definitely be looking into this new wrinkle. I've heard the E-V system several times, and yet not until I mounted the Dynavector to the Lenco did I hear that particular Master-Tape-like quality, to the extent that it HIT me.

The rest of the components were my own CJ PV-7 (itself very fluid, silky and musical, and with the E-Vs a Master of Bass) and the humble ASL Wave 20 monoblocks. Doesn't sound like much, but thanks to those E-Vs (and the sound-room which eliminates their brightness), simply the best I've ever heard, and that by FAR. The E-Vs retrieve detail from the electronics out of all proportion to what one would normally expect from those same electronics. God only knows what would happen if high-resolution electronics were hooked up to those E-Vs. Might not be a good idea. I still don't know exactly which particular E-Vs these are, except that they belong to the era of the famed Patricians (which had 30" woofers, the largest ever made!!!).

In building this particular Lenco, I took the normal care in putting it all together/modding it/adjusting it, and noticed as well, as always, that until everything was put together just so - in addition to the usual motor and main bearing rebuilding/balancing/etc. - and by this I mean the Direct Coupling screws tightened just so, the bolts tightened just so, and so on, the Full Lenco Magic was there, but not in full strength. Once it was dialed-in, it was OBVIOUS....sounding spectacularly Lenco-like (and those who have heard modded Lencos know what I mean), with its full measure of limitless power with an utterly fluid sound...like the Amazon in Full Flood. But once that Micro-ridge cartridge was set up and heard in that E-V system....Master Tape. So, don't be sloppy or cavalier!!

Anyway, having pursued the Kundalini Effect (timing SO potent it raises the hairs on the body and causes **frissons**...which I still pursue) which so far only a good idler-wheel drive can deliver, I will now pursue this Master-Tape-like sound (also idler-wheel-related, Analog speed stability which depends on torque-aided inertia, in my experience so far), and see if indeed it does come down, at least partly, to the Micro-Ridge cartridge. But also, in both cases, spectacularly good speakers were being used: in the one case the E-Vs, and in the other Quad ESL-57s. Oh, and tubes too in both cases.

Oh, and on the budget front, I've written it before and I'll write it again: the tonearm cable (5-pin DIN type) which comes with the vintage Audio Technica tonearms (which usually run about $200) is SO good it's worth it to buy one of these tonearms and ignore it and use the cable, or keep the cable and sell on the A-T. I've compared it to several pricey tonearm cables on such luminaries as Graham tonearms (vs a Hovland cable) and such-like, and I just tested it on my newly-acquired SME V, which came with the Van den Hul M. C. D501 Hybrid Halogen-free cable which comes standard with SME Vs and...the A-T slaughters it. More detail, more bass, more depth (MUCH more), better and more extended highs, better timing (music just ROCKS more with this cable) and so on. So, if you already have an Audio Technica tonearm with the silvery/gold/metallic sheath, then hang on to it! The rest of you, look for A-T tonearms with the original cable, if you have a 5-pin DIN connector.

More Lenco Adventures on the horizon, as well as other idlers, DDs, and so on (maybe even a belt-drive!!). Have fun all!!

Hi Gene, yes, I was about to correct that. Actually, one would suspect that increased flywheel effect of the motor should improve things. But, it may also make the motor more audible, leading to some sort of "break-up"/loss of control. So, this would be a case of comparing the two - with step-up and without - to see what the effect is.

On the issue of SP10 MKII vs Sony 2250, I had already written way back that what I suspected was happening was a case of torque vs inertia. The SP10 has a much more powerful motor, and no physical system being perfect, this means the Technics platter cannot overcome the motor's speed imperfection/signature (which is quartz locking made audible). The Sony, on the other hand, has less torque (and is servo-controlled), allowing the platter to overcome the motor's signature, smoothing out any audible deviations from perfect speed. The other advantage the Sony has, like the Garrards and the Lenco, is that it can be Direct Coupled, while the Technics cannot. There are ways, however, to ameliorate the Technics' coupling, but it cannot be Direct Coupled the way the Sony can. And Direct Coupling makes a world of difference. Whatever the case, as with the Lenco back when I declared it a real Contender when the World seemed determined to dismiss it as, let's be frank, crap, so I now urge those out there to also consider this one, a Sleeping Beauty waiting to be taken seriously. Be playing with mine soon.

Finally, I see the idler wheel making serous inroads, being brought back in various forms as well as being exhumed and revived from various basements. Of course, as in the beginning, I still believe the idler-wheel system is the superior system, various statements made by even idler-wheel aficionados, that no system is superior, being unscientific and based on nothing else but faith, motivated by a philosophy/atmosphere of political correctness (i.e. offend no one). Perhaps we offend the mouse when we state, with certainty, that the elephant is heavier and more massive, but this is simple fact. Perhaps we offend the fans of steam power that the combustion engine is superior, producing superior power in a much smaller package, at lesser cost. Nevertheless, this also is true. So why balk at similar differing mechanical/engineering systems in another arena? I see many of those who argued, back in the starting days of the original thread, that speed stability had been addressed sufficiently by the belt-drive system, and that stylus force drag was inconsequential. And yet even then the best LP-spinners relied on extreme mass to produce more stable speed (and why if stylus force drag was not seriously affecting speed stability?) and extra motors to produce more torque to overcome, indeed, stylus force drag? Many/most opposed me when I declared the belt-drive the inferior of the three systems (and still do), and yet many of these now espouse the growing DD phenomenon as well. Both the idler system and the DD system produce, like the combustion vs the steam engine, far greater results for far less economic investment. A $3K to $20 K DD system, produces equivalent or superior results to a $100K belt-drive system. Why? Because, like the steam engine, a far greater amount of carefully-machined materials is required to get equivalent results from a belt-drive machine, and this is at the root of engineering: producing results to a cost. Otherwise we would all be driving $100-million trains to reach equivalent-to-combustion engine speeds (and the analogy is apt: a $150K belt-drive – simple platter driven by a motor via a belt - is equivalent to the $100-million steam train).

Maybe the DD will win the battle, but I have faith that the facts will eventually catch up to the various sources of prejudice - political correctness included - and the idler will eventually be found to have been, all along, the best of the three systems. An extremely slow-revolving motor system which, given the fact that this magnifies speed imperfections to a truly large degree, requires extensive computerized control to be workeable (DD); vs a system which relies entirely on a high-torque, high speed precision mechanical motor designed specifically for that purpose, counterbalanced by the required amount of inertia, requiring a platter which, given concentration of mass at the periphery, need be no more massive that 10 pounds or so, thus obeying the engineering aim of cost vs performance. And that's what it is all about. Furthermore, purely mechanical systems are far easier to repair and restore than complex circuitry and computerization, furthering the aim of cost vs performance (but not the time-honoured economic principle of planned obsolescence).

So, to those who love the idler sound but continue to deny years of accumulating evidence, I say pull up your britches, accept the daily-growing evidence, and join in the battle for scientific truth! Politics has no place in scientific research/investigations, and never has (though this doesn’t mean politics hasn’t contaminated/compromised scientific research/findings to a truly horrendous degree).

I keep hearing/being told that the Lenco has limits. Like the political correctness thing which, in the utter absence of evidence, offered simply as a given (like the old given that the Sun revolved around the Earth, which, actually and come to think of it, at least had some evidence to support it, that being that it certainly **looks** like the Sun revolves around the Earth) says that no one system is superior to another, being simply a matter of implementation. Where is the scientific evidence for either of these two statements (all systems are equal and the Lenco has limits)? And as written, if it costs twice as much (or more) to get similar results from system A as from system B, then, very simply, system B is superior. Likewise, where is the evidence that the Lenco has limits? Apart from the pure hearsay of those who for various reasons (none of them objective and based on evidence) keep saying this, there is no evidence. Like George Bush who, in the absence of evidence, simply kept repeating that there were weapons of mass destruction in Iraq, until, eventually, he was believed by a majority. So far I have personally compared my Lencos against belt-drives and other pricey machines to the $50K level, and often receive reports of similar experiences from around the world, both direct to me and on various forums. Like any recipe in a kitchen, just because someone follows the recipe, doesn't mean the same results will be guaranteed, and lesser results doesn't invalidate the recipe. That's why there are recognized levels of talent, from middling through chefs. So, the upper limits of the "regular" birch-ply/mdf Glass-Reinforced Giant Direct Coupled Lenco has not yet been found, especially in the currently belt-drive-dominated marketplace, which is how this whole thing started, and what I was aiming at in the beginning, that being the context/battle. But say the upper limits of the Lenco had been reached at the $50K level? What would that mean? Say a new Lenco was manufactured today, as it is with pressed metal chassis, eight-pound balanced platter and 1800 rpm motor and smallish main bearing balanced on a ball bearing, and sunk into a 65-pound birch-ply/mdf mass. Would it come anywhere near $50K retail? Not even close, given the standards of engineering of materials and cost of materials. So, back to manufacturing to a price, the Lenco proves the idler-wheel system superior to the belt-drive, at any rate. I not only continue to espouse the birch-ply/mdf recipe because of its extreme effectiveness, but also because the experiment is not yet finished. My own experiment that is, in which I am trying to prove the superiority of the idler-wheel drive, which so many find offensive due to the current philosophical atmosphere of political correctness (which I emphasize again is a social, not scientific application). By rushing off in a million different directions (materials, implementation, etc.), this experiment fizzles out, and we are back to that tired old canard that no one system is superior to another (tell that to the auto industry, which according to this philosophy should re-instate the steam engine), all depending on implementation. And again: you say this based on what precisely? Examine your assumptions, for that is precisely what they are. And the identification and elimination of assumptions is also what science is about.

Anyway, many will be happy, for a variety of reasons, to see me go away, including those who want to erase me from history so they can then benefit in a variety of ways. I'm a pain in the ass, I know, but it's the squeaky wheel that gets the grease/attention. By confining yourselves to out-of-the-way forums, you do not affect things to anything like the degree you do when you participate in a general forum like this one. Keep on reporting in, keep on adding -**postively**- to our store of knowledge/evidence. The idler wheel is back with a vengeance, and this would not have happened without seriously squeaky wheels, out in the public eye, in the face of the industry, on something like Audiogon.

Anyway, soon I’ll have to direct my energies elsewhere, and I’ll simply be watching from a distance (I can hear the sigh of relief), but I predict the continued inroads of the idler-wheel system, as fact and science – AND economics - finally overcome political niceties and various personal agendas. In the meantime, of course, Vive la Lenco, Vive la Idler Wheel!!

LENCO GRADUATION!!!

Back last September, on my yearly pilgrimage to the Eastern Mediterranean, I stashed a little something in my luggage, in the hopes of getting it through both on-board luggage, and Customs. Stashed in my bags, in a regular-sized bag, was a smaller Lenco, in fact the smallest I have built in years, about 50 pounds all told.

Kostas, a friend of mine from the slopes of Mount Olympus, just under the Throne of Zeus, had asked me about a Lenco, and we made a deal. To make it sweeter for both of us, I built it to be included under my maximum luggage requirement, so I wouldn’t have to pay the exorbitant extra weight fees. And also to be able to carry it at all . Worked like a charm, the lovely woman at the check-in desk passed my Lenco (hidden in the bag) no problems, and wished me a good trip. At the other end, Kostas was waiting for me in his car, so I didn’t have to lug the nevertheless quite large Lenco all over Athens. Off he whisked me to Mount Olympus, and up we went as high as we could go with a bottle of wine for us and Zeus, to celebrate .

Once installed, Kostas was smitten. I asked him to try to get the attention of audiophiles in Greece, with the aim of ultimately getting the attention of the Audiophile Club of Athens. After all I go to Greece every year, and this is the ne-plus-ultra of audiophile organizations, where better to gain the Lenco’s graduation papers and world respect? I still remember back when I went to Berlin’s phonophono and admired their rebuilt Garrards and Thorenses, and mentioning the Lenco, and their telling me that “We do only serious machines”. This was after years of reports of Lencos outperforming various belt-drives into the mega-buck league.

Trust Kostas to not only gain the attention of Greek audiophiles, but to gain the attention of George, the owner of a collection of EMTs no less, and not only THAT, but the KING of them all, the rare and wonderful (and extremely pricey) EMT 927. So, the FIRST demonstration of the Lenco in Athens was attended by 8 witnesses in all, including a member of the board of the new Audiophile Club of Athens, THE most passionate and dedicated audiophile organization in the world, I think I can safely say, and the reason I took the Lenco to Greece. Just have a gander at their webpage to see how deep these waters run.

Now, had I known the FIRST demonstration would be against what might well be the finest record player in all of Greece (the EMT 927 can rightly lay claim to being one of the best in the world), I would have somehow arranged to have my best shipped over, at twice the mass. I mean, my plan had been to use the smaller/lesser Lenco simply to create enough interest to eventually lead, after a few demonstrations, to a serious public Shootout involving the A.C.A., so as to make shipping one of my best worthwhile, in the interest of gathering more evidence of the sort I have been after since I first brought the Lenco to the world’s attention,.

After all, there is a VERY significant sonic difference between the even a 75/80-pound Lenco and a 100-pound Lenco (quieter, blacker backgrounds, a more balanced presentation, greater retrieval of fine detail, deeper soundstage, more even presentation of bass SLAM and timing, greater “stability and balance” to the sound, etc.), how much more between a 50-pound Lenco and a hundred-pounder?!!? But, the die was cast, and considering the results, I see now that by being “tricked” by Fate (or Zeus ;-)) into sending my least Lenco I have only made the point that much stronger. To make things worse, the little Lenco was armed with only a humble Sumiko MMT and a Benz Glider. But I did what I could, and sent my new bearing and some other upgrades to be installed, to give this Lenco a fighting chance.

I’ll let Kostas tell the story via several e-mails he sent me, I, unfortunately, did not attend this demonstration, but on the other hand, no one can accuse me of “hypnosis” or influence :

"Just came back from Athens, the demo went well, or so it appeared, since everyone present liked the turntable. comments ranged from "a really nice turntable"- remember, compared to an EMT 927, no less - to ”simply amazing". Most people actually preferred it to the EMT, in spite of the latter's superior tonearm, cartridge and probably phono
stage. I have to go right now, there is a lot to do, including re-assembling the Lenco, but it seems the demo was not a failure. I 'll be back with a more detailed report on the demo, probably tomorrow."

“The Lenco sat on a specially conceived, built to specification turntable-rack, made by Japanese Zhen monks from a special vibration free wood which only grows on the island of Honshu. You can see it on pic 4. George complains that some visitors mistake it for a common Director's Chair and try to sit on it-can you believe those people? We had some difficulty connecting the TT on the preamp, but Manolis-on pic 2 crawled behind the rack and succeeded in plugging the rca's in the right socket. Manolis BTW, is a speaker builder himself, you can see his creation here:

http://www.tuneaudio.com/

“We listened to all kinds of music, rock, classic, jazz, but especially opera, which is George's passion. We made all kinds of comparisons, we didn’t spend the whole night comparing though. However everyone had the opportunity to build an opinion on the Lenco, and everyone was extremely positive, even the aforementioned Manolis who preferred the more, quote musical sounding, end of quote EMT. Now Andreas Economides, (pic 5 middle, sitting,) is the fellow in the board of the new-aca (http://www.new-aca.com/ ) who asked for the article. He was actually ecstatic about the Lenco and told me he very much preferred it to the EMT even now with this arm, cart and cable. Oh yes, and George, the host, would like to hear the Lenco again, in more peaceful conditions after the cart is broken-in. He is a big idler-wheel drive fan George. So it appears the Lenco has made a good impression, don’t you think?

“Well, let me try and remember how it sounded: The Lenco sounded more extended on top and bottom, overall it sounded more balanced and had a better "punch" down below, and more rhythm. The EMT sounded sweeter, more relaxed and "beautiful ounding", if you know what I mean. But voices really sounded great when played through it... We made quite a few direct comparisons of music, but on one occasion the record sounded thinner and less full-bodied on the Lenco-it was a Capitol violin concerto recording, Nathan Milstein playing the Brahms concerto on a mono LP. I suspect the recording is really thin and not very full-bodied and the Lenco just revealed its weaknesses. Or perhaps it was just the weaknesses of my tonearm/cartridge combination, hard to say. I am quite sure that stereo imaging and sense of depth were equally good on both turntables. In a nutshell: the Lenco sounded cleaner, more real, the EMT sounded warmer, more "beautiful". I'm sorry that I cant report more details, I spent more time talking to people about the Lenco and answering questions than listening to the TT's myself. :-) “

So that’s Kostas’ report, independent demonstration and report from Athens of an almost-stock Lenco in classic birch-ply/mdf (with a small substitution ;-)) plinth vs the King of all vintage ‘tables – AND many would say record players past AND present . Now the fact it was an al most stock Lenco in classic plinth is IMPORTANT, as no one can point to something else and say “it was not the Lenco but something else which accounts for the results!!” No, the Lenco weaknesses were addressed (primarily the main bearing, making the idler-wheel post solid and stable, and Direct Coupling to a wooden plinth), but it was mostly the same old recognizable Lenco, lovingly restored, improved and set-up. This also supports my report of the Shootout between my much larger 100-pound Lenco I had shipped to Cyprus years back, in which the Lenco outperformed the EMT 927’s little brother, the EMT 930 (bought and restored at a cost of 18,000 euros). But MAN that 930 was fine.

I would like to once again thank George in public, look under my “system” page to see the evidence this is not a fantasy, pics of the Lenco under the EMT 927 (and an EMT 950 next to it), and George’s wonderful system.. One can see from his choices, ARC SP11, vintage horn-loaded drivers, Jean Hiraga amps among others, that this man knows MUSIC vs simple Hi-Fi, a true connoisseur.

To underscore once again, a 100-pound Lenco would have sounded much more secure, even-handed and stable, and so might have addressed that matter of “beauty” of the midrange, but I know what Kostas is talking about here, as I heard a similar quality to the EMT 930 when I was on Cyprus. In addition, the new main bearing I shipped over would have had a much larger, and more natural-sounding effect when mated to one of my 100-pound Lencos, as it was designed to work with these. Finally, I have gone back to the drawing board, and have rethought and redesigned not only the main bearing, but also the plinth, also to work with the new main bearing, the totality of which not only extracts far more information and energy from the grooves, but more importantly, while preserving and enhancing the Lenco’s magical way with timing and coherence, and simple majesty, all the while sounding much more “natural” and unforced. More news anon.

So, I won’t be back to answer questions or otherwise until I have further solid news to report, keep your eyes peeled all. So, I hope you enjoyed this report from the Lenco Front on which I continue to conduct my campaign!!! In the meantime…..Vive la Lenco, Vive la Idler-Wheel!!!!

Well the audio analysis part of the review is out and of course I am amazed and ecstatic at the outcome, truly better than I could have DREAMED possible (seeing a Lenco in Upper Class A of Recommended Components STILL hasn’t completely sunk in: I’ll have to go stare at it on a Greek island and meditate on it :-)), especially years ago when I first entertained a serious audio review of a Lenco (but had no idea what the outcome would be given politics etc.)!!

Many had warned me that Arthur Salvatore was a VERY difficult and picky reviewer (I could see this myself from perusing his website), but he stepped up to the plate, and I’m sure any Lenco fans out there - worth their salt - will join me in thanking Arthur profusely for taking the chance on the New Kid on the Block, the Lenco, instead of always the established (and by extension safe) Garrards, EMTs, Thorenses, and for taking a great amount of time and effort in order to make his analysis bullet-proof – and necessarily lengthy (like my own posts) ;-) - so that nay-sayers will only expose their lack of understanding, intelligence and integrity.

The lengthy history and explanation is necessitated as well by the fact the Lenco IS the new kid on the block, AND an idler-wheel drive to boot!! I cannot begin to explain what an act of courage – as a reviewer and audio guru (AND belt-driver) with an established reputation - it is to stick your neck out to report honestly (especially positively and to this extent) on the Lenco – and in such glowing (AND honest) terms! Stop and think on this a while. Had Arthur instead raked the Lenco over the coals, as I know from experience, the world would have heaved a sigh of relief and stood up and lionized him and said “Bravo, some reason restored to the world and those deluded individuals put in their place!!” Please, Arthur, don’t revise your findings on this account :-).

Given the world is filled, sadly, with those who feel it necessary to poison a good thing (essentially vandals who use keyboards), as I see it Salvatore had to back up his analysis with his history, and an explanation of the idler-wheel phenomenon, to anticipate any such attacks, and of course to provide a rational and believable foundation to the unprecedented (as he put it) performance he discovered and reported on. Having been a [willing, or I would never have promoted the Lenco/Idler] lightning-rod for the world’s opposition to the Lenco/Idler qualities for years now (from the honest to the ugly), I entirely understand.

As to ANY suggestion that I may have somehow “bought off” Salvatore, this is SO laughable as to make that person utterly ridiculous (tantamount to publicly pie-ing your own face, and then kicking your own ass :-)), as anyone at all who knows me knows all too well.

But to be more precise: I am more of a nomad than anything else, putting ALL real money into my trademark lengthy trips to exotic places around the world (I am into experience, not things, and only invest in audio equipment for the experience of music, which I DO passionately consider an important and miraculous experience). I am not particularly interested in money (other than expecting a fair return for my investments in materials, tools and research and hands-on work), and have none to spread around. I literally couldn’t GIVE away my car! I am one man, with a small workshop (and have no plans for expansion, I prefer to keep my life simple), and now backed up by a very talented machinist to make my visions reality. I will not and am not considering mass-production, and will remain loyal to him if he does to me. (To answer previous questions, I cannot have my new main bearing made in sufficient numbers at the moment to consider selling them apart from my Reference Lenco commissions, if this changes I’ll announce it). Salvatore paid me in full, and in timely fashion and according to my rules, even though he had no idea what he would receive (apart from what we worked out in print).

I have NO financial clout, and in no way can he benefit from positively reviewing my work (in fact quite the reverse as already explained). I don’t want anyone to feel sorry for me, so I’ll list one of my favourite – and central - philosophies: the best revenge is good living. In the spirit of this, I spend months every year in exotic places, in beautiful villas and bungalows (as the case may be) on the world’s finest beaches, interspersed with adventures in the Himalayas and jungles and deserts. This is where my money goes (and when I’m in a particularly beautiful and striking place with a cold beer in my hand and beautiful women around, I say “Take THAT, Bill Gates!!” to anyone who will listen :-)). I don’t think Salvatore could be influenced by the twenty bucks I could throw his way ;-). All my advantages over my “competition” are my brains, my dedication (or stubbornness), and my willingness to go to GREAT lengths to prove my various points (like starting the Home Despot Thread/Project, ongoing).

But, back to the apter celebratory note, re-capping the history of Lenco Dominance :-), back in 2003 I tried to start an idler-wheel revolution in a thread entitled “Idler-wheel drives”, on Audiogon :

“Time to start the revolution: does anyone out there own an idler-wheel drive record player they actually listen to? Or has anyone out there heard an idler-wheel (not a Garrard SP-25) in a decent system? I own several record players, some "high-end", like an Audiomeca or Maplenoll, some simply good, like the AR-XA or Ariston, and I also own several idler-wheel players I built myself, following the Garrard-rebuilds going on out there: high-mass bodies to sink the vibration. They go deeper in the bass, are faster, have more dynamics, both micro and macro, are better at focussing detail, and are pretty well indestructible. Sure, the wheel's got to be in good shape and sure, it needs a good body - but so does a belt-drive. I'm tired of reading about the superiority of belt-drive, especially as most of those writing this have not heard good examples of the alternatives. Hellooo...anyone out there share my conviction?”

Well, THAT one went up like a lead balloon, with a grand total of one lukewarm response. So, in January of 2004 I devised a new strategy: I would use the then cheap-and-plentiful Lenco I myself had been using since 1992, which I knew was superb, and put out a recipe for a high-end record player as bait, whose REAL intended purpose was to gather evidence of the superiority of the idler-wheel drive system. THIS time it took off like a rocket, as a vast untapped reservoir of unsuspected DIYers were just waiting for the instructions and encouragement to get started on a “true high-end” record player project , as advertised in my title (at that time only a very few were into this, be it belt-drive, DD or idler-wheel), rather than the usual amp and speaker projects!!

Being posted Front and Center on the world’s most important audio forum (at least ONE of the most important), and structured in such a way as continued posts put it back to the top of the list, and with the help of the various excited participants at the time, as the Lenco reputation continued to snowball, that original thread eventually went past 4000 posts, the longest in audio history at that time (I have no idea whether or not this is still a record), and spawned and fed various Lenco forums!!

I fought on the bigger audio forums for more than six years now (and it appears the fight still has no end in sight, SIGH, though thanks in part to Salvatore we are definitely getting somewhere) to have both the Lenco and the idlers I considered it represented taken seriously, and now, with the added help of this review, one can see the tone of discussion on forums around the world changing and becoming more serious and accepting (lines on French, English and Asian forums like “Well you KNOW Salvatore has now put it in Recommended Components….”).

So, all you Lenco (and idler) aficionados out there, you have now been vindicated, those who looked at you askance all those years will now (and ARE now) look at you with new respect!! So I, anyway, give Arthur Salvatore a BIG thank you for first taking a chance on an idler-wheel drive when his whole posted history was belt-drive with LOTS of skepticism aimed at the idler-wheel phenomenon, and taking an even bigger chance on the Lenco!! I can only hope that those who claim to be Lenco afficionados will join me in appreciating this great leap of faith and courageous action, and also extend their thanks.

And why not (though I know it irritates many, but what the hey, if I was interested in popularity instead of truth I would never have made it a mission to have the Lencos and idlers taken seriously): Vive la Lenco, Vive la Idler-Wheel!!!

On a more positive note, I'd like to thank all those who offered me encouragement and kind words, both on this thread (Malcolm, Mike, Mike and Mike :-), Terry, Ed, Gene for his enthusiasm (a breath of fresh air), Abill, Jloveys, Hiho, etc.) and those who did so by word or e-mail, thank you all. And to Arthur as well, for his as-always well-chosen words, and I'm sorry they had to be said. And thanks very much Mgreene for your long (though short compared to mine ;-)) address!

So, time to make clear the effectiveness of the timing of the two outcomes - Athens, Arthur - coming together. Across the world, in front of 8 witnesses (only one of which owned a Lenco; counterbalanced by the owner of the EMT 927 who hosted the event), the Lenco was pitted against the EMT 927 (at the low end of the scale worth $25,000, at the high end $40,000). At that event, which I did not attend, the Lenco was judged the winner. One of the attendees was a member of the Audiophile Club of Athens, who himself greatly preferred the Lenco. At the other end of the world, in Florida, the results recently posted. I must have deep pockets indeed to buy off not only Arthur, but the owner of a $40K machine (sitting next to another one, the legendary EMT 950, surrounded by equally legendary equipment), and a member of the board of the ACA, and six other participants!!

And STILL, after all my lengthy explanation of my absolute inability to pay anybody off (a ridiculous and ugly charge AND insinuation even if I had any financial clout), one worm steps right up attempting to spoil the apple, in the clear light of day, to expose himself on several forums. It's embarrassing really, and sad.

But, I confess I LOVE it when someone steps right up to prove my very points, and so I must thank the latest example of "ugly" ("from the honest to the ugly") for underlining my points with SUCH a timely and pointed example, and for, as always is such cases, stimulating discussion to a fever pitch and once again putting the Mighty Lenco to the forefront of everyone's mind, my e-mails have gone mad, this thread is THRUMMING :-)!! To that list I should have added "stupid", hindsight is 20-20!

Anyway, getting back to music, my Athens Shootout was intended first of all to be a gift to the DIYers and Lenco followers who want to get their hands dirty, as it was a classic-plinthed Lenco, with original chassis, and so as original/"pure" as I could risk (when I found out it was an EMT 927 I had to send my new bearing and a mat as this was FAR out of the league I had originally envisaged), to make the point CLEAR as to just how truly great the Lenco is (major changes would otherwise take the credit, leaving the Lenco nowhere and no lesson taught)!! While I won't give out ALL my methods and choices in my current best (in fact I never did, figured DIYers had to figure SOME things out for themselves, being DIYers and all), still, beating an EMT 927 should be good enough for any DIYer, so don't worry, be happy!

It is only secondly and incidentally that it serves as a buttress against the usual ugly attacks (and it's sad that they ARE usual, always another one to step right up and fill in the Ugly Shoes, I'd make a fortune on rentals :-)), as a support.

So to make it unmistakable, once again, for the Gupper (and I realize some got it already, so please bear with me): in Athens, while I was not in attendance, eight witnesses attended a Shootout between an EMT 927 and a Lenco, and the vote went to the small (50 pounds), wooden, and vastly inferior to my Reference, Lenco. Many cognoscenti consider the EMT 927 the ne-plus-ultra of record players, and scoff at the idea that ANY belt-drive at ANY price is fit to be in the same room: I get e-mails from such, and they can afford ANYTHING (these men are to vinyl replay equipment what wine tasters/critics are to wine, and come across as such). In Florida, a greatly improved Lenco (100 pounds, new materials) landed in Salvatore's audio system with the result we all now know. The one finding supports the other, the other supports the one, it is entirely believable and iron-clad. Add to that all the conversions posted on this thread and others, the dedicated Lenco forums, the endorsements by such figures as Roger Hebert of Wyetech Labs.

I think it's safe now to say, FINALLY (and why I waited more than a year to post again), that the Lenco is now secure from such petty-minded attacks (and now the Lenco IS secure the pettiness and ugliness is now exposed for all to see clearly, and Thank God for that, it only took SIX YEARS), that reviewers like Arthur can now step up and treat the Lenco (and Idlers!!) with the proper amount of respect and clear and honest thought, and expect to be treated as if they were reviewing any other quality item, with no fear of unreasoning attack.

So join me all once again (and THIS time - thanks to this timely worm in the apple who gave me the segue I needed to Deliver the Lenco from Evil and free it from any further restraints - I REALLY feel it :-)): Vive la Lenco, Vive la Idler-Wheel!!!!

Hi Win, thanks for the supportive words, it is indeed all about the music, it does my heart good to see someone recognize and fasten on the best drive system to reproduce music from LPs, and then take it as far as he can take it. Don't pay no never mind to my publicist, he's off his meds ;-).

That said, I have to say that laying the earlier misunderstanding at my feet - that it was I who was misrepresenting something so THAT's OK then - evidently doesn't sit well with me. As they say: what am I, chopped liver? I do not write what I don't believe, and I have worked hard to build up an impeccable reputation for honesty, integrity and truth (I make no claims for diplomacy or humility ;-)), without which I could not have succeeded to the extent I did in promoting Lencos and idler-wheels. If I had come across, instead, like some Worm in some apple, the original thread would have died an early death, and there would be no Lenco forums. But as many discovered back then, who had actually decided to find Lencos and actually listen to them before pronouncing on them, nothing nefarious was going on, it was just that, as regards Lencos and idler-wheels, as now also testified and endorsed by Arthur, I was speaking the simple truth. Short form: as Lew said I’m an idealist (NOT a diplomat), Arthur does not have a monopoly on integrity.

It is good to finally see my years-long campaign to focus on the idler-wheel drive system – and the question of drive systems in general - now verified by a specialist audio figure, publicly. Back when I first proposed this Garrard-ers claimed it was some mysterious "Garrard-ness" which was the reason for their greatness (and not some larger reason), and nobody was looking beyond the tips of their noses to the bigger picture but instead simply defending their limited turf: Linnies promoted their Linns, EMT-ers their EMTs, Technics SP-10-ers looked down on other DDs (especially Sonys), Garrard-ers looked down on Lenco-ers (and so bitterly opposed the Lenco movement). Territoriality Uber Alles.

Now, after Arthur's exhaustive and comprehensive analysis, with a tremendous audio and vinyl playback background, he comes to the conclusion, after all, that it MUST be the drive system which explains the Lenco's Greatness. To make the point short: I had no agenda to aggrandize myself (as so many opponents hungry for recognition charged, peddled out so often it has become a sort of dogma by dint of simple repetition – unexamined and unquestioned by the less perspicacious as so many things are), I KNEW something was true, and battled for several years to have it recognized because I knew it was true, nothing else.

Back in 1992, when I first discovered the idler-wheel principle via the cheap little Garrard SP-25 record-changer - a story I've told often - I instantly recognized that the greatness I heard then (which I DID hear), with that crappy little record changer, could only be due to the drive system (there could be no other explanation). That little Garrard awakened me to the fact of the superiority of idler-wheel drive (as Arthur found, it could be nothing else), and I set out, once I had done the research, to find a Garrard 301 or 401. But in those pre-internet days, in Scandinavia, all I could find was a Lenco, accidentally (I didn't know what it was, but I knew it was an idler, and the biggest /heaviest one I'd seen yet). And, a decade on, with time on my hands one day while doing some media analysis, I decided to promote the idler-wheel via the Lenco. I won’t deny that simple mischief also added a fun factor (I later regretted this more than once ;-)).

If you click on my “system” page, posted back in 2004, you’ll find a RATIONAL explanation of why the idler-wheel drive system is superior to the belt-drive system in so many sonic ways: "Idler wheel drives in general were originally designed to overcome stylus drag, as in their day cartridges tracked at 10 grams. As tracking forces diminished, idler-wheel drives became more refined, but retained their resistance to stylus drag. As time went on and VTF dropped to below 2 grams, it was thought stylus drag could be combatted by the simple use of mass, and not the brute force of rumbly idler-wheel drives, which were discredited, even though their rumble figures were in fact better than those of the then-rising Linn LP12." But this was ignored by those who simply preferred to believe otherwise (i.e. they weren’t going to let logic or evidence contaminate their beliefs).

So now I ask you to THINK (I know it's tough ;-): Given I have proven myself repeatedly to be motivated by truth, given I have proven myself to be right again and again, given I have discovered, recognized and promoted umpteen ways to further improve on, AND recognize, the various greatnesses of the Lenco and Idlers in general, that you might, just MIGHT, consider that if I write something, do something, or believe something, that it might be wise to give me a little credit, and think there might be something to it, and not simply dismiss it as dishonest, wrong or stupid or, indeed, a “marketing ploy.” I believe in what I do (as Mosin does in what he does), and I have rational, and tested, reasons for doing so.

Now, I had the temerity to send out a wooden Lenco. AND I had the audacity to use the original Lenco chassis. Remember, I had the temerity and audacity too of claiming, before and against the world in an actual campaign, that belt-drive was not the superior system, that the idler was. So get used to it. The results are out. Use your heads if possible, and without the rhetorical techniques of damning with faint praise (claiming that “of course we knew the Lenco could outperform any belt-drive”). I remember when it was Lenco forum members who were first to jump and say – when a SME 30 owner admitted that the Lenco had superior dynamics and presence (and tacitly admitted it equaled the SME for raw detail) which he judged was colouration – “Of course we know the DIY Lenco cannot outperform state-of-the-art ‘tables, sanity at last (referring to me)!!” I’ve been here quite literally from the beginning and I’ve seen it all of course. There are many things belt-drives and DDs – and other idler-wheel drives - can teach us, like how low a noise floor is possible from vinyl, how much torque or inertia is needed, how short we are on high frequencies, how effective certain materials are, how much imaging information is possible, how significant inertia is in the real world, any number of things which helps us develop idlers – and the Lenco – further. To say simply “of course we knew the Lenco could outperform any belt-drive” shuts you off from an important source of information and thus improvements (until you hear a Forsell, how can you know if you have a shortfall in noise floor, high frequencies or imaging?).

I sent Arthur a wooden Lenco and waited for the outcome (and excuse me Arthur, but Arthur is not easy to deal with, I was on tenterhooks). Now THAT, my friends, is conviction (born of experience/empirical evidence). I also did it so that it would be understood that it was the Lenco (and its drive system), and not some exotic material, which was responsible for the sound (which most certainly would have been the conclusion of any belt-drivers or DD-ers). The results are now posted, the analysis in-depth and complete. I think I have settled the issue of "insurmountable problems" with wood. More particularly, I have demonstrated that a PTP is not necessary to achieve state-of-the-art black backgrounds, and in the process proven the value of Direct Coupling to wood. As Arthur wrote: “As it turned out, the Lenco's sound-floor was basically as low as the Forsell's (which has an air-bearing platter). In fact, I couldn't distinguish them. Since the Forsell had the lowest sound-floor I ever experienced, the Lenco's (highly welcome) achievement in this area is both surprising and unexplainable (at this time).”

There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, than are dreamt of in your philosophy. Likewise there are more woods than simple birch-ply and mdf, more ways of assembling them, more ways of extracting the best from them: practically-speaking, an infinite number of ways and combinations of materials. They can be “tuned” for astounding performance, supreme tonal accuracy, complete freedom of dynamics (something you would learn, if you bothered to listen to, and respect, the best of belt-Drive, DD, Idler, and so know what to shoot for). There's more than one way to skin a cat.

Sorry for such a long post, but I’ll soon stop posting altogether, and simply set up a website (not a forum, mind you, I’m tired of infestations) and so free myself to devote more time to work and life. Speaking of cats, I’ll be back with the story of the Balinese cats, plinths, and how perfection is not possible – or allowed – on earth. But I’m not in a hurry.

I'll soon be gone from forums (I'm sure this will be a relief for many :-)), time to enjoy life and get on with other things, I hope that some of you at least enjoyed the ride. Enjoy your Idlers all!!!

WHAT I DID WITH STRING, SARAN WRAP AND PENNIES

I was sitting at home during an extreme cold snap (similar to today’s extreme cold snap which is why I’m writing this :-)) which made it impossible for me to work in my workshop, and so I decided, FINALLY, to address the issue of that damned Lenco idler-wheel spring. Pay attention now y’all as I’m about to provide the Keys to Paradise, a MAJOR upgrade to the Lenco’s sound and overall performance regardless of implementation/flavour, to all Lenco aficionados, DIYers and client/buyers alike. The “competition”, already living in fear of the Lenco, will have the bar raised - overall performance - quite a bit further, heh-heh.

So let me tell you about the TJN Mod (named pithily in remembrance of the fab Twl Mod for the Rega tonearms which was popular back at the start of the original Home Despot thread) which you can either fabricate/cobble yourselves extremely cheaply (as I’ll explain in some detail), or simply order entire as a kit later (dependent on availability/time). It’s been at the back of my mind for years, but since the Lenco is so amazing I never got around to actually testing it out, thank the cold spell.

As I’ve written since the beginning in the Long Ago and Far Away (i.e. since my first attempt to start the Idler-Wheel Revolution), the reason the Lenco is such a sonically-amazing record player is not Magic Lenco Fairy Dust as some seem to want to believe, but simple engineering: torque from the combination of a powerful motor married to an amazing flywheel-platter via a delicate idler wheel and the resulting speed stability, a great resistance to the braking action of the stylus in the groove, friction, otherwise known as Stylus Force Drag.

BUT, this whole scenario depends on that damned little spring (the motor too, but that’s not at issue here). Now, I’ve rebuilt some 100+ Lencos (and others) over the years (remember I rebuilt quite a few in a variety of ways/styles/materials before ever starting the A’gon Home Despot thread) and very often any problems which come up are due to that damned little spring. Usually the issue is a tired spring, meaning it has lost its force and so the Lenco’s overall torque is severely compromised and, as demonstrated to and verified by Salvatore, leads to a serious loss of detail, SLAM, PRaT, dynamics, and so on (even imaging!). It can also lead to serious “wobbling” at higher speeds, like 45 rpm, where the wheel simply doesn’t engage reliably.

The fix to this was to snip off a few loops of the spring to make it tighter, but one had to be careful, because if the spring was shortened too much then all sorts of weird noises and grindings and bindings would occur: the force of the spring needed was pretty exact: not enough, and a serious loss of performance, too much and various problems. Add in to this that it is very likely, after all these years, that ALL Lencos are performing sub-par due to tired springs (unless NOS).

Furthermore, looking at how the spring operates on the Lenco, it is evident that, even given a spring which has all its original force intact, that it draws the idler-wheel arm closer to the motor shaft the higher the speed chosen. Which means that the higher the speed, the shorter the spring. Which means that the spring is not drawing with as much force at 45 rpm as it does at 33 rpm. Which means that the performance/sound, given “perfect” spring force at 33, will be lesser at 45 rpm than at 33 rpm. And this is assuming that the exact amount of force needed for 33 rpm actually exists.

Finally, let’s admit that the spring is a spring, which means that it is spring-Y. This means that, being a spring, it is always springing, i.e. stretching and contracting. Can you see where this is heading? It is behaving exactly like those rubber belts in belt-drives (which consequently many now replace with thread etc.) I started attacking back in the beginning, meaning that the performance, regardless of an optimized spring, is always, to a certain extent, as verified by Salvatore, being compromised. Now it is obvious that the Lenco spring DID work as the Lenco’s speed stability relative to pretty well everything else is clearly audible in transient speed, bass power, reach and detail, dynamics macro and micro, detail period, etc. Which is why the Lenco, essentially unknown, unrecognized and reviled only 6-7 years ago, now stands high along with the Garrards, EMTs, and top belt-drives of today.

So you can see why I think of it as That Damned Little Spring. Especially given the heights to which I’ve brought the Lenco, which made that Damned Little Spring all the more galling, since my end results depended so much on it, a major weakness and so problem (i.e. in almost every case – not all - a problem with the Lenco can be traced to That Damned Little Spring).

But what if we could ensure optimal performance of the Lenco, all the time, at every speed, with utter stability and dependability, forever!!??!!

So, up opened the Mighty TJN R&D Laboratory. I took out scissors, Saran Wrap, pennies (being in Canada, Canadian pennies) string, and a drill bit. The intent was to measure the force of the spring, which I measured in grams. I needed a cradle which had no weight, hence the Saran Wrap (this message brought to you by Saran Wrap TM :-)!!!) and string. Doing some research, I discovered that all Canadian pennies minted between the year 2000 and today weigh in at 2.35 grams. So, I cut a square of Saran Wrap (doubled for strength), poked a hole at each of the four corners, knotted string at each to form a weightless cradle, and suspended it from the spring. I started to pile in the year 2000+ Canadian pennies until I reached an amount which seemed not to drag on it too much, but enough to cause it to stretch comfortably. I counted the pennies, then multiplied the amount by 2.35 grams. Ta-Da, a precise amount, double-checked via a postal scale.

I then drilled a hole in the Lenco, beyond the motor in the same general direction as That Damned Little Spring post but in a place where it would not interfere with motor or plinth, and inserted one of the brass, rounded inserts which originally held the on-off switch, to ensure the string was not catching on any edges to give me a false reading. I then ran the string through the brass insert and, cutting off the spring so that only one loop remained (so no springing), hooked the string to the loop/idler-wheel arm so that it was tied to the idler-wheel arm, the other end hanging below the motor. The Lenco itself was sitting high above the floor on stilts so I could have access to the cradle (see photo of the experiment under my “System” page).

I piled the pennies in and turned the Lenco on. BAM the platter started up, and the silence was astonishing. That Damned Little Spring makes noise too; The Glorious Little String does not :-). I checked the torque by hand as I always did when optimizing That Damned Little Spring and the torque was amazing. I added pennies and subtracted them to test torque at various pressures, even pulling on the string/cradle to add pounds of force weight to see if I could increase torque/speed stability. The end result of all this was that after a surprisingly small amount of weight/pressure/force, there is no increase in torque. Not enough and there is a very definite decrease in torque. Too much and not only is there no increase in torque, but there will be undue wear on the wheel and strain on the motor.

If there’s something I’ve learned in my years of participating in and reading internet forums, it’s that for every idea/result someone will rise up to say Nay, and someone else will rise up to Defend, regardless of the worth or not of the idea. So, I’m not going to give anyone a hook to attack and criticize my results by publishing the optimum weight I’ve arrived at, as I know from experience someone wanting attention will say “It is not enough, I’ve come up with better weight” and someone else will rise up and say “It is too much, I’ve come up with a better weight.” Then armed camps will rise up and the X-weighters will oppose the Y-weighters, and the thing will go the way these things always do, in an increasing fracturing of the Brotherhood I had naively in mind when I started on A’gon (I gave up on that idea as, evidently, impractical nonsense).

So I’ll give pointers now on design of a cheap DIY TJN Mod, and leave you all to it. To those who want a finished kit-form TJN Mod, with threaded insert for secure bolting to the Lenco chassis with rounded lip which raises the string to the level of the arm (so pulling at a perfect 90-degree lateral angle at X-gram force) and which extends to below the motor so there is no fouling of the string/weight possible, machined brass weight with hole, measures string with hooks at both ends and template so you find the exact position on your chassis, contact me, I haven’t yet decided on a price, but it will be about $60. For those who will inevitably rise up and scream WHAT, so expensive???!?? I remind you I don’t use 13-year old children in sweat shops in Asia, but a locally-based European machinist who has made reality my exacting and precise and practical and simple design, using real and pricey metals, then there’s my own time an materials.

So here’s the instructions to the TJN Mod, look at my photo too. I had first contemplated plastic fishing line for the thread due to its low friction, but decided that plastic, being hard, would transmit vibrations, and given the extreme silence and “mushiness” of simple string, decided on cotton thread on the same principle (I rejected polyester thread based on this same principle). Find the spot on your Lenco which doesn’t interfere with your motor or scrape against the inner platter. I used the brass insert which comes with the original Lenco on-off switch due to its rounded/smooth edges, it’s a 5/16th inch hole, so small and easy to drill (I use this same diameter for my kit for this same reason), but you can use something along the same idea somewhere else, have a blast. Cut the spring to the last loop so that there is no longer any springing, it’s convenient and easier than stringing directly to the idler-wheel arm, it only has to pull with a certain force expressed in grams which, being a weight subject to gravity, it will do with Supreme and Eternal Reliability (WARNING: do NOT take the Lenco into outer space and expect the same results). I use fish hooks at both ends which I snip so that there is no risk of blood spilled, After finding the weight you like best, simply hook your weight (which can be glued-together pennies, or a bolt and nuts or or or…, just be sure it’s not scraping your plinth or motor) from the other end.

Even if certain of you don’t agree, for whatever reason (as is almost certain to occur) that the TJN Mod is a sonic improvement, be aware of the other issue, that being that That Damned Little Spring will be gone, to be replaced with something which will NEVER wear out or get loose or tired and will ALWAYS work with exactly the same force you’ve determined is ideal at every speed, FOREVER. Now THAT’s peace of mind :-).

In MY current set-up, which is, for the moment, a Koetsu Black mounted to a Triplanar mounted to my Reference Lenco with spring already optimized (prior to the TJN Mod), I noticed the following things: first of all, the utter silence of the mechanism itself, which now always works. Sonically, previous to the TJN Mod, I had found this set-up a tad on the polite side, both the Triplanar and the Koetsu being on the more polite/rolled-off-highs side of things compared with other tonearms and cartridges. But, after the mod, suddenly the Triplanar/Koetsu combo sounded much more incisive, with even quicker transients and more extended and aggressive – in a GOOD way (more defined and forceful) – high frequencies. The bass gained in power and detail in the bass is amazing (it was already excellent via the Triplanar/Koetsu combo). PRaT/timing has become much more exciting still (already very good), an album which I had worn out in terms of interest – Kraftwerk’s Electric Café which I had indeed played previously on this combo (one of my test records) – became once again rivetting with much more SLAM and excitement, in fact it was SO good that for the first time in years I had to sit entranced through the whole album. Finally, and since the Triplanar/Koetsu combo is relatively recent I can’t be sure, but while listening I realized that there seemed to be no surface noise from LPs I knew were noisy: I suddenly sat up and thought “Where the heck did the surface noise go??!!” Did it disappear the moment I set up the Triplanar/Koetsu, or did the TJN Mod do it? Further testing and results ahead.

Needless to say, all my Lenco reconstructions will from now on include the TJN Mod. Those who want a nice kit ready to go with all issues already addressed contact me via my website at www.idler-wheel-drive.com.

All those who have had various Shootouts and have come to certain conclusions prepare to seriously revise upwards!! Enjoy the Mod all!!!! And for the Gupper: Vive la Lenco, Vive la Idler-Wheel!!!!

The pennies are for purposes of the experiment only, I thought this was clear: "After finding the weight you like best, simply hook your weight (which can be glued-together pennies, or a bolt and nuts or or or…" and "To those who want a finished kit-form TJN Mod, with threaded insert for secure bolting to the Lenco chassis with rounded lip which raises the string to the level of the arm (so pulling at a perfect 90-degree lateral angle at X-gram force) and which extends to below the motor so there is no fouling of the string/weight possible, machined brass weight with hole,..."

I am NOT pitching this kit to make money, at this price it's barely worth my while to go to the post office, it's only intended as a public service to help SERIOUSLY improve the Lenco sonics around the globe to, as I wrote, cause more Lenco fireworks/importune the competition, be it DD, belt or other idler, and again I say: heh-heh :-). I encourage those who want to roll up their sleeves and have some fun to do so, I mean really. Of course the kit will be standard in all my models, this is too fundamental and important.

Nevertheless, unless you intend on pushing it or operating it in a high wind, it will not start to swing in any physically-meaningful way. A related issue is finding the precise mass which will exert the most pressure, and so be the most difficult to move, without straying over into so much you start to wear out the wheel and cause various mechanical problems: anyone who has tried to substitute for the original, let's remember VERY delicate spring, with a stiffer one knows this simply doesn't work.

No physical system on the face of this planet is perfect, including the TJN Mod, but the EXTREMELY simple weight on a string substitution is SO much superior to the spring (and I'm talking not only mechanically but also sonically) - and, it will be found due to its extreme simplicity and effectiveness superior to any other solution - it is astonishing that in the seven years since this whole thing started, no one has thought of it. And I believe no one has because as a rule, people are far too impressed by the unnecessarily difficult, the unnecessarily complex (for this reason it's a large component in many audio manufacturers' marketing), and have forgotten about simple results, simply achieved. Effectively, it was so obvious and simple it was invisible.

This spring issue, as demonstrated to and witnessed by Salvatore (a virtual doubling of sound quality) is much more FUNDAMENTAL to the operation of the Lenco than any plinth and so on questions, which FOLLOW, not lead (i.e. it is the fundamental Lenco engineering - powerful FAST motor, flywheel-platter, idler-wheel - which makes it great, without this, the best plinths in the world & etc. applied to a belt-drive will only result in another so-so belt-drive).

So getting back to it: silicone baths and what-not are not necessary, do you see anti-bias weights on far more sensitive tonearms (in terms of importance/sensitivity to vibrations etc.) bathing in silicone fluid? Let's stick with my leading principle since forever, the KISS principle, the reason the Lenco itself is so great: Keep It Simple, Stupid. Not intended as an insult, but simply a good motto, especially in engineering.

I won't give out the precise weight/force I found optimal due to the reasons given - and already I can see all sorts of unnecessary side issues will end up dominating and eclipse the beauty of this simple solution - anyway self-respecting DIYers should embrace this chance at a fun experiment and DIYelves :-)!!

So let's get back to it: the TJN Mod is a weight on a string (KISS), and that string does not transmit vibrations, contract or expand, simple, effective, forever, and the weight, being a simple weight, will always hang with the same mass/force, steadily, since gravity does not vary on the surface of this planet, and string is not a spring. Those who implement it will have a GREAT improvement, those who don't won't.

So have fun y'all, I'll be leaving now and won't be back for quite a while, as a customer of mine always says, Roger & Out.

Thanks for all the reports everyone - Mike, Barry, John, Terry - and all those who have been trying it out and reporting in on various forums, I appreciate your posting all!! This is better than theorizing in the utter absence of evidence, no?

In fact a version of this very experiment was carried out and reported on by Salvatore in his initial analysis of the weak vs strong spring on his Reference Lenco: the ONLY element changed in his system was the tightness of the spring on his Reference Lenco, which, as he reported, doubled the sound quality in his system. So the ONLY conclusion that could be drawn was that the amount of force applied to marrying the wheel to the motor-platter interface was of EXTREME importance to delivering the motor's torque.

This is the whole point of an experiment: devise an experiment to prove - or disprove - a theory, and accept the results. This is why I went on and on about science and the scientific method in early days: because the then-ubiquitous belt-drivers (much less ubiquitous now :-)) would not accept evidence of the superiority of the idler-wheel drive system or the serious high-end quality of the Lenco. They dismissed any evidence as anecdotal (to those espousing ANY theory all evidence it is wrong is "anecdotal" and all evidence supporting that theory is "proof"), so I devised a way - the original thread - to give them 1000 anecdotal results, "anecdotal" THAT! Ditto the TJN Mod.

As I wrote earlier, the TJN Mod was too important to keep to myself - and too simple, effective and elegant (no complex electro-mechanical solution to this problem will ever match what this little string and weight does with utter reliability and stability for as long as Gravity operates in the Newtonian universe) and most of all IMPORTANT to keep to myself and my own work. Every Lenco owner owes it to himself, or herself, to implement this mod, as it "completes" the heart of the Lenco: its drive system (without it the Lenco is just another record player).

This also proves what I have been saying since the very beginning back when I started the original thread: it is TORQUE which makes the Lenco - and other idler-wheel drives - superior. With the TJN Mod installed torque can be felt to increase, and with an increase in torque - precisely what Salvatore reported in an experiment where the ONLY element changed was spring tightness - comes roughly a doubling of the sound quality.

So, stripping the results of the experiment down to its barest essentials: more torque - and torque stability and so speed stability - equals more information-retrieval, more detail, better separation of instruments, better soundstaging, better low frequencies (lower, tighter, more detailed) better high frequencies (more extended and at the same time more natural with less distortion) better dynamics micro and macro (greater focus, greater speed).

A cautionary note to the usual suspects who tend to equate simply running endlessly in the same direction of a pre-existing already discovered idea with true progress (200-pound platters on the way, I have a lot to say about THIS subject soon with, as always, proof, engineers seem to have forgotten grade-school physics - keep your eyes peeled all): don't start hooking up 200 HP motors to your idlers, as with the spring mod weight - which reaches maximum torque at a surprisingly low weight/mass - so the torque necessary to push the LP through stylus force drag in the better idler-wheel drives (their motors ARE relatively enormous) was accurately calculated by the '50s (and earlier) engineers, they had not forgotten their grade-school physics ;-).

So, getting back to the results of the latest experiment: More torque = clearly better sound, and what better system to deliver this torque than the idler-wheel drive system with their massive motors and decoupled wheels (which makes use of massive motors advisable), which, as Salvatore reported, given Direct Coupling, achieves low noise floors to equal top belt-drives: massive torque without sonic penalties!! Now THOSE were engineers!! If someone came up with the decoupled idler-wheel/massive motor idea NOW - against a background of direct-drives, direct rim-drives and belt-drives - the whole analogue world would be set on its ear, gasp and cry Sheer Genius!!!!

Get Ye out all Ye Lenco users and show the world what an optimized idler-wheel drive system can really do!! Vive la Lenco, Vive la Idler-Wheel!!!! Next time I'll come back (it'll be a while) with yet more fun in the world of science, physics and spinning LPs, maybe that platter mass thingy :-).

I have to add my own admiration for a gorgeous plinth Kim. And what a MONSTER!! Just goes to show that patience is indeed a virtue ;-). Fascinating account as well, great reading! Too bad that beauty will be sailing away, good luck on the Russco project. Keep adding to the idler repertoire!! Great to see the Son of Da Thread doing so well and off to a great start. A testament to the Power of the Idler and to all participants so far, and with thanks to Mario!

Up here I have been slowly settling into a new rhythm with energies directed in other directions and new routines forming, but this doesn't mean the Mighty Lenco Master had no lessons for me since I last posted! On the old thread I had acquired an Audio Research SP-8 and was struggling with speaker-room issues. I tore apart my listening room/living room several times re-organizing so I could get larger speakers with deeper bass to work well in there, which I finally did. Now all my larger speakers - the Athena Technologies S3's, the ESS AMT4's and the AR2ax's - all sound beautiful with deep, tight, powerful, slamming and PRaTful bass. I am also trying a relatively easy to implement perhaps-large improvement to the Lenco which I'll describe further if indeed it is an improvement (the Mighty Lenco is so good it is sometimes hard to tell if one has achieved an improvement!).

What I discovered recently with the new soundroom/speaker combo is something I will call the Kundalini Effect, after the mystic serpent which is said to lie coiled at the base of our spines: Kundalini. In living with the Denon DL-103E installed on the SME V mounted in turn on my own Giant Direct Coupled Lenco (which doesn't look so giant now I've got a gander at Kim's Lenco ;-)), and with the addition of my deep-bass speakers (Athenas and AR2ax's), I reached yet another and deeper level of musical bliss: whereas I was getting used to the hairs rising up on my arms and the occasional fit of shivers with my smaller Yamahas, with the introduction of deeper bass I now found myself often experiencing intense muscular spasms starting at the base of my spine and working its way up to my scalp, like "ordinary" shivers, but far more intense (and I mean this literally) when playing many of my records. Now the goosebump/hair-raising experience is rare enough in audio and as intense an audio experience as I've ever had in my life, but NEVER have I felt these intense spasms from the base of my spine all the way to my scalp! AND this is repeatable through both the Athenas and the AR2ax's. Though I attribute this in part to the tremendously musical ARC SP-8 (which is in audiophile terms superior to my Sony, but this is not why I'm keeping it: it's because of its intense musical POWER) and to the re-organization of my room, what I believe is happening is that the Lenco - and all good idler-wheel drives - retrieves musical energy and information in the bass which is quite simply lacking in belt-drives, and in such a fashion (gestalt, flow) that is also superior - at least for now - to Direct Drive. As with my arguments in older days that PRaT and musicality were not subjective but due to some technical aspect of vinyl engineering/replay detectable by our biological makeup (i.e. superior speed stability), so I believe that these physical/biological effects have some technical reason as well, and yes, once again it is superior speed stability, for which some elegant high-torque system is needed (i.e. idler-wheel drive). In short, until you've heard the Lenco (or other Mighty Idler-Drive) via a speaker with serious bass, you don't know just how powerful a listening experience it can be! Though My Yamahas are excellent "mini-monitors" (though quite large and with surprising bass nevertheless), they cannot offer the experience both my Athenas and my AR2ax's can offer: like the difference between looking at a Playboy magazine, and being at a Playboy Mansion party!! Now the Kundalini Effect may or may not be partly due to the new mod I'm trying out, I'll be back later this week with a full report.

Which brings me to the Acoustic Research 2ax's...High-End Audio On a Budget Alert!!!: these speakers are quite simply awesome, and deserve to be ranked - despite their clunky "it can't be" looks - with the likes of Quad ESL57's and LS3/5A's. Cheap too, as most are fixated on the famous AR3a’s, which reputedly aren’t as fast as the 2ax’s and speed is essential in caputring the razor-sharp transients and SLAM of good idlers. Sorta like the Lenco story ;-). In my new soundroom, they combined the extreme neutrality of my Yamahas with the musical exuberance of my Athenas (and in musical exuberance/magic, the Athenas are simply unbelievable). And they trump the Athenas in terms of SLAM and bass POWER.

The story is this: I had already settled on the ARs as being the best-suited to my new room, and decided to get off my lazy ass and finally finish the restoration. I bought new Solen caps for the crossover (simple, a 4uf and 6uf cap apiece), and took apart the pots to deep-clean them with an electronics cleaner and a stiff horsehair brush. These pots are works of engineering art as well: meant to be taken apart with a ceramic seat and a coil inset over which copper contacts rotate to give the correct resistance, it is also built so that there is only one way to re-assemble it, so it is foolproof AND lasts forever (like certain vintage idlers)! Before this, I had already had them re-foamed, as I bought them with rotten foam for 10 bucks at a garage sale. Anyway, now they are restored, the bass is quite simply unbelievable, as they aren't all that big (23 3/4" H x 13 1/2" W x 11 1/2" D), the smallest near-full-range speakers ever made. But more than just deep, the bass and percussion especially (which includes piano) emerges with lightning speed and with the heft of a wrecking ball, I confess I've never heard anything like it. Of course, having a Lenco helps ;-). And more than this, they are very neutral, image very well, have beautiful smooth highs (despite having the most primitive dome tweeters, these being the first on the market) and have excellent detail (a dedicated dome midrange). In comparison to the Athenas, they are far more neutral, in fact the MDF Athenas are the only boxy-sounding speakers I have, all the rest - being made of chipboard one and all - sound clear and clean. Which points the finger at MDF, the true reason for its near-ubiquitous use is the fact it is easily machined and finished, chipboard is simply a better material for speaker cabinets (this doesn’t apply to plinths, where MDF’s superior mass is required to keep the size down, though feel free to build total house-dominating monsters :-)). In fact, I intend to rebuild my Athena speaker cabinets in hefty chipboard (1 ½”), and get rid of that boxiness (this boxiness being relative to my very-neutral collection of speakers, the ESS being seemingly made of cement ;-)).

So, while the AR's don't have the delicacy of the Quads or the scary-real vocals of the LS3/5As, they are leagues ahead of either in terms of bass SLAM, reach and POWER (and yes, bass detail), AND in any sort of percussion/power/speed/slam (including piano) up into the midrange, while being nevertheless surprisingly detailed and neutral across the frequency range. This explains the Kundalini Effect, a faithful communication of yet another Mighty Lenco Master lesson! Anyway, as with the Lenco, many would dismiss these claims due to the AR's age (designed in the Sixties, but the Quad ESL57s are older) and lack of PR, and as with the Lenco, they would be mistaken. Highly recommended for those assembling a high-end system on a budget, and despite the budget aspect (likely less than a hundred bucks), still superior to many current high-end speakers in many ways (especially that wrecking-ball lightning slam and power). A couple of well-heeled audiophiles came over visiting last week, and freely admitted I was extracting far more from the little Yammies than they were from their expensive high-end gear (they didn't know what to attribute to what, but were shaken). They LOVED the Athenas, being the good sort of audiophile who simply accepts what they hear without contaminating status/money issues (and it isn't easy not to defend what one owns simply for the fact of owning it), true music-lovers. And they haven't yet heard the far-superior AR2ax's.

So that’s this rant for now, I’ll again absent myself and return to my cave to get on with other things, just had to report these experineces and discoveries! Here’s a pic of one of my Lencos, built for an MG-1 air-bearing tonearm and featured on the MG-1 website. Unlike Kim, I cheated :-): while I built and designed the plinth, the fellow I built it for has a professional cabinet-maker father who did the finishing: http://airtech.atspace.com/mg1lenco.jpg. I’ll be adding it to my system page with explanations, along with one I built specifically for the humungous JMW 12.5i tonearm (for the designer of truly High End award-winning amps and preamps I'm hoping to introduce you to in future, Lenco ownership evidently still being dangerous), done in a high-gloss red-wine lacquer by a professional lacquerer, which should serve as an aid for those contemplating a Lenco for the cumbersome (oversized bass) JMW tonearms. I'll be back when I'm certain of my latest experiments, and in the meantime congratulations to all the idler-drivers past, present and future!! Go Ye Out and Seek the Kundalini Effect.

A local fellow who has asked me to build him a Giant Direct Coupled Lenco has just left after an afternoon of listening, and in leaving (and in the context of an extremely high-end system) admitted to me that the day he first heard one of these rebuilt Lencos (last summer), was the day he started to hate his Wilson Benesch turntable.

Oh yes, the Lenco is Mighty, but I have some bad news to impart to all Lenco followers, and Yea, it is this: the Lenco is severely coloured. Yea and Woe!! In every system I hear it in - and I get the opportunity to hear it in many in my favourite sport, Crush the Belt-Drive (and my second-favourite sport, Crush the DD) - the sound of a Lenco is unmistakable. In fact, every time I hear it in a different context I laugh as I hear the Unmistakable Ingredient, the sonic signature of the Mighty Lenco. What is this colouration, this sonic signature?!? It is the Ultra-Fluid, Unstoppable quality/character, the sound of perfect speed, like the flowing of the Amazon into the Atlantic at full flood. It is the sound of transients perfectly captured, of the utterly natural presentation of unthinkable and unbelievable amounts of detail, thus managing the very difficult trick of not sounding particularly detailed, but instead simply like the music it is playing. It is the sound of large-scale dynamics growing at the speed of light, limitless, when required, of all the little micro-dynamics, which nail the organization, perfectly preserved and retrieved. It is the sound of a perfect image, with TONS of atmosphere, of endless decays and echoing chambers, of air moving, changing pressure, expanding and contracting. It is the sound of intense musicality squeezed out of even the worst recordings (especially if the artist, like Nina Simone, is truly great). This colouration, O Lenco Followers, is this: Perfection. Yes, the Lenco sound SO perfect it is almost a violation of the laws of physics, which allows no perfection in this, the physical world. And every time I hear it, there it is, unmistakable, the sound of a Lenco, and I laugh as it pierces through the masking influence of alien systems and makes itself known, whatever the context. Incredible. Sorry to have steered you all down this path of severe colouration, this sound our brains scream is impossible, and which thus always manages to amaze us, through the years without stop, my apologies.

And my apologies as well to those belt-drivers who have sunk huge amounts of dosh into their sources, as they are eventually going to have to face the music, so to speak, face the Mighty Lenco, as I send them out to do battle in no-holds-barred systems, in the systems of designers, in the systems of distributors, in the systems of retailers and in the systems of the well-heeled (or simply obsessive) and make the point. My ambassadors are Out There (there's more than one way to skin a cat, in the face of unscientific political correctness which makes the following Statement of Faith, no different from religion: I BELIEVE all systems are equivalent - not I KNOW all systems are equivalent, an impossible statement to make truthfully, since the fellows peddling this have not tested the claim), and they'll eventually be knocking at your door. Welcome it in, you can only gain. That nagging voice that tells you, no matter how far up the ladder of belt-drive-ness you've climbed, "something is yet missing", will be vindicated, but the answer will be there: Lenco (or Idler-Wheel).

So, to answer your question Easytune, if you click under my "system" you will see at the top of my list the first Lenco I ever rebuilt, in which I indeed, due to all the propaganda about noise, built with the motor completely removed from the top-plate. But, it turned out, the whole noise issue was grossly exaggerated, and was due also to improper set-up. When I started the original thread, I wanted the design as simple as it could be in order to gather fellow experimenters, and in the process discovered myself that it was not necessary to remove the motor. In fact, I discovered mass and Direct Coupling (the two go together) make a FAR larger difference to the sound, and make such acrobatics as split plinths moot (as the annihilation of the low-mass two-tier Cain & Cain plinth by my single high-mass plinth makes clear). In addition, the least difference in the geometry of the motor relative to the workings will be detrimental to the sound. Nevertheless, until I started the original thread, I had listened to my two-tier Lenco for close on 12 years. Of course, everyone is free to design as they wish, it's your baby, and the Lenco will not disappoint, as its essential ingredients will remain, all tied to its amazing speed stability (which, however, improves by Direct Coupling to a high mass).

Hi David, your Audiogon "system" is a hoot, I was rolling on the ground as I clicked on each different item listed to find in each case a photo of a Lenco!! For a Good Time, click on Gilbodavid's "system" :-)!

Greetings from Jerusalem all! I am here, and can you believe it, the Lenco is still stuck in Cypriot Cutsoms, as untouchable as the Ark of the Covenant (seems appropriate, considering where I am). Lenco-wise, this trip has been a daily logistical nightmare and disaster, I waited three weeks on Cyprus in the hopes of setting up the Lenco, and finally threw in the towel, and will spend the next three weeks travelling this part of the world - Israel, Egypt, perhaps Jordan - before returning to Cyprus in the hopes that by then all the items will be together for the set-up and review. I've had to extend my Lenco voyage, and of course, the earliest available flight back is...Sept. 11th.

In all the nightmares, confusions, late deliveries I have to thank - PROFUSELY - two individuals: George Karaolides on Cyprus, and John Thomson back in my home town. George, when I was desperate thinking that none of the associated hardware necessary for the review - which was being handled by others generously contributing phono stage, tonearms and etc. - would arrive, answered my plea for help (to source the necessary items if none did show up), picked me up at the airport in Larnaca at 3 am, and helped me out and introduced me to the audio movers and shakers on Cyprus and elsewhere (very well connected). He also entertained me for much of the three weeks, and through him I got to know the secret life of Nicosia, very fasinating. For instance, he took me for a beer one night across the Green Line into Turkish controlled Nicosia, after which it became my habit to have my coffee on the Greek side, and takle my lunch in the caravanserai on the Turkish side, my hotel being only twenty minutes walk away great fun. He will have some idler tales to tell, but for now it will remain a mystery.

John Thomson - "vinylcanuck" on eBay, the source of much of my vinyl and my master turntable packer, not to mention avid Lenco Lover and now owner of my Garrard plinth - handled the sale of much of my collection of audio goodies to fund this venture, and collected moneys owed to me, as I left on a shoestring with insuffient funds and a prayer. At every step (from Athens where I landed via the islands to Cyprus where I finally ended up) it looked like I would be forced to return to Canada, and John came through, wiring me the moneys to allow the continuance. He also took a looonnnng drive out to the country to my abode to dig out my RS-A1 from storage and ship it in time for the review (more misunderstandings), should it ever happen.

Finally, I have to thank the still-shadowy distributor helping me out in this venture, as well as ESELAB, whose identity will be made clear in the review - again should it ever happen ;-). He is a great fan of the Lencos, hence his participation. And of course I have to thank Srajan Ebaen at 6moons for handling all this, and most of all for giving me/us/the Lenco the chance!

With all the negativities so far in this trip (relating to the Lenco, the trip itself a fabulous adventure), it's no surprise the Yahoos, baboons and hyenas on VA continue to sling mud and deny the evidence - as all good Yahoos do - of three years and more of Mighty Lenco success, of the rise of dedicated forums and the creation of special sections in pre-existing forums, and even more, the creation and manufacturing of specialised top-plates to further realize the Great Lenco Potential. VPIs have fallen and been sold off in numbers, as have Linns, Well Tempereds, various Nottinghams, and so on. Even EMTs - the one thing Status-Conscious prejudiced Garrarders (which is NOT to say ALL Garrarders are this way, but many, some very well-known on Yahoo Asylum) quake, quiver and fawn before (of course, because of the price/Status).

Using the principles developed in Da Original Thread and this one, a Giant Direct Coupled Garrard whooped the ass of a top-of-the-line Platine Verdier, which a low-mass Cain & Cain plinth could not touch. Remember all, the Mighty Lenco is merely a tool (being cheap, and this is the real reason for the attacks, not to mention lowly envy/personal attacks/gadflies) to make the Greatness of the Idler-Wheel Drive known, and this has been a tremendous success, despite the Yahoo (not as in the organisation but as in Jonathan Swift's feces-slinging tree-living cretins) Forum's endless efforts to stop the Mighty Lenco Machine. I fought tooth and nail a couple of years back on that forum and others to have both the Lenco and idlers recognized, and encouraged them all to try their hand at it and roll their own: a matter of public record and easily verified by combining my moniker there - "melomane" (music/sound lover) - with various combinations (Lenco, idler, etc.). But of course, Yahoos and dog packs aren't interested in the truth, they merely follow the leader and like Mandrill baboons, let their aggression control what there is of their brains. Men (meaning thinking people), on the other hand, would investigate before unquestioningly playing the old dog pack routine. I'll return to battle another day, as demonstrated by the post/reply which Audiogon deleted a while back when one of these characters dared to post one of his ugly remarks on this very thread (and to those who asked for a copy, sorry I didn't save it ;-)). George related to me a Cypriot joke: "Hey Nikos, Pandelis is going around town bad-mouthing you to whoever will listen, what's the story here?" Nikos: "I don't know, I can't recall doing anything good for him lately."

This behaviour is destructive, the whole "attack the Lenco/idler thing" which was pretty well dead two years ago after the many vicious and endless battles I waged (you'll recognize some characters here who now present themselves as Captain Idlers, for those who want to investigate) has now returned, old issues of rumble and so forth revived. These attacks - based on nothing but prejudice (status/cost, belt vs idler, Garrard vs everything else) and ugly personal feelings (which defines them) - makes those just tuning in, so to speak, and unaware of the history, take these attacks seriously, as if no prejudice/ugliness were involved. This attitude then leads to an undoing of years of work, participation and development.

But in spite of this destructiveness, these tactics have failed, as the idler thing has taken SUCH wing that, what I wrote long ago and which I never thought to come true - to force the indutry to recant and bring back the idler - is actually happening. First of all Teres, which has introduced a rim-drive, but instead of a detached idler-wheel, has mounted the wheel directly to the motor. It is evident the idea is due to the Idler Wheel Revolution, due to the very reasons I wrote down so many times : wheels do not stretch, and they do not react, providing a much stronger motive force. Ironic then, that Teres - which continues to build and sell belt-drives - and considering I used the Lenco/idler comparisons to demonstrate the inherent speed instabilities of belt-drives - claims their new rim-drive does not suffer from the speed instabilities inherent in both belt-drives AND idler-wheel drives.

So let's consider this new rim-drive. Being directly attached to the motor, this invites noise problems, which the idler-wheel (wheel not directly engaged to the motor but stood off) was designed to reduce (in this sense like the belt in belt-drives). This design, in turn, means that a powerful motor such as used in Lencos (1800 RPM and four pounds), Garrards, Rek-o-Kuts and EMTs (ditto) cannot be used. And the wheel itself - not stretching and contracting or slipping - is only half the story. The other half is torque: it takes POWER to overcome the nefarious and dangerous stylus force drag, which is very significant (a ton of pressure per square inch where the stylus meets the groove), and so what you're hearing when you hear a Mighty Lenco, Garrard or other large idler-wheel drive - i.e. speed stability so convincing it is audible as speed stability, incredible dynamics, razor-sharp transients/speed, better imaging, incredible detail retrieval and organization of such, and so on - are the large and powerful motors, designed specifically for the task of overcoming stylus force drag (they were created when tracking pressures were in excess of ten grams). These powerful motors could and can be used due to the idler-wheel. The old boys understood fundamental engineering. Amd more so: an idler-wheel, as it wears down and changes diameter, does not affect speed, which is regulated by the motor pulley and other surface. The Teres rim-drive, in addition to necessitating a less powerful motor, will also change speed as the wheel wears down. In the end, this is still a step in the right direction, they're half-way there, and if they want to compete sonically with true idler-wheel drives, they will eventually have to start producing true idler-wheel drives.

And now Dave Pogue informs me that VPI is also entering into the act, though I don't know the details of this design. It's actually happening fellows, and it's due largely to the Lenco/DIY phenomenon which we started Lo these many years ago! To the pinheads who continue to badmouth the Lenco and attack it, I suggest they get their brains in gear (if possible) and overcome their many [largely status-oriented] prejudices, before the egg on their collective faces drowns continents (already very deep :-)). It is telling, that whenever I offer to bring a Lenco, free of charge, to challenge whatever pet they have decided is the end all and be all, they, to a man, decline. Those who are interested (intellectually curious, open-minded), contact me, not I them, and to a man, convert (and STILL they find, sometimes, excuse to atack the Lenco and go Garrard, etc...status/prejudice again, which shows prejudice is sometimes teflon). In order to preserve the Idler-Wheel Fraternity I have always refused to declare one idler-wheel 'table superior to the other, as doing so leads to the situation on VA/Yahoo Asylum. I have also tried to keep the deisgn simple (which, it turns out, is the superior way), and to showcase/demonstrate my less-than-professional early plinths, so as to encourage the participation of novices and amateurs and bring in large numbers of converts, and to avoid the number-diminishing pissing contests again a feature of Yahoo Asylum. But some day, I may break my silence on this issue. In the meantime, enjoy your idler-wheels all, whichever the type. I look forward to testing out the Rek-o-Kut Rondine when I get back, as I heard true Greatness back when I heard it in mono, over a single tube monoblock and via a sinle Quad ESL-57.

Wish me luck all (I won't post again for a while), and Vive la Lenco, Vive la Idler-Wheel, Vive its Return!!

Thanks for your input Francois, it's been a looooonnnggg time since I played with a Lenco tonearm, the only one I ever rewired was back in '92 when I first discovered the Idler, then found my first Mighty Lenco!! That tonearm I also modified by gluing a better headshell in the front, with epoxy-resin (I found one which fit snuggly into the drilled-out end), and via advertising at the back of British audio mags found the address of Technical & General for new armblocks. The end result was quite good as I recall.

So I guess the MAS tonearm is excellent for reasons all its own ;-). On another budget front, I just cleaned up a Sony 1130 integrated, truly a work of engineering art with matched capacitors and so forth, and it came within a hair of matching the top-of-the-line Sony 2000F preamp/TA-3140F combo which is my current reference!! Lots o fpower too for those looking for audiophile sound and Party Punch on a budget!! Weighs a ton. Have fun all, want to check out my Piezo YM-308 MKII next :-).

Hi all, just to correct certain things, the high frequencies were, as Rick noted, severely rolled-off. I don't believe this was due to the idler mechanism (which flipped and flopped like a drunken sailor as the mechanism simply didn't fit this particular Lenco, coming from another [I had assumed these were all drop-in replacements and until the Shootout, considering how good it was anyway, I never noticed]), but instead more a cable issue. The Clearaudio's (my favourite cartridge of all time, and according to Rick I should never even consider selling it, so an unexpected benefit of this Shootout as well) accompanying graph shows it drops off at 14K, but since most men over 30 have roll-offs at about 13K, this shouldn't make much of a difference. The highs did improve, it seemed to both of us, when I swapped to the JMW, but the cable I made for the JMW was a BIG improvement over the cable I had to concoct for the SME, as well, being direct from the RCAs at one end to the Neutriks at the other. And perhaps switching to Mogamis, as I was considering, or something other than "warm-sounding" Cardas cable, would have made even more of a difference.

Anyway, I think this high-frequency roll-off did much too much to colour the outcome, had they been there, then, in terms of neutrality, the contest would have been much closer. But, the Lenco produced, as-was, only the lowest bass to the lower highs, and so sounded much "warmer" than it should have. So let's not make too much of this warmth and musicality issue (at least for now): in terms of absolute information-retrieval, i.e. raw detail, the two 'tables were actually very close within the frequency range the Lenco did reproduce; and in terms of "ordinary" overall dynamics (I mean apart from the "jumping out" percusssion/palpability factor of the Lenco) the two were actually quite close again. It wasn't a night-and-day slaughter of the SME by the Lenco in this respect, more a matter of degree (significant degree, but still degree). I was frankly surprised by how dynamic and exciting the SME really was. I was also frankly surprised by how deep and powerful the bass was. From the lowest bass through the midrange through to the lower high frequencies, the two 'tables were, in overall audiophile terms (detail, imaging, placement, dynamics, etc.), quite close. So, yes, the Lenco IS more involving, more exciting, and so forth, but don't assume it is far behind the SME 30 in terms of information-extraction (we had to switch back and forth, back and forth, in order to hear what each 'table was picking up and how they presented it, in order to hear what each was doing and judge which was correct, they were so close), this was mostly due to the missing high frequencies which, being simply not present on the Lenco, meant the SME simply picked up some detail, and fleshed-out/brought forward other detail, up here which the Lenco did not. Who knows what the JMW/Concerto would have done, and with better cable?

On the other hand, the SME 30 was powerful, dynamic, with deep controlled bass, in these areas quite close to the Lenco (and in the matter of bass, at least with the SME IV/Concerto combo, its equal, superiority was recording-dependent according to my ears), and not what I was expecting from the reviews I read and the auditioning I did of a SME 20. The Lenco furthered these dynamics somewhat, and added superior timing to my ears. The Concerto is considered extremely musical according to the reviews, and according to my ears is simply the best I have ever heard in this respect, and extraordinary in terms of detail, dynamics, and all the rest. I LOVE it. Perhaps the Concerto was giving the Lenco a further advantage in terms of musicality as well. Maybe switching the Concerto to the SME would have brought the SME some needed PRaT and gestalt, and switching the Benz LP to the Lenco would have brought the Lenco further neutrality, thus bringing the two 'tables closer together in terms of musicality - and neutrality - as well.

Anyway, both these 'tables were superb, the experience was amazing, and I thank Rick again for his time and hospitality. For those who are price-conscious, I suggest you don't get too upset the Lenco is SO cheap, the REAL reason idlers stopped being manufactured is that they were simply too expensive to manufacture (they switched to belt-drive because this was cheap and easy to manufacture). The companies - like Lenco - which produced these at the time were HUGE (LP was king and EVERYONE had an LP spinner), with huge R & D resources, and all was manufactured in-house. How much would it cost to design and produce a Lenco from scratch today? So yes, the Lenco can be picked up for $200 today, but that's used, on eBay, today, and even this price has more to do with perception (so-so) than reality (incredible).

Anyway, have fun all, back to my Concerto!!

Oops, for the photo of the experiment so you can visualize/understand, just click on my "system" under my name.

"Finally, I have gone back to the drawing board, and have rethought and redesigned not only the main bearing, but also the plinth, also to work with the new main bearing, the totality of which not only extracts far more information and energy from the grooves, but more importantly, while preserving and enhancing the Lenco’s magical way with timing and coherence, and simple majesty, all the while sounding much more “natural” and unforced. More news anon."

From my last post, now I guess this is the news here presented, the Lenco I built Arthur Salvatore now - I didn't dare to dream - officially on the Reference Components page in Upper Class A, though there are further details coming, and like some of you out there I am on tenterhooks for the continuing story! Once the full review is out, I'll give my further impressions of how the review came about, and of my visit to Salvatore's sound room, with the phono section of his Jadis preamp wired directly to his amplifiers, the volume control and switches out of the signal path, a demonstration of the extreme audiophile path of preservation of the purity of the signal, which - in spite of 8-watt SETs - resulted in THE most transparent, dynamic, focused and detailed (while preserving musicality) system I have ever had the pleasure of hearing.

Re. the results from Athens, apparently, as I have been writing for more than six years now, it must be pointed out that there is one main reason the Lenco is as good as it is: THE DRIVE SYSTEM. Those who don't want to believe this, go get ye a belt-drive Lenco L85 and see how far modification, replinthing and tweaking will get you. As I wrote back on February 1st, 2004, when the Audio Landscape was completely different and the "Idler Wheel Revolution" was just a dream in my head (still in development ;-)), for those who don't remember their history:

"Do I want to get into the whole idler-wheel drive philosophy and science and so upset hordes of belt-drive maniacs? No! Unless you want an explanation. But consider the history. I personally own many 'tables, some high-end, like the air-bearing Maplenoll which a friend recently dumped his VPI MkIII with Clearaudio parallel-tracking arm for (also considered very highly by Salvatore), some "mid-fi" (but I love them), and some I built myself. The Lencos beat them all. Sugano who builds the Koetsu uses a Garrard 301 idler-wheel drive. The Japanese have been using low-powered tube amps and sensitive speakers for decades while we scoffed, and now we're finding out that there was something to this after all. The Japanese have also been buying up all the heavier Garrard idler-wheel drives they could get their hands on. There are idler-wheel fans all over Europe and North America with high-end systems. Through all this, one highly-regarded 'table which sold in large numbers has been ignored in all the Garrard-fever (and I have owned a number of these Garrards in Europe), and that's the heavy-duty bomb-proof yet elegant Lenco idler-wheel drive. Because of this, it can be had cheap. Forget about rumble figures propaganda, that's what this thread is meant to address. The issue was the wheels themselves, and if you can find a Lenco with the rubber-coated aluminum wheel, then it will be perfect, as I have never yet found one which was flattened. There was a business in England which still sold Lenco wheels only a while ago for roughly $20, I will search this out. The moment someone finds one and buys it, I will proceed with a step-by-step demonstration - with photos - of how to build a high-end 'table. Chipboard and plywood are enough, but feel free to source Corian, acrylic, marble, anything you can get your hands on, as the prime issue is mass. It's easy, even someone who has never used tools can do it. Fun, and you'll end up with a 'table you'll be hard-pressed to match, let alone beat. Those who want to dismiss or object to the idler-wheel technology, please address your objections to Sugano."

I always thought the following was one of the better things I wrote, so here it goes again :-): "Those who want to dismiss or object to the idler-wheel technology, please address your objections to Sugano." Audiophiles all over the world considered Sugano something of an audio god, and yet all turned a blind eye to this apparent aberration of his, preferring to look away than to investigate, which is why I loved tweaking their noses on this subject.

So, that attended to, I must underline the IMPORTANCE of the Athens results and the respect the result demands from Lenco-ites as well as the rest of the world!!: the EMT 927 is an IDLER-WHEEL DRIVE, the REASON the Lenco is so good you would all do well to remember, and NOT coincidentally the KING of all vintage 'tables and, in terms of build quality anyway, the KING of all idlers. It makes the Lenco look like a cheap piece of crap in terms of build quality (though build quality is NOT design, where the Lenco scores BIG). Even the famed fully-blown Shindo Garrard (let alone various lesser rebuilds) must quail (and not in the bird sense ;-)) at the prospect of a Shootout versus this near 150-pound (without plinth) Swiss-made professional studio machine and LEGEND. Which is the reason certain participants of this thread, and others, have tried to bury Lenco vs EMT successes (there have been others). So, that explained, we have GREAT reason for celebration, as the Lenco - in close to stock form (plinth excepted of course) - has received TWO sets of graduation papers: judgment vs the KING of all idlers (and unless you've heard an EMT idler, which is a borderline frightening experience, you are not fit to judge, dismiss or reduce this achievement); and judgment, by an audiophile of extreme experience and analytical "mercilessness" and a reviewer/guru of, until now, the Belt-Drive persuasion.

I'll here quote from one of Salvatore's earlier postings, to provide context from this exclusive, until now, user and reviewer of high-end belt-drives: "I have to admit that I still have a degree of scepticism about idler-drives. This unease is based on the history of turntable development and marketing. This is my problem: I don't understand why none of the contemporary turntable manufacturers are using this method, if it's truly superior to what they are now using. If there's a rational reason for this reluctance, I can't think of it."

This, evidently, was the problem many had from the beginning of my crusade to have the Idler taken seriously - via the cheaper and yet superb Lenco - by the general audiophile population, and removed from the fringe element existence, much as some would have preferred it - and the Lenco - remain a secret ;-).

I'll post a photo of said "Reference Lenco" under my "system" for those who wish to see it, you'll recognize the design, though under the hood, where it counts, I have made important changes. More details anon.

So, one more time for Old Time's sake (I HAVE been fighting this battle for more than 6 years now, good to finally see vindication - from Salvatore AND from Athens - of my claims for the Lenco, so please indulge me): Vive la Lenco, Vive la Idler Wheel!!!